Shoving 10BBs UTG on MTT bubble

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ph_il

...
You know that when you shove it and get called probably will have around 45-50% chance of winning the pot. In your situation UTG and on the bubble, I wouldn't take that risk. Especially with a relative healthy stack (compared to others).
I don't have a healthy stack at all compared to others. My stack is significantly larger than other stacks who are folding all of their hands and trying to get into the money, but compared to the blinds, I'm a short stack. The smaller stacks are severely short.

I'm hoping this gets seen, but for those who replied, does your decision change if this were the final table bubble and not the money bubble? We are no longer min-cashing and there are significant pay jumps at the final table, so are we still taking the same 'go for the win' approach when much more money is on the line in this same situation?
 
atlantafalcons0

atlantafalcons0

Legend
I don't have a healthy stack at all compared to others. My stack is significantly larger than other stacks who are folding all of their hands and trying to get into the money, but compared to the blinds, I'm a short stack. The smaller stacks are severely short.

I'm hoping this gets seen, but for those who replied, does your decision change if this were the final table bubble and not the money bubble? We are no longer min-cashing and there are significant pay jumps at the final table, so are we still taking the same 'go for the win' approach when much more money is on the line in this same situation?

I think that depends on stack dynamics, how many shorties are there? 3-4? What exactly are the stacks involved? I'm not one to fold to the final table and finish 9th. Is rather take my flip now before it's super easy for multiple players to call me. An UTG shove looks suspect though, from a 10bb stack. How loose are the big stacks? Any other players been shoving lately and getting called down light? Your "M" is like 4 right now and if you fold this, players can call you down super light and if you shove from the button or cutoff a big stack will surely call with ATC now.

That being said, I'd take the chance now and hope to win my flip against one player with QJ, K10, etc. and who knows, you might get called by ace rag or a lower pkt pair and catch an easy double up.
 
4soul

4soul

Visionary
if you are the shortest player from the mtt...you must go allin in some circustances....but most of the times folding giving yourself more satisfaction...depends how much is the first place ITM....and your aspirations....if the second place isn't good ....you can push with 10bb for shure quite and light, because most of the players will fold to catch the money places :) .
 
R

razzor94

Rock Star
Awards
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Going into an MTT or any other tournament your goal should always be to win it. Statisticly you cash aroung 15% of the time in MTTs. Thats slightly above once in ten MTTs you play. Making it past the bubble probably won't cover your 9 other buy ins. So make sure that one time you cash. you cash big. So always a shove there with 10BB or less.
 
robertocoelho

robertocoelho

Rock Star
I would have expected to have fallen short to shove, but the smaller your stack but easy call opponents
 
alipalip

alipalip

Rock Star
I think WiZZiM and razzor94 got right. The right play here was to shove. When you start a tournament you have to play for at least the final tabel!
If you fold here you maybe get the ITM but with 10bb you still have to go shove with another hand, in better way you got one in the next hand but probably you have to wait another 10-15 hand wich means 1/2 bb +sb so you got your self in coin flip situation.

If you go shove you get the chance to double up, and the chance to play for final tabel where are the most of the money!
 
rock0001

rock0001

Visionary
Awards
19
it depends maybe on a higher buy in tournament i might consider making a raise/fold or just limping however i think you played the hand well because to succeed at mtt you need to reach some final tables to make them profitable over the long run. better luck on the next tournament.
 
Saperion

Saperion

Enthusiast
I think I may have found my biggest money leak when playing MTTs.

Blinds were 400/800, I was sitting on ~8.1K, and was dealt 88. The stack sizes behind me up to the CO were very short, between 2K-4K. The CO and BTN were sitting on ~40K each and the blinds were both smaller than my stack.

I decided to shove and at best pick up the blinds, get called by a smaller stack and knock them out, or get called by the big stack and hopefully double up.

I lost the hand and was out of the MTT. I took a look at MTT lobby and noticed that I was the bubble boy, busting 20th/19 places paid. The bottom player had 120 chips in their stack. A closer inspection and my stack size put me at around the 8th place, which I found interesting as I only had 10BBs.

So, did I make a mistake in shoving the 88s UTG? I've always been a player who advocates shoving hands when you're at 10BBs, but maybe I need to take a different approach to the strategy on the money bubble. If I had been paying more attention I would've noticed the severe short stack and maybe would've folded, most likely got into the money, and found another spot to shove....but is folding the right move?

What hands are we calling and folding here? I'm sure we're def shoving KK+, but AK? Or maybe we just fold. I don't know the formula, but I'm sure there is a way to calculate your risk vs reward for these types of situations? If anyone knows it or can point me in the right direction, I appreciate it.

I guess my ultimate question is: What is the most profitable play in this situation?

Easy fold until u get ITM.
 
ribaric

ribaric

Visionary
I think I may have found my biggest money leak when playing MTTs.

Blinds were 400/800, I was sitting on ~8.1K, and was dealt 88. The stack sizes behind me up to the CO were very short, between 2K-4K. The CO and BTN were sitting on ~40K each and the blinds were both smaller than my stack.

I decided to shove and at best pick up the blinds, get called by a smaller stack and knock them out, or get called by the big stack and hopefully double up.

I lost the hand and was out of the MTT. I took a look at MTT lobby and noticed that I was the bubble boy, busting 20th/19 places paid. The bottom player had 120 chips in their stack. A closer inspection and my stack size put me at around the 8th place, which I found interesting as I only had 10BBs.

So, did I make a mistake in shoving the 88s UTG? I've always been a player who advocates shoving hands when you're at 10BBs, but maybe I need to take a different approach to the strategy on the money bubble. If I had been paying more attention I would've noticed the severe short stack and maybe would've folded, most likely got into the money, and found another spot to shove....but is folding the right move?

What hands are we calling and folding here? I'm sure we're def shoving KK+, but AK? Or maybe we just fold. I don't know the formula, but I'm sure there is a way to calculate your risk vs reward for these types of situations? If anyone knows it or can point me in the right direction, I appreciate it.

I guess my ultimate question is: What is the most profitable play in this situation?
Well i would do the same but i would just raise if the man with 40k called and if the man with 40k folded i would raised to all in to pick up blinds and KO short stack
 
E

ElRosado

Enthusiast
Call me cautious or tight or scared but Im not putting tourny life out there on the bubble with pair UTG. Never. The value of my chips in hand are far greater than the chips I'll gain.
 
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