25nl 6max - 3bet vs TAG

Munchrs

Munchrs

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Stats: Villian is 19/8 and im at 21/16. Villain was folding alot to 3-bets and wasnt to strong postflop. I put him either on a wa/wb type hand(JJ,QQ) or AK.

How would you play this hand post flop? What is the best line to take here after we have hit our ace?

Stacks:
* BB with $25.10
* UTG with $19.65
* MP with $31.15
* CO with $25.00
* BTN with $21.00
* SB with $32.15
hand.pl

Blinds: $0.10/$0.25
Site: pokerstars
* * Dealt to MP:A♠ Q♠
Preflop:
* * UTG raises $0.75 to $1
* * Hero raises $2 to $3
* * 4 players fold.
* * UTG calls [$2]
* * Total folds this street: 4
* * Potsize: $6.35
Flop:
* * 6♣ 9♦ A♣
* * UTG: checks
* * Hero: ?
* * Potsize: $6.35
Turn:
* * 10♦
* * UTG: checks
* * Hero: ?
* * Potsize: $6.35
River:
* * 2♥
* * UTG: checks
* * Hero ?


Poker Hand Converter By Cardschat.com Poker Forum
 
ChuckTs

ChuckTs

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I don't like 3-betting AQs here. Usually guys that tight are basically folding everything worse, and calling/4-betting everything better. There just isn't any reason to 3bet. Call and take a flop.

As played, postflop we have to play pot control. It's not a hand we want to stack with since AK will still be in his range, and AJ will generally not be. I probably look to bet turn and/or riv after checking flop hoping to valuetown JJ-KK or the very rare AJ.
 
F Paulsson

F Paulsson

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I agree that its not a good spot to 3-bet AQs, but I also know deep down that I probably do it every time.

Basically, I'm just posting to agree with Chuck. Checking back (when did we stop saying "checking behind?") the flop is probably the best play, unless he's super reliable AND doesn't know how to fold JJ on an ace-high board. After he checks the turn, you can go ahead and bet/fold. If called, it's really a matter of trying to decide if he'd see a showdown TT-KK after you bet the turn. I probably don't bet again since most hands that call me, beat me (AK) and most the ones that don't beat me, I chop with.

Don't get me wrong, though. I think a lot of weaker hands will call your turn bet, but may plan to fold if you bet again on the river. Your line may look so weak that they decide to test you by taking one off and see what you do on the river. The weaker hands just won't call a river bet, so betting the river may be moot.
 
B

bw07507

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I pretty much 3bet AQ every time unless its vs a super nit but I kind of agree with Chuck here that this type of player will fold his worse hands and call/4bet his better ones. I think flatting this UTG + 1 leaves u open to a squeeze though. If Im on the button and see a raise UTG and a flat UTG + 1 from relatively solid/tight players I will squeeze it with almost anything realizing that UTG + 1 is almost never strong enough to call the 3bet and UTG is afraid of what UTG + 1 will do if he calls.

As for the line, I check behind flop here, bet turn when he checks to me, and check river if he calls my turn bet.
 
ChuckTs

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Most players aren't anywhere close to good enough to recognize a good squeezing spot at 25nl...
 
F Paulsson

F Paulsson

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"Opening yourself up to a squeeze" is a good point, and something that definitely has to be considered. I've thought about that some lately. The same concern goes for overcalling with a hand like small and medium pocket pairs, which is a fairly common play. Then someone squeezes on the button, and you're up shit creek because your implied odds just went out the window and you're out of position with a hand that's either way behind or barely ahead.

So I started thinking about balancing it, and decided that against a person who squeezes with a wide range, I will four-bet fairly liberally. Also, and we talked about this in some other thread, one of the sexiest moves there is in preflop poker is smooth calling in early position with AA/KK.

Well, it's sexy when it works.
 
Munchrs

Munchrs

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BW I never actually considered anyone would squeeze as most players just play there cards at this limit.

so most of you said check behind and bet the turn. It is along the same lines as what I thought at the table. He would call with hands that beat me and fold all else(thought of this after I saw the flop) so checking behind for pot control was my best play on the flop, which i did.

Heres what im trying to get at, why is everyone betting the turn and checking behind on the river if he calls? Would he not be more likely to call a river value bet if we check the turn also and make a supposed 'crying bet' at what looks like an orphaned pot?
 
F Paulsson

F Paulsson

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Heres what im trying to get at, why is everyone betting the turn and checking behind on the river if he calls? Would he not be more likely to call a river value bet if we check the turn also and make a supposed 'crying bet' at what looks like an orphaned pot?
We bet the turn in part for protection. That aspect isn't there on the river.

It takes a stronger hand to call both the turn and the river than it takes to call just one of them. So if we want to maximize value vs. a hand range that will call one street, then betting the turn is often better, because some of his range contains draws. There's no value in betting the river when he has a (missed) draw.
 
Munchrs

Munchrs

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We bet the turn in part for protection. That aspect isn't there on the river.

It takes a stronger hand to call both the turn and the river than it takes to call just one of them. So if we want to maximize value vs. a hand range that will call one street, then betting the turn is often better, because some of his range contains draws. There's no value in betting the river when he has a (missed) draw.

makes sense. Thanks for explaining that. :D
 
SavagePenguin

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...one of the sexiest moves there is in preflop poker is smooth calling in early position with AA/KK.

Well, it's sexy when it works.

Ha ha. Checking those is a wa/wb move with your ego. You either feel like a king, or you get that sick feeling in the pit of your stomach when your chips get shifted after you let him hit something.

I occasionally do that in tournaments, but hardly ever in rings.
 
KerouacsDog

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dumb question, can someone explain the meaning of the term 3bet? is it like betting every card, ie flop/turn/river, or is it something else?
 
c9h13no3

c9h13no3

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dumb question, can someone explain the meaning of the term 3bet? is it like betting every card, ie flop/turn/river, or is it something else?
The first bet preflop is the big blind (hence why you just call it). The second bet is the first raise that anyone makes preflop. 3-betting is to re-raise that first raise. And for example, if UTG came over the top of Munchrs, that'd be a 4-bet.
 
KerouacsDog

KerouacsDog

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The first bet preflop is the big blind (hence why you just call it). The second bet is the first raise that anyone makes preflop. 3-betting is to re-raise that first raise. And for example, if UTG came over the top of Munchrs, that'd be a 4-bet.
ah, i get it now, thanks very much, sir!
so it does it only apply to pre-flop, or can you 3bet any street? And basically it's just another name for a reraise?
 
c9h13no3

c9h13no3

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ah, i get it now, thanks very much, sir!
so it does it only apply to pre-flop, or can you 3bet any street? And basically it's just another name for a reraise?
Applies to any street.
 
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