This is a discussion on Overbetting the Turn[or any other street] within the online poker forums, in the Cash Games section; Recently, I've been watching a lot of Doug Polk's live streams and noticed that he often over bets the turn. Personally, I don't understand why
Recently, I've been watching a lot of Doug Polk's live streams and noticed that he often over bets the turn. Personally, I don't understand why this works as it polarizes your range and if your opponent calls, they will probably have a nut hand. Is over betting good? how?
Similar Threads for: Overbetting the Turn[or any other street]
It is not necessary good, but given that there are some really weird people out there at the tables it notice that I would call with a hand like QK on a flop with 9 8 K 7 very much more when the opponent calls more. It seems like it is a bluff (because he overbets it).
It depands on the opponent if he will think that way or he won't.
I can't tell you what your opponent will do, but I am sure that if you have a good reason (given above) for the things you do and you can explain it. There are no bad actions you can make in poker.
13th July 2016, 9:49 PM
Poker at: ACR
From the guys I have seen do this on Twitch I think they do it when villain has a capped range and it is really hard to call a turn overbet. Especially with how balanced these guys are because they overbet the turn with TPTK+ or air.
I've tried it on Bovada Zone a few times and they snap call me with 22 when I am bluffing and snap fold when I do it for value. Small sample but so far not so good. haha
14th July 2016, 4:55 AM
Game: NL HE
I try to save overbetting for calling stations for value. Everyone I see overbet at micros has the nuts.
14th July 2016, 8:02 AM
re: Poker & Overbetting the Turn[or any other street]
Overbetting a limped pot where the absolute $ is low and where people will call with draws/TP when you have a set IP is good. So is overbetting river when you river a very disguised straight or hand, and you look FOS (x back turn, FD misses on river). Overbet shoving & x/jamming river with nuts vs strong range is one of the best plays. Like rivering nut straight with AQ on a J10x9K board, or top FH/quads vs likely lower fullhouse. Most opponents get very confused by overbets and pay off too often, and most are unable to fold a straight. Don't really recommend overbetting as a bluff at most stakes.
15th July 2016, 7:30 PM
Online Poker at: Pokerstars
In micro stakes it can be profitable because there are a lot of fishy players.
19th July 2016, 9:27 PM
Just like anything in poker, it's good if you do it in a balanced way.
If you balance bluff over bets with value overbets, it can put your opponent in a very difficult spot and allow you to get way more money out of a hand if you'd been using more conventional bet sizing.
19th July 2016, 11:18 PM
Online Poker at: ACR
I thought of this thread today when playing a hand. Some background, the BigBlind has a history of making large over-bets pre-flop and post-flop. He's done this too often for it all to have been for value. For that reason I suspect that he's likely to see over-bets as "bluffy" and weak.
I limp the SB pre-flop, when it's probably a raise against most other players, because the BB is very likely to 3-bet large and I'll be unable to call. I expect my limp to be raised, but I can likely call most of his raises. He doesn't raise, which is unexpected, but a cheap flop with a small pair is always nice.
*** FLOP *** Pot ($0.20) Hero Bet $0.40
BigBlind Calls $0.40
Well, this is a good flop, but we're very deep. The SPR is over 38. It is very unlikely that I can get stacks in with normal pot sized bets. So, let's plan for 2x-Pot, 2x-Pot, ~Pot and see how we do. I think we'll get called down with any Ace. He's also really aggressive and might try and take the pot away, but I don't expect that because he usually is the aggressor and I haven't seen him play when someone else is leading.
*** TURN *** Pot ($1.00) Hero Bet $2.00
BigBlind Raises $6.00
Hero went All In $7.24 BigBlind Folds
I expected to get called here by most A-x hands, and be able to shove $5.24 into the $5 pot on the river. But, the BB clearly read this as a bluff and put in the third bet for me. I stick the rest of the money in and the BB quickly folds.
*** END OF FOLDED GAME ***
Hero won $12.28 from Pot 1
Hero had $1.24 returned from uncalled Pot 2
Over-bet for value, for sure, in these games. I might have been able to make $2.60 with normal pot-sized bets, maybe even less because he might have folded to normal bets. Instead, I get $6.50 when he gets confused and spazzes out. In retrospect, I might have got the last little bit of money by calling the turn raise and giving him one more shot to bluff.
20th July 2016, 12:28 AM
Poker at: Bovada
Is Polk a heads up specialist? If so that means he likely has a more aggressive style than one might utilize in a 6 max or FR setting. I'm not sure if you're referring to a heads up match (not when it's heads up in a 6 or FR game, but literally 1 on 1 every day) or not.
In any event I see a lot of people overbetting the turn. I notice it a lot more live which is interesting. Some players I've asked say they follow a "make em pay for their draws" mantra so are happy to overbet the turn to get a reckless loose player to chase draws and miss most of the time. A few might say they do it to get better hands to fold or draws from thinking players to fold but that can usually be done with a smaller bet anyways. So basically I think some people overbet the turn to make chasers pay dearly. If you think about it, usually a 3/4 to pot size bet does give poor odds to chase most draws but it's still like 2:1 which many loose players and rec players happily chase. If you can get a player to call their gutshot with 2:1 odds why not see if you can get them chasing 1:1 or worse!
Another reason to perhaps overbet a pot on the turn is if it's a multiway and there's a lot of draws out there. If you're holding top set on a flush and straight heavy draw board and you have 3 players in it with you and simply bet like 3/4 the pot you risk having them all call you and if anyone has a strong draw they suddenly get better odds. Consider if you have a $40 pot and you bet $30 into it and 2 others call, so now the pot is $130, the 3rd player might be on a nut flush draw and suddenly has 4:1 odds. Make that turn bet $70, the pot is now $110, and one player folds, one calls, the last guy now only has like 2.5:1 to call.
My numbers might be a little off but in general overbetting the turn gets fish to pay dearly for draws, and to weed out limpers in multi way draw heavy pots.
They don't always have the nuts either when they're the ones shoving the turn , I've called down people before who spew shove the turn on draws or spew shove with 2P on a paired board and lose to a set, turned straight, or better.
If you have the nuts you want value. You really have to know your villain to know if a value over bet is needed. If the villain thinks they have the best hand (like 2nd nuts to you) they may insta call. If they think you're a bluff machine they may see you as stealing and call with worse.
20th July 2016, 7:00 PM
Online Poker at: PokerStars
re: Poker & Overbetting the Turn[or any other street]
it seems like a bluff. However you can use it to you favor, showing something different you want inicially.