Can you be profitable with pokerstars spin & go?

[mr.fers_one]

It's probably possible... surely someone is succeeding... but it seems to me that at best this is a near-zero game... in spin and go, more depends on doubling than in a simple SnG

 

[bablovod]

this is my favorite format. I'll say this, I'm a profitable spin player, even if only a little bit. I won big jackpots of $60 $25 several times, and this is for $0.25. I used to publish all this in my old topic. there were ups and downs, the variance was crazy, the sherfish maniacs seemed to be frostbitten morons, I often thought RNG was working against me, but when you win, such thoughts are erased, although not for long: LOL:. I managed to withdraw funds from several rooms. so I can say I've had a small spin +.
However, now I'm interested in CIS 6 double or suck it off, and the $0.2 satellite for 3X$1 is usually played by 9 to 16 people and about 30% I have a $1 ticket :tricky:

 

[Balou1982]

in my opinion you can make a little bit out of it but i wouldn´t say it is a profitable game because in 100 cases of spin&go you got a multiplicator 2-3x buy in - example each of 3 players have a 0,50§ buy in and then the pot is often 1$ i mean thats a joke.

 

[ms_attack]

difficult to achieve I guess.. I was on 40 % some weeks ago I usually play only the free tickets at GG, but when you have a bad run, it is hard to get back in that range..

do you?

View attachment 356325

With 37% you are one of the top players at Spin and Gold. Take a look at the leaderboard of the top 100 players, there is only one player with 40% and a few others with 38%, the rest are all between 33-37%.

You are profitable if your win rate is above 36% due to your skill.

 

[Gallarado777]

I always say the same thing if you are good at any game, you will achieve results in the long run, the main thing is to be able to play poker and let it all be spin go if you play very hard there you will be able to make money in the long run

 

[Omaha_53]

The answer to your question is a simple "yes".
The worst rake level for spin-n-gos on pokerstars is 8%. That is significantly lower than the worst MTT rake level (12%), and comparable to most low-stakes cash game rake. If you can beat 12% in MTTs, you can obviously beat 8% in spin-n-gos.

It would take a ridiculously unfavorable long-term dry spell to make a loser out of an otherwise-winning player.
And that is all assuming that you never apply any kind of buy-in strategy that helps decrease the break-even win percentage.

 

[fundiver199]

If you can beat 12% in MTTs, you can obviously beat 8% in spin-n-gos.

Its not that simple. In spin-n-gos you get 25BB to begin with, and blinds go up every 3 minutes (hyperturbo). This mean, that on average you only have few hands to find skill edge, and you are also playing with a stort stack, which tend to negate skill edges quite a bit. After all if the only decision is to push or fold preflop with 9BB effective, there is a limit to, how wrong people can get it after just a minimum of study.

In MTTs on the other hand you get at least 100BB to begin with, and in regular speed games blinds only go up every 10 minutes. So per hand you actually pay way less rake in MTTs, and you play with deeper stacks. Both of which is far more important than the amount of rake per game. You can also calculate the rake per hour, and because spin n gos are so fast, they are literally an ATM for poker sites. Which is why, they like them so much

 

[TeUnit]

The big winners have low single digit ROIs, they make most of their money on rakeback and incentives.

 

[pansipos]

could be , if you win them )

Me too

 

[Suns of Beaches]

Hi
Of course not
These tournaments are bingo, who will be luckier and take the money. Today you, tomorrow your opponents. These are not the tournaments you can rely on as a source of constant and stable profit.

Not true.

Many players already showed in different forums/threads that being profitable in the long run with spins is certainly possible. U need a mindset of steel and u need to be willing to play large samplesizes.

Only because u cant does not mean others cant too 😀

 

[pentazepam]

Not true.

Many players already showed in different forums/threads that being profitable in the long run with spins is certainly possible. U need a mindset of steel and u need to be willing to play large samplesizes.

Only because u cant does not mean others cant too 😀

It's possible for sure - but the ROI is like 3% for a good player and the variance is sickening.

And you have to be a "special kind of person" to sit and mostly push-fold for long sessions.

 

[fundiver199]

It's possible for sure - but the ROI is like 3% for a good player and the variance is sickening.

Exactly. Around 3% is, what the players topping the leaderboard on ACR achieve playing 6-man hyperturbos, which is a very similar format to spin n gos just without the lottery element and with 6 players rather than 3. And as I said earlier, there is probably a reason, why they have all chosen to play those games rather than the spin n gos, which ACR also have. Maybe they want to avoid the lottery element. Or maybe people make significant ICM-mistakes in 6-mans, whereas spin n gos are winner takes all and therefore without ICM considerations.

Returning to the subject of MTT rake vs. spin n go rake this is another reason, why a much higher ROI is possible in MTTs. An MTT is a complex game, where for instance the final table require understanding of ICM and different strategies for a short, medium or large stack. Plus some people are not able to concentrate well for 5 or more hours. And then they end up donking away their stack, when its down to 4, 3 or 2 players, and the payjumps are the largest.

A spin n go on the other hand is always either 3-handed or heads-up, you simply play for chips, and its over in a few minutes. So its a simple game, which it is easy to become at least reasonably good at with a minimum of study and practice. The point here being, that we win in poker, when our opponents make mistakes (and we avoid them), and therefore complex games are easier to beat than simple games.

 

[mr.fers_one]

in poker, you can earn anywhere, cash, mtt, spin... discipline is important everywhere))

 

[dreamer13]

The probabilities for realists do not show the most rosy picture: poker players play almost 89 percent of all spins with a maximum x3 multiplier. Seeing a prize pool that is 10 times the buy-in amount is very rare.Play, maybe you'll get lucky.

 

[Comboss599]

Of course but there is a catch. You must be lucky with cashpricze you can win and of course you must win it.

 

[Omaha_53]

Its not that simple. In spin-n-gos you get 25BB to begin with, and blinds go up every 3 minutes (hyperturbo). This mean, that on average you only have few hands to find skill edge, and you are also playing with a stort stack, which tend to negate skill edges quite a bit. After all if the only decision is to push or fold preflop with 9BB effective, there is a limit to, how wrong people can get it after just a minimum of study.

In MTTs on the other hand you get at least 100BB to begin with, and in regular speed games blinds only go up every 10 minutes. So per hand you actually pay way less rake in MTTs, and you play with deeper stacks. Both of which is far more important than the amount of rake per game. You can also calculate the rake per hour, and because spin n gos are so fast, they are literally an ATM for poker sites. Which is why, they like them so much

Barring odd exceptions like "flip" MTT formats, it is exactly that simple.

You've made a series of incorrect assumptions here:
--- "In spin-n-gos you get 25BB to begin with, and blinds go up every 3 minutes"
That's only the structure of a regular speed spin on Stars. In flash spins, the starting stack is 15 BBs, and blinds are 1 minute in length. In Omaha spins, the starting stack is 50 BBs, and the blinds are 3 minutes in length. But none of that really matters...all that matters is that you have free will to make decisions.
--- "After all if the only decision is to push or fold preflop"
That is not the full range of options. You've imposed your own approach as an absolute input, which it is not.
--- "In MTTs on the other hand you get at least 100BB to begin with"
No, not necessarily. But more importantly...late registration exists. Most online MTTs these days allow late registration up until the starting stack becomes <10 BBs. The majority of registrations take place after the start of a tournament.
--- "So per hand you actually pay way less rake in MTTs"
Rake in MTTs is measured per buy-in, not per hand. The number of hands played - or the total elapsed time - has zero impact on the amount of rake paid, and vice versa. Number of hands played is not a factor which determines profitability in either spins or MTTs.
--- "and you play with deeper stacks"
There are many MTT formats which play is shorter-stacked than a regular-speed spin.
--- "Both of which is far more important than the amount of rake per game."
Again, imposing your own approach as an absolute input.

Try taking yourself away from your own experience, and viewing the situation from an objective standpoint. It will become more clear.
You'll find that the rake % is the dominant variable for all games in which players have decision-making rights. (i.e.: non-flip format)

NOTE:
My statement was made under the assumption that a player is:
a) playing the same buy-in level across an infinite sample
b) not collecting anything from rakeback programs

Using staggered buy-ins, a player can be still be profitable in an infinite sample despite having wayyyyy lower than the ~42% win rate normally required to be profitable in the former. I'm sure someone who actually enjoys spins (not me) could do better, but I've personally produced significant samples where 23% win rate was profitable using a staggered buy-in approach.

I have a few Excel sheets I can share if you need more help with this concept.

 

[Lena M]

Can you be profitable in the long term?

No, I didn't manage to get good results. I played in these tournaments for a while, for a few weeks, but at best my result was close to zero.

 

[Cooking]

Yes, you can, but in my opinion it's more difficult than be profitable in mtt's or cash games because spin&go involve more luck than the other games.

 

[Poker Orifice]

I have a friend who played SPINS for a living while Supernova Elite program was still happening on Stars. He profited between $200k - $250k for 3 years.
Today I have no clue but my guess is, it's not enough to live off of (unless you're in a 3rd world country perhaps).

 

[iceheart888]

if you get a large volume you can be profitable