when should I play ,when should I fold them?

L

luvspoker2

Enthusiast
Joined
Oct 7, 2007
Total posts
35
can you help me to understand--when I should play this type of hold cards-and why it would be good?....ans when it would be bad to follow through with this type of hold cards,and what stage of game?....... sorry for my lack of poker terminology/wording of my issue/problem,I am still new with poker,but very willing to learn/understand it.I can not learn on my own,been trying to and I am still clueless,I am willing to admit I am needing help/guidance. on this. I am tired of losing my positions,cash,tokies,jackpots,bubbling out,etc..... I want to learn,have aunderstanding of this.
below,i was in a tourney $3.30 buy in 10 players. 99% of the time my hold cards are:Ac/Kc or Kh/Qh or Jd/Kd suited, below it is Ac/4c~~it was the only hand that came closest to my issue/problem, to use as an example to show you.
please explain for freerolls-cash tourneys-ring games(I get these in all those type of games):why it would be good to play/chase this type of hold cards,and what stage of the game your in....and explain why it would be bad to play/chase through and what stage of game. feel free to use your own type of game-chip stacks,amount of players started,what stage your in-placing prizes.
I have been getting these type of hold cards a lot-several times in same game,in many stages of the game.I get these when: I am chip leader,or low stacked,with 1,000 players to 9 players,from 1st table to the last final table.
I am wanting to really learn/understand how to handle them,in all stages of the game,be it a freeroll,or a 10 player tourney,to a tourney with 2500 players and a $1,000.00 jackpot. I think there are others who need help with this as well,and can learn from your help/advice. please,explain in the easiest,simplest terms/wording ,examples of percentages/odds of it paying off to follow through.and when to follow through would be a bad percentage/odds against yourself.
all I ask is for others,who would like to help out,to please,NOT criticize other views on this,everyone has his/her own way of explaining/playing thier habits,and thoughts.
example posted below......


pokerStars Game #13349851678: Tournament #67728216, $3.00+$0.40 Hold'em No Limit - Level V (75/150) - 2007/11/19 - 23:15:35 (ET)
Table '67728216 1' 10-max Seat #9 is the button
Seat 2: agnóstico (2675 in chips)
Seat 3: chris0118 (945 in chips)
Seat 4: dokiel (1365 in chips)
Seat 5: WarChinchila (1680 in chips)
Seat 6: firegreen99 (950 in chips)
Seat 7: geop_55 (2075 in chips)
Seat 8: scottE78 (880 in chips)
Seat 9: platopoker (1685 in chips)
Seat 10: luvspoker2 (2745 in chips)
luvspoker2: posts small blind 75
agnóstico: posts big blind 150
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to luvspoker2 [4c Ac]
chris0118: raises 300 to 450
dokiel: folds
WarChinchila: folds
firegreen99: folds
geop_55: folds
scottE78: folds
platopoker: folds
luvspoker2: calls 375
agnóstico: calls 300
*** FLOP *** [8c 2c Ad]
luvspoker2: bets 450
agnóstico: raises 1775 to 2225 and is all-in
chris0118: folds
luvspoker2: calls 1775
*** TURN *** [8c 2c Ad] [9c]
chris0118 said, "qq"
*** RIVER *** [8c 2c Ad 9c] [Qs]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
luvspoker2: shows [4c Ac] (a flush, Ace high)
agnóstico: shows [8d 2d] (two pair, Eights and Deuces)
luvspoker2 collected 5800 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 5800 | Rake 0
Board [8c 2c Ad 9c Qs]
Seat 2: agnóstico (big blind) showed [8d 2d] and lost with two pair, Eights and Deuces
Seat 3: chris0118 folded on the Flop
Seat 4: dokiel folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: WarChinchila folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: firegreen99 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: geop_55 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: scottE78 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 9: platopoker (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 10: luvspoker2 (small blind) showed [4c Ac] and won (5800) with a flush, Ace high
 
W

William Martin

Enthusiast
Joined
Aug 5, 2007
Total posts
45
Reading between the lines, you are asking about playing suited aces-rag.

My advice / opinion is as follows:

Early in a tournament - try to limp in with no raises and hit a big hand.
Late in a tournament - throw them away, the blinds are too high for you to make this play .
If it's folded to you in late position in a tournament, you can raise with it, but it's a risky play for obvious reasons.

In low limit cash games, try to limp in and win a big pot.


You never want to play these hands to a raise. The chances of you flopping your flush or getting a flush draw and being given odds to chase it are small. It's never a good idea to get all of your chips in chasing a flush. "People who chase flushes go home in busses", lol.

Hope that helps.
 
L

luvspoker2

Enthusiast
Joined
Oct 7, 2007
Total posts
35
thank you for your advice,I now understand,what has been hard for me to learn/understand.mainly because you explained it in simple terms that I understood,and not big poker slang words/terms/mathmatics quotations, that floor my usually.Now,I understand how to play them and when. I hope other newbies, have learned from this question, and your advice on this,is clear cut to the point. I like that saying you used:"Peple who chase flushes go home on buses!"..... I never heard this phrase before:) thanks again for answering my question.good luck to you on the felt! No more 24/7flush chaser~ I'll turn in my bus ticket:):p ;)
 
bubbasbestbabe

bubbasbestbabe

Suckout Queen
Joined
May 22, 2005
Total posts
10,637
Awards
1
But people who chase flushes and catch them go home on the limo.

You have to know when to go after that flush. And you in that position did the right thing. Chasing flushes is best done with the A or K. You also could have caught a str8, and the A,(which you also did).
You were also the big stack at the table. It was only a min raise. You could have afforded to see the flop,(as you did).

The biggest thing is you have to decide is which way of playing you are most comfortable with. And really start to learn how to play that style. There are 3 basic styles. LAG, TAG, and PAG. Now this isn't to say that stick to the one style. A successful player mixes up all three. But they also overall stay true to one form. You need to figure out who you are. Once you do your play will improve.
 
E

ellisman7

Guest
Joined
Sep 20, 2007
Total posts
188
Reading between the lines, you are asking about playing suited aces-rag.

My advice / opinion is as follows:

Early in a tournament - try to limp in with no raises and hit a big hand.
Late in a tournament - throw them away, the blinds are too high for you to make this play .
If it's folded to you in late position in a tournament, you can raise with it, but it's a risky play for obvious reasons.

In low limit cash games, try to limp in and win a big pot.


You never want to play these hands to a raise. The chances of you flopping your flush or getting a flush draw and being given odds to chase it are small. It's never a good idea to get all of your chips in chasing a flush. "People who chase flushes go home in busses", lol.

Hope that helps.

lol where did u come up with that phrase??? yes, ace rag shouldnt be played till late in a tourney.
 
L

luvspoker2

Enthusiast
Joined
Oct 7, 2007
Total posts
35
thank you all for sharing your thoughts/advice and helping me to better understand how to play these.they are my personal nightmare hands,that gets my butt every time.now I have a good understanding of this,and they will no longer send me home on the buses! thanks for your time as well :) i am sorry it took me so long to reply back.been a crazy t-day week!.happy thanksgiving to you all and best of luck!

p.s.-I do love that saying that w.martin as well, it's snappy...."people who chase flushes go home on the buses!"
 
E

ellisman7

Guest
Joined
Sep 20, 2007
Total posts
188
i very rarely play ace rag unless its a freeroll or its late in a tourney, or to steal blinds(which i do once in a while :cool: )
 
Dorkus Malorkus

Dorkus Malorkus

HELLO INTERNET
Joined
Jul 12, 2005
Total posts
12,422
I won't make any general comments, I'm just looking at the hand you posted.

Fold preflop! Your line on the flop is fine given your preflop action, but preflop someone has raised 3*BB for half of their stack under the gun. There are few moves in poker which signify strength more than this (hands like ~KQ/~33 are more likely to just shove) - your A4s is absolutely crushed by villain's range here, and it's not like villain has a lot of chips for you to win anyway should you manage to flop something huge and stack him.

Okay, I lied, I'll make some really general comments. When wondering whether you should be playing hands like AXs, you should consider

- How cheap it is to get into the pot, in terms of your stack size. The cheaper it is, the more inclined you should be to play.
- Whether anyone has yet shown significant strength. The more strength shown, the less inclined you should be to play.
- Your position. The earlier your position, the less inclined you should be to play.
- How much you stand to win should you flop a huge hand/draw. This ties in with the cheapness point somewhat - the cheaper it is to get in and more you stand to win compared with how much you'd have to put in to play, the more inclined you should be to play.
- The aggressiveness of the players left to act. The more aggressive, the less you should be inclined to play because you don't want to be facing a (re)raise with AXs.
- The tournament situation. At 100/200 blinds with a 1.5k stack if folded to on the button we are obliged to be shoving with A4s, but at 5/10 blinds with the same stack folding is reasonable with the same cards in the same situation.
 
Last edited:
W

WhatItDew

Guest
Joined
Nov 23, 2007
Total posts
27
In all honesty, I like this hand because it gives you a lot of versatility without having to make tough decisions post flop.
The only time that you should play this hand is from late position with a lot of limpers in the pot, and you can enter the unraised pot.
The reason for making this play is that you are strictly trying to hit one of your draws with this hand, not make money off of a pair if it comes (although you can try to get paid off if two 4's flop, and you have a set with top kicker).
The thing I like about this hand is that it is an easy fold if you have to enter a raised pot. And if you don't flop anything toward one of your draws, it's an easy fold to a raise post flop. There it gets you in trouble is how you play it if you hit 2 to a flush on the flop. I think it is appropriate to call a small bet on the flop, with the hopes of hitting your money card on the turn. If you don't get your money card by the turn you need to give up the hand, and do it at a cheap price. If you happen to hit your hand, let them keep betting the hand for you, and reraise the river once it gets to that point.
 
L

luvspoker2

Enthusiast
Joined
Oct 7, 2007
Total posts
35
thank you for your time/advice/help :) I see there is much to consider on this hand play.I have understood much about this now,thank you all for your help on this. I'm sure others have learned from all this as well. I didn't understand just how much more was involved. i saw it only as hand,I didn't take in consideration,what place-chip stacks-how many left-etc..... good luck to you all !
 
Folding in Poker
Top