Overlays are common on ACR - HOW?

theANMATOR

theANMATOR

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Hey fellas & ladies.

Hope yall are doing well and crushing the tables.

How is it possible on ACR nearly every tourney has an overlay 95%. I play micro and low stakes, up to 16.50 buyin, but mostly my average buyin is 4.40 or 6.60.

I just wonder how ACR can support giving away the overlays for about 95% of the tourneys I play in - every day 7 days a week.

I used to think the obvious answer was the cash table rake more than covers this 'expense' for ACR. But recently some people have said cash volume is low on ACR.

Is it possible the mid & high stakes nearly always meet/exceed the guarantees and that is what covers the lower level tourney overlays.

Speculation is cool here - I'd be cool to hear from some one who knows about this stuff - rather than conjecture, but speculation is fine too.

I'm hoping this isn't affecting ACR negatively - because this is the site I put 95% of my tourney volume on - and if it went away - I'd probably just cry! ;)
 
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fundiver199

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If the overlay is small, the poker site still makes some money. Say its an 11$ MTT with a guaranty of 1.000$, and 95 people play. Then the price pool will be 1.000$, of which players have contributed 950$. But players paid 1.045$, so the poker site still earned 45$. With that being said I also dont understand, how constant overlays can be sustainable, and most likely the they are not. So either ACR will eventually reduce the quaranties, or they will manage to attract more players, or they will go bust.

Right now volume is declining on nearly every single online poker site due to the nothern hemisphere summer and lifting of COVID restrictions. So this might be mostly a case of ACR not being as fast to adjust their guaranties as some other sites. Regardless of the reason for this just enjoy it, as long as it last.

If you are worried about the financial stability of a poker site, then just dont keep to much money deposited there. While at least 100 BIs is recommended for MTTs, nobody say, that all the money has to sit on the poker site. After all depositing more money if needed usually only takes seconds ;)
 
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BIGAUS

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I've noticed this happen more frequently as well when it comes to micro stakes tournaments. I think like fundiver says, they can "afford" to do this because the amount they're giving away is small compared to what they make in bigger stakes tournaments that when I look out of curiosity rarely have overlay. When I watch Youtube bloggers document their live tournament play in Vegas, even with those massive guarantees, you always see them break the guarantee super quickly and sometime 2x or 3x it, so perhaps there's a similar element of that on ACR. One high roller tournament going 2x the guarantee could probably fund weeks and months of micro overlays.
 
Amanda A

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I've wondered about this on ACR as well. I always look for Overlay, I'm Queen of Overlay, :) I have noticed that they don't have all the tourneys they used to with great overlay and that some of the ones that used to have great overlay like the $6 $8000 GTD actually more than met the guarantee last time I played it. Boo Hoo.

I think some of the low buy in tourneys are now offering less GTD than used to, or it feels that way to me. And now that they named the $11 evening tourney the Boski, it is getting more people, so no overlay. I think they are experimenting with ideas like that so get more people to play some of these tourneys.

I love ACR as well and would be devastated if they went away, but while they are offering overlay, I'm certainly going to seek out and play those tourneys when I can. It would be crazy not to. I'm certainly ok with high rollers funding us grinding the micros, LOL!
 
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fundiver199

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I've noticed this happen more frequently as well when it comes to micro stakes tournaments. I think like fundiver says, they can "afford" to do this because the amount they're giving away is small compared to what they make in bigger stakes tournaments that when I look out of curiosity rarely have overlay.

Obviously overlays are more costly in high stakes tournaments, and therefore poker sites might be faster to adjust the guaranties there. But I dont think, any poker site will deliberately allow microstakes MTTs to run with permanent overlay. It seems like an inefficient way of attracting players compared to bonuses, freerolls or other promotions.
 
Adi8877

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Someone few weeks ago opened a topic about the same thing.

Based on common sense, and as i play these tourneys often too on micro, low level + what i heard from them in the weekly ACR shows, when i used to watch it + i follow them, play on their site for aprox. 2 years have some conclusions:

1., First of all, i don't count overlay, when the guaranteed prize don't go up, but the buyin+fee amount is over that. Good example the 15K 11$ tourney, what 1-2 times in a week have less than 1500 regs. If you count it with 1400 regs, it gives you 15400$, but the prize stays 15k because of fees, so they still earn 400 bucks

2., Probably the most important, when they have started it in the last spring, summer, more tourneys - even more than nowadays, they already cut back few - it was a promotional act, too. Bringing more players - what anyway works, i always see new players on the reg tourneys i play - was one of that, the other one, basically they don't have any rakeback program what applies on these tourney levels.
They even mentioned it in their weekly show it will go like this at least for 2-3 years more, perhaps even extend it, add new tourneys - what they do sometimes anyway.

3., It is really simple to count out how much money approx. they earn weekly from CG, sng (based on the leaderboards, rakerace) also the tourneys (if you want to dig in their pocket, obviously they make profit, otherwise they wouldnt do it - no mention the casino, sportbetting), 1-2 mid level 30-50K gtd tourney easily covers the real overlays in a given day. So basically the tourneys are same profitable like cg, sng, you can look it as something instead of tourney rake race - at least i see the overlay tourneys like that. i think ACR too, anyway they would shut it down, but i am sure that would make them loss more players and money. anyway opposite direction if you are building something up.

4., Most of the players waste their money on their site, go play upper level, so pay back it in rakes, or casino, sportbetting - i spent significant part of my low level winnings as well, i know others, too.

5., if you compare it to the sng, cg rakerace - especially sng, where if you play only on demand, they give you back the fee - it is still a cheaper promotion. (recommend you check the level of distinction promotions, how much money they give away for that few dozen guys yearly, count it how much rake, fee they pay... the micro, low level couple of grand is very small part of their income, just take some time to count it out approx.) And they rarely have any overlay from high gtd, med, high level, even on low, you must search them, know daily 3-4 what is good.

6., Take an average weekday and weekend day, count it out, you will see, takes max 30 min check the tourneys, count it and compare...
and check the rakerace weekly beast and sng, how much money they give back there......

if you did enjoy further their low, micro tourney promotion for us!!!!!

gl
 
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Adi8877

Adi8877

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Hey fellas & ladies.

Hope yall are doing well and crushing the tables.

How is it possible on ACR nearly every tourney has an overlay 95%. I play micro and low stakes, up to 16.50 buyin, but mostly my average buyin is 4.40 or 6.60.

I just wonder how ACR can support giving away the overlays for about 95% of the tourneys I play in - every day 7 days a week.

I used to think the obvious answer was the cash table rake more than covers this 'expense' for ACR. But recently some people have said cash volume is low on ACR.

Is it possible the mid & high stakes nearly always meet/exceed the guarantees and that is what covers the lower level tourney overlays.

Speculation is cool here - I'd be cool to hear from some one who knows about this stuff - rather than conjecture, but speculation is fine too.

I'm hoping this isn't affecting ACR negatively - because this is the site I put 95% of my tourney volume on - and if it went away - I'd probably just cry! ;)

That's just great, there are plenty very intelligent humanoids out there, whose complaining because they offer some promotion, easier money. It was ongoing for a year, but for some reason there are few great one, whose even start threads because of that... Total insane, nuts somethings.....
They just cut back (or deleted) all the micro, low level tourneys in the European morning time, so that means, we can go back into nightshift, make your life, play, winning harder!!!!

Okay, very clever, let's do it!!!!!!! Anyway, we are better on these levels!!!!;)
 
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mikemayberry

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With all of the crypto they handle, if they don't have a team doing arbitrage I would be shocked. There is probably more profit for them in daily trading than there is from the site if they are doing it right.
 
rock0001

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I am actually wondering the same. i dont know how ACR can support these overlays without losing money. probable they still profit from the higher buy in mtt, so maybe they can afford losing some money on lower buy in mtt.
 
antonis32123

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I have also seen these overlays in the micros , in higher stakes I do not think they are so big . But yes , in the micros ACR puts money from their wallet to fund these tourneys , maybe because rake from higher buyin tourneys and profits allow them to do so , maybe to attract fish to their platform , maybe because still many of the grinders in the micros use their profits to reinvest them in higher buyin tourneys or cash games and not withdrawing gthem instantly .

So yeah , for some reasons they keep these games in the lobby . Fine by me , I think they know what they are doing , players are benefited by this , so no reason to complain . Also PS , , partypoker , other poker rooms , now are offering less or no games in micros , or their GTD prze is rediculous or there are not any NLH but only PLO games lol , 25c for a 50$ or 30$ prizepool , lol , PS has no 55c big tourneys now (they didn't want overlays ??they didn't want to lower the prizepool and still offer the games to grinders?? who knows...) , so paying 25c to play for 500$ is good on ACR , if it has overlay , who cares , lol :) The fact that ACR is raising their stakes by adding more money to their bigger event , the VENOM , $10M seems to me they are doing great with their profits .
 
Luvepoker

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Its always slower in the summer time and with covid restrictions easing we should not be surprised by this. By mid September will will see an up tic in players going into poker though the winter.
 
theANMATOR

theANMATOR

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follow up playing higher stakes

I've wondered about this on ACR as well. I always look for Overlay, I'm Queen of Overlay, :) I'm certainly ok with high rollers funding us grinding the micros, LOL!

Obviously overlays are more costly in high stakes tournaments, and therefore poker sites might be faster to adjust the guaranties there. But I dont think, any poker site will deliberately allow microstakes MTTs to run with permanent overlay. It seems like an inefficient way of attracting players compared to bonuses, freerolls or other promotions.

That's just great, there are plenty very intelligent humanoids out there, whose complaining because they offer some promotion, easier money. It was ongoing for a year, but for some reason there are few great one, whose even start threads because of that... Total insane, nuts somethings.....
They just cut back (or deleted) all the micro, low level tourneys in the European morning time, so that means, we can go back into nightshift, make your life, play, winning harder!!!!

Okay, very clever, let's do it!!!!!!! Anyway, we are better on these levels!!!!;)

I am actually wondering the same. i dont know how ACR can support these overlays without losing money. probable they still profit from the higher buy in mtt, so maybe they can afford losing some money on lower buy in mtt.

I have also seen these overlays in the micros , in higher stakes I do not think they are so big . But yes , in the micros ACR puts money from their wallet to fund these tourneys , maybe because rake from higher buyin tourneys and profits allow them to do so , maybe to attract fish to their platform , maybe because still many of the grinders in the micros use their profits to reinvest them in higher buyin tourneys or cash games and not withdrawing gthem instantly .

So yeah , for some reasons they keep these games in the lobby . Fine by me , I think they know what they are doing The fact that ACR is raising their stakes by adding more money to their bigger event , the VENOM , $10M seems to me they are doing great with their profits .

I've noticed this happen more frequently as well when it comes to micro stakes tournaments. I think like fundiver says, they can "afford" to do this because the amount they're giving away is small compared to what they make in bigger stakes tournaments that when I look out of curiosity rarely have overlay. When I watch Youtube bloggers document their live tournament play in Vegas, even with those massive guarantees, you always see them break the guarantee super quickly and sometime 2x or 3x it, so perhaps there's a similar element of that on ACR. One high roller tournament going 2x the guarantee could probably fund weeks and months of micro overlays.

Hey all - just following up on this topic. I've been playing slightly higher stakes lately, and it seems most of the tourneys above 10k seem to eclipse the guarantee nearly always.

Case in point I played in a 25k, 40k and a 70k this weekend.
The 25k prize pool ended up somewhere above 35k.
The 40k nearly hit 50k, and the 70k prize pool almost hit 100k.
Obviously this is great for the players who make it into the money, and also the company since every buyin has rake attached - so the 70k event was a 30+3 dollar event and I think their were right around 3200 runners so that is just under 10k profit for ACR.

I think it's really cool when the guarantees are surpassed. Seeing a 70k event nearly hit 100k prize pool is definitely eye opening.

I ended up busting out of the 40k in 27th out of about 3000 players. Not bad, but I was really hoping to make FT in this one.
Next time. :)
 
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