open raising from EP-MP on short stack

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chakalaka

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Hi guys!

What do you think about open raising x2 when you are on EP-MP with 15-20bb and you have hand like: A9s-AJs, suited broadways? You play or/fold, or/call, just push or just fold? I don't consider limp, because it's wack.

Cheers!
 
thehangdude

thehangdude

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I use a 2X raise in certain tournaments, but only at certain times. Most everybody should have near the 10-20BB amount (with maybe a big stack or two). If you are the low stack, just shove or fold.

You need to guess what villains will call, fold, and raise with when you 2X raise. Callers will likely have near the range you suggested, so I wouldn't want these in my 2X raise range. You want hands that you can easily call an all in or over bet, or hands that will be easy to fold to raises.

In ep-mp, my 2X/call (or shove to raise) hands might be QQ+ and AK+ at this point in a tourney. My fold to raise hands might include 66-88, suited Ax, and maybe KTs+. I would open shove hands like 99-JJ and AJ+ for fold equity, knowing when I get called I am likely flipping at best.

I usually wait until final couple tables to start a 2X open strategy. But with any strategy, you need a plan for whatever your villain does. What would you do with your range when the Button raises it to 5X? Are you willing to drop another chunk of your stack out of position to a player that might already have you dominated?
 
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karl coakley

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2x raise really isn't a raise and all kinds of bad things can happen.

Your certainly going to get called by the phone book. This type of raise just invites the fish to school in your hand.

It also shows a lot of weakness, you min raise and there are 1 or 2 other calls invites a villain in late position to shove over the top.

I would....

Not play weak hands like you posted in early position.

If you do play these hands, 3x -4x. Don't telegraph your hand by betting less with weaker hands and more with strong hands.

Limping really shouldn't be an option. If you can't properly raise your hand what does that tell you? Probably better to just fold the trash and find a better hand.
 
Collin Moshman

Collin Moshman

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It's fine to min-raise with a 15-20bb stack from any position (besides the small blind). With 15bb from early position, you want to be min-raising a polarized range. What this means is that with a hand that's strong enough to shove but not a monster, then just shove.

So for example with AQo, KJs, or 88 I'd just shove.

With AKs or JJ, you can raise and call a shove.

With ATo or KJo, you can raise and then fold to a shove.
 
deputat777

deputat777

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Hi guys!

What do you think about open raising x2 when you are on EP-MP with 15-20bb and you have hand like: A9s-AJs, suited broadways? You play or/fold, or/call, just push or just fold? I don't consider limp, because it's wack.

Cheers!


I would have pushed. A 2bb raise is so ...
 
Vorem

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I would not open A9s from early positions. Only A10s,KQ, 88+
 
Maiuchi

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in that instance and being short I make an increase in bets I can even go there trying to steal the blinds
 
shinmenkami

shinmenkami

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2x raise really isn't a raise and all kinds of bad things can happen.

Your certainly going to get called by the phone book. This type of raise just invites the fish to school in your hand.

It also shows a lot of weakness, you min raise and there are 1 or 2 other calls invites a villain in late position to shove over the top.

I would....

Not play weak hands like you posted in early position.

If you do play these hands, 3x -4x. Don't telegraph your hand by betting less with weaker hands and more with strong hands.

Limping really shouldn't be an option. If you can't properly raise your hand what does that tell you? Probably better to just fold the trash and find a better hand.


Great answer, thanks
 
Igor Popadyk

Igor Popadyk

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a lot also depends on opponents and the effective stack, my opinion is that with such hands open 2.5x, but exclude A9 offsuit and sometimes limp premium hands (but this is not certain)
 
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Warlock1792

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I think advice to use a larger sizing than 2x when 15-20BB is bad advice. A lot of the time you will have opponents on button and in blinds who will have <30BB, so why raise with 2.5x and even worse 3x. People call tighter when short stacked and will shove over your raise a lot, so anything bigger than 2x is essentially wasting chips if you raise/fold.

Personally I use 2.2-2.3x when I have over 30BB and generally min raise when below 30BB unless I am constantly getting shoved on and may increase my raise for that reason. I use 2.5x when usually between 50-100BB and 3x when over 100BB. I would take into account the effective chip stacks though so if I have 50BB and a lot of villains behind me are at 20BB then min raising would be correct play in my opinion
 
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