Omaha nut low, nut flush draw

Alon Ipser

Alon Ipser

Cardschat Elite
PokerStars Game #6326604663: Omaha Hi/Lo Pot Limit ($0.10/$0.25) - 2006/09/17 - 23:58:19 (ET)
Table 'Aludra III' 9-max Seat #6 is the button
Seat 1: godzilla51 ($6.70 in chips)
Seat 2: stikum ($24.75 in chips)
Seat 3: FLOGGER-1- ($7.35 in chips)
Seat 4: Biggle10 ($27.75 in chips)
Seat 5: xxxxjcxxxx ($24.45 in chips)
Seat 6: z whiz ($15.35 in chips)
Seat 7: Alon Ipser ($16.45 in chips)
Seat 8: Sunnydale ($4.75 in chips)
Seat 9: Sam I Am II ($35.45 in chips)
Alon Ipser: posts small blind $0.10
Sunnydale: posts big blind $0.25
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Alon Ipser [Ks 9h 2d Ah]
Sam I Am II: folds
godzilla51: folds
stikum: folds
FLOGGER-1-: calls $0.25
Biggle10: folds
xxxxjcxxxx: calls $0.25
z whiz: calls $0.25
Alon Ipser: calls $0.15
Sunnydale: checks
*** FLOP *** [4s 6h 3h]
Alon Ipser: bets $0.25
Sunnydale: calls $0.25
FLOGGER-1-: folds
xxxxjcxxxx: folds
z whiz: raises $0.25 to $0.50
Alon Ipser: ???? I have the nut low and the nut flush draw. Should I pot in this situation? Should I have potted 1st bet after the flop?
 
DESSERTLADY

DESSERTLADY

Legend
Alon,

I'm not an Omaha h/l expert by no means, but I think that your .25 bet on the flop was a little weak. I would have bet half the pot right there.

I would just smooth call this raiser, till the turn came. Myself I don't jam the pot early on unless I am really trying to get everyone else out of the hand. With the turn and the river to come I try to decrease any possible losses incase I get counterfeited. You don't want to split this pot you want to scoop it.

At this point you have no idea what villian has whether it be another A2, a set of 4s or even a 56 of hearts.
Granted you have the nut low, and the nut flush draw. This is just me though, I would wait till I saw the turn till I started Jamming the pot.
 
gord962

gord962

Legend
I would bet about 1/2 the pot to try to keep as many people in the pot as possible. You don't want to knock people out of the pot here as there is a VERY good chance you will win the hig and low pot, so suck as much out from as many people as you can.
 
t1riel

t1riel

Legend
He got the nut low and possibly the high so you want as much money in the pot as possible. Now that one player raised, you need to reraise. The raiser will either reraise or call because either he's bluffing (which is unlikely) or he has something good.
 
JAMILE1

JAMILE1

Cardschat Elite
I think I'd just call and see the turn first, granted u have the nut low but maybe someone else does to? which I think is highly likely, on that board your only worry would be that someone holding A25? or even A257? and has low and high made already? yes you have a flush draw but see that turn for cheap and go from there. Just betting the low in a multi way hand can be damaging to your stack!!!
 
katymaty

katymaty

Legend
only danger is when it gets 2 two players and u dont hit your flush draw.

could tie the low but lose the high (get quartered)

also if an Ace or 2 appears on turn or river alot more people will have the nut low
 
Alon Ipser

Alon Ipser

Cardschat Elite
Is there a formula for figuring pot odds here? If I miss the high and tie the low I only get 1/4 of the pot, miss the high and take low by myself I get 1/2 the pot. Hit the high and split the low is 3/4 of the pot and of course the scoop for the whole thing. To complicate it more, it could to be a 2 handed pot or 3.

I forgot that I can loose the whole thing too if an ace or 2 comes on the turn or river.
 
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Bombjack

Bombjack

Legend
I'm not much good at PLO8 but isn't the idea that you pot it with a strong Lo and a draw to the nut high, so you "scoop" whether you hit or not?
 
Lo-Dog

Lo-Dog

Cardschat Elite
I would put out a decent raise here with two others still in it. Best line I have heard about O8 is this: Go for the low, back into the high. So you have the low now try and sweeten the pot and hope to scoop.
 
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Lo-Dog

Lo-Dog

Cardschat Elite
If an A or 2 falls anyone with a 5 (and A through 4) has him beat for the low.


I never said that, its not in my post, I wouldnt say anything that stupid, stop trying to frame me god dammit! AAACKAACKARRAKAACK!!!!
 
Alon Ipser

Alon Ipser

Cardschat Elite
PokerStars Game #6326604663: Omaha Hi/Lo Pot Limit ($0.10/$0.25) - 2006/09/17 - 23:58:19 (ET)
Table 'Aludra III' 9-max Seat #6 is the button
Seat 1: godzilla51 ($6.70 in chips)
Seat 2: stikum ($24.75 in chips)
Seat 3: FLOGGER-1- ($7.35 in chips)
Seat 4: Biggle10 ($27.75 in chips)
Seat 5: xxxxjcxxxx ($24.45 in chips)
Seat 6: z whiz ($15.35 in chips)
Seat 7: Alon Ipser ($16.45 in chips)
Seat 8: Sunnydale ($4.75 in chips)
Seat 9: Sam I Am II ($35.45 in chips)
Alon Ipser: posts small blind $0.10
Sunnydale: posts big blind $0.25
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Alon Ipser [Ks 9h 2d Ah]
Sam I Am II: folds
godzilla51: folds
stikum: folds
FLOGGER-1-: calls $0.25
Biggle10: folds
xxxxjcxxxx: calls $0.25
z whiz: calls $0.25
Alon Ipser: calls $0.15
Sunnydale: checks
*** FLOP *** [4s 6h 3h]
Alon Ipser: bets $0.25
Sunnydale: calls $0.25
FLOGGER-1-: folds
xxxxjcxxxx: folds
z whiz: raises $0.25 to $0.50
Alon Ipser: raises $2.45 to $2.95
Sunnydale: calls $2.70
z whiz: raises $10.05 to $13
Alon Ipser: raises $3.20 to $16.20 and is all-in
Sunnydale: calls $1.55 and is all-in
z whiz: calls $2.10 and is all-in
*** TURN *** [4s 6h 3h] [Jd]
*** RIVER *** [4s 6h 3h Jd] [6c]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Alon Ipser: shows [Ks 9h 2d Ah] (HI: a pair of Sixes; LO: 6,4,3,2,A)
z whiz: shows [5s 8s 2c As] (HI: a straight, Deuce to Six; LO: 6,4,3,2,A)
z whiz collected $10.10 from side pot
Alon Ipser collected $5.05 from side pot
z whiz collected $5 from side pot
Sunnydale: shows [7d 6s 6d 7h] (HI: four of a kind, Sixes)
Sunnydale collected $7.05 from main pot
Alon Ipser collected $3.50 from main pot
z whiz collected $3.50 from main pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $35.95 Main pot $14.05. Side pot $20.15. | Rake $1.75
Board [4s 6h 3h Jd 6c]
Seat 1: godzilla51 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 2: stikum folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: FLOGGER-1- folded on the Flop
Seat 4: Biggle10 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: xxxxjcxxxx folded on the Flop
Seat 6: z whiz (button) showed [5s 8s 2c As] and won ($18.60) with HI: a straight, Deuce to Six; LO: 6,4,3,2,A
Seat 7: Alon Ipser (small blind) showed [Ks 9h 2d Ah] and won ($8.55) with HI: a pair of Sixes; LO: 6,4,3,2,A
Seat 8: Sunnydale (big blind) showed [7d 6s 6d 7h] and won ($7.05) with HI: four of a kind, Sixes
Seat 9: Sam I Am II folded before Flop (didn't bet)
 
Bombjack

Bombjack

Legend
His hand was quite a bit better than yours because he had the remaining wheel card (5) in case the A or 2 were counterfeited, as well as the made 6-high straight. Apart from not having the flush draw, he had the nuts on this flop. But your opponent won't always have the nuts, and you probably have marginally enough equity to call when he re-pops it even if you know what he has. But you know the rest of your chips are going in at this point, so you have to take this into account when working out your pot odds.

If you assume he has A2 as well, there are only 4 outs to counterfeit your low, i.e. you're 83% to split low. You're only going to win high if you hit your flush (36%) so you total equity is about 0.5*83%/2 (low) + 0.5*36% (high) = 39% equity. Seeing as you only need 33% to call all-in in pot-limit, the call doesn't look too bad. (It's actually a bit more complicated because of the third player but... well, use one of those online calculators if you want to know exact numbers.)
 
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