Using the Clock to increase Profit

J

jecolgan

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I was in a tourny the other day,,16 of 24 left,,12-18 get 3 tournament dollars,,im at 2and change at 16th...so..since the change is relatively worthless,,i used up my entire clock each and every hand to get to the 18th spot and my 3dollars..most of the time i knew i was gonna fold,,,had to lay down some hands that hurt to let go of,,but once i hit the 18 mark,,I played poker,,all in with decent hands and went out at 14th,,some called me rude names and said i was being an ass,,i totally dissagree with that..first Its my Clock and I'll use it as i dmn well see fit...2nd..i wanted that 3rd dollar,,thats a whole other MTT:) anyhoo,,just some poker thoughts for tonight,,,cya on da felt,,still learning my way around this site,,gonna take a bit..
 
dcor

dcor

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this is a great strategy if you are shortstacked or the bigstack.....not hand for hand though haha...
 
C

Crudelis

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I find this tactic acceptable sometimes but some people don't use common sense when doing this. For example: The tourney has been running for 2 mins and you are already using the stalling tactic, at this stage everyone is about equal in chips and nobody is remotely close to the money, stalling at this point in the tourney won't be helping you in fact it will be working against you. Allow me to explain, in Full Tilt's freerolls the blinds go up every 5 minutes, you need to make the best of that 5 mins not stall because doing so means there will be LESS hands in that 5 mins resulting in you having LESS of a chance to get a good hand.

Now near the bubble in can be seen as a good and bad thing for both short stacks and big stacks alike. If you are short stacked and near the money then it might help depending on your M. If it is at 5 or less then its not helping you because the next time the blinds go up your M is going to drop to about 3 meaning you are forced to go allin. However sometime it CAN help you get to the money (you will be in a bad spot in chip size though.) Now if you are a big stack this is a wonderful idea, it causes there to be less hands before the blinds go up so less likely for the medium size stacks to double up which would give you a run for your money later on.
 
8Michael3

8Michael3

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Do whatever it takes (ethics please) to squeeze an edge out of this game.
 
the lab man

the lab man

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IMO, my cards, my chips/money, my chair, my clock ... I'll use any/all of them as I see fit to play my hands.


Absoulutely Agree, If I am on the bubble of tourney or especially a satellite like the OP I will Stall as long as I can to make the bubble.

Obviously I am desperate for chips(M level desperate) and it is more important for me at this point just to cash.

I am NOT going in here with any 2 cards and I do have the other 2 or 3 windows open to see where my fellow similar Bubbleers are.
 
Maid Marian

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I agree...a fellow CC'er told me about this to burst through the bubble...I will try it next time I'm close to that and also to increase my money won AFTER I'm already ITM! You're given the time so why not use it?:D
 
Surf Rat

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IMO, my cards, my chips/money, my chair, my clock ... I'll use any/all of them as I see fit to play my hands.[/quote]


absolutely use it all as part of your game... long clock decision when strong to appear weak to induce calls,quick call or raise/re-raise to seem stronger than you are etc. or as been said to slow play down near the bubble to squeek ITM or protect your stack against lesser ones for the run to final table.
It may piss off some and they will bitch at you but it may even put them on " :mad: " tilt (which is good also) but if its not against the rules of the game then "all's fair in love,war 'n poker" :D
 
T

The_Pup

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I took a look at the previous thread flagged by Nevadanick and there were plenty of people who saw the tactic as unethical/annoying/unsporting and so on. There was also some OT nonsense talked there.

I think there is an etiquette issue here - if someone is pissed off by it then it is probably poor etiquette. That said, I do it myself all the time. As others have said, you use the time you have as a resource to get the prize. To me it is no different from using your clock to make it look like you have a tough decision when you have the nuts, or folding quickly to get the rising blinds through, or slowing up so the blinds are big on your button etc etc.

Using the clock on the bubble can backfire - when you really need that time later on in the tourney and it isn't there.
 
TPC

TPC

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It's a weak ass strategy used by players that have no game. You should be using the bubble time to build your stack at a time most of the other players are tight. If you are playing a tourney then why play it to just get the first pay out? Also the bubble is usually hand for hand. Which makes it even more stupid when people run the clock.
 
T

The_Pup

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Another use of the clock is when facing a bet that you are going to fold to, especially a reraise. It's amazing how often people will flash their cards. Not a major winning strategy, agreed, but a little bit of free info never goes amiss.
 
H

holypendant

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This is a tourney, a race n about winning the prize or even juz get itm. everything that u can use and secure a winning pos is good.. i used to use the entire clock everytime when i was a newbie to get myself from bubbled. even until now, i still tend to use it but to get myself deeper into the prize pool... So yeah... u've done the right thing.. who cares you use wat tactics as long as u can win...
 
Stu_Ungar

Stu_Ungar

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I think you will show a higher profit by learning how to play poker correctly rather than just using your clock time up in strange spots
 
8Michael3

8Michael3

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Use whatever you can to stall the game while a player like myself will just keep stealing your Weak and easy blinds. Ive used it but not anymore because I dont play above my bankroll anymore.
 
Egon Towst

Egon Towst

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If your preference is to avoid playing hands, you can achieve this most effectively by not entering tournaments in the first place. :p

On a more serious note, check the site rules of your chosen poker room. Several of them say that deliberate time-wasting is not permitted. Therefore, you may be in some difficulty if opponents become annoyed and make a complaint.
 
B

bilgert

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I don't see what the problem there is with this. In live touneys if you do this too much, they'll call a clock on you (often), but this is precisely why they have a time bank. I see no problem with using it to your advantage if your style of play can profit from it.
 
G

Goinfordamill

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I agree but with a condition.....

I have used this strat in the past but got tired of just barely making the money. I now make it a point to never put myself in this situation and usually make it deep ITM.
 
Egon Towst

Egon Towst

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I don't see what the problem there is with this. In live touneys if you do this too much, they'll call a clock on you (often), but this is precisely why they have a time bank. I see no problem with using it to your advantage if your style of play can profit from it.

I suspect you missed my post:

check the site rules of your chosen poker room. Several of them say that deliberate time-wasting is not permitted. Therefore, you may be in some difficulty if opponents become annoyed and make a complaint.

For example (from bodog`s rules):

"Players that intentionally slow down play will be warned and if such behavior continues may have their accounts suspended."

You might be surprised, if you search in the fine print, to find how many sites have a similar rule. The only reason, imo, that slow play has become quite widespread in tournaments is because those who dislike it don`t actually realise that they have the right to complain to Support about it.
 
Oskool

Oskool

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Do your thing

Poker is a game of skill, and some luck. If you're smart enough to do this and someone else isn't, take whatever advantage you can get (legally). I too have done it.

I will look in your treasure's gypsy, do you understand?
Who is this lady you've shrunk?

-Borat
 
TPC

TPC

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Poker is a game of skill, and some luck. If you're smart enough to do this and someone else isn't, take whatever advantage you can get (legally). I too have done it.


Who said this gives you an advantage? It doesn't, you are only hurting yourself by doing this. Yeah, you might sneak into the first level of pay. However, the point is you shouldn't be in that situation in the first place. You should be shoving and be aggressive when your M is around 10, to give your self a shot to go deep and make the final table!!!

"Using the clock" is a strategy used by poor players. Players that are happy with just cashing. You never get ahead or make any money playing to just cash a tourney.
 
Pbland

Pbland

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I would only use time stalling as a last resort. I play at Bodog so stalling isn't permitted, but I doubt many players have ever been told by Bodog to not do that. When I'm on the bubble, I'm always looking to push with a decent hand and I've got a small stack. When I first started playing poker, I would get to the bubble with hardly any M and then try to make it, but I realized that's a poor strategy. You will never win a tourney and rarely make the bubble.
 
A

AceZWylD

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I think that if you are severely crippled by a previous play that puts your M far below 10, stalling might have a place. Other than that, I don't agree with this approach.
 
N

nightmoves44

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yes

I totally agree with using the clock and stalling,Ive placed in the money(or satelite entry)by using the clock.It really does work,and I dont care who or what anyone says...it does work,and it is legal online at least.
 
bullishwwd

bullishwwd

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Legal and smart play

I was in a tourny the other day,,16 of 24 left,,12-18 get 3 tournament dollars,,im at 2and change at 16th...so..since the change is relatively worthless,,i used up my entire clock each and every hand to get to the 18th spot and my 3dollars..most of the time i knew i was gonna fold,,,had to lay down some hands that hurt to let go of,,but once i hit the 18 mark,,I played poker,,all in with decent hands and went out at 14th,,some called me rude names and said i was being an ass,,i totally dissagree with that..first Its my Clock and I'll use it as i dmn well see fit...2nd..i wanted that 3rd dollar,,thats a whole other MTT:) anyhoo,,just some poker thoughts for tonight,,,cya on da felt,,still learning my way around this site,,gonna take a bit..

Proper clock usuage is a key ingrediant of the game...smart and is legal...most do it when necessary but after hand to hand, not that productive.
 
Stu_Ungar

Stu_Ungar

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Proper clock usuage is a key ingrediant of the game..

Yes its right up there with board texture, opponent profiling and equity. I would suggest you all spend some time reading up on the various clock usage strategies as its probably one of the most profitable tools you can add to your game. From what I gather on 2+2 Ed Miller is devoting several chapters to it in his next book.
 
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