KK close to bubble

M

major pissadas

Enthusiast
Silver Level
Joined
Jul 22, 2010
Total posts
52
Awards
1
Chips
14
Hello,

I had this hand today and I don't know what the correct play was:


I timed out thinking if I should call and risk going out or if I should fold. I was rank 188 out of 331 in a 5€ MTT, 305 ppl get paid, min cash 7.61€. What's the right move here? Don't think I've ever folded KK in a situation like this and it certainly didn't feel right doing so. I ended up cashing but could only get the min cash.

Appreciate the advice.
 
najisami

najisami

Legend
Loyaler
Joined
Aug 11, 2014
Total posts
3,066
Awards
6
MA
Chips
330
Hi major,
First of all, I'm no expert or pro, just going to say what I think.

There are two ways to look at this situation:

Some players would look at it with a conservative approach, meaning they would prefer not to gamble and get to the money first, hoping the 14 BBs could be enough to stick around with and outlive the 26 players left. The other reason is that there are players left to act behind you and they have you covered, any one of them could shove to isolate (Seat 3 for instance), forcing you to put in the rest of your chips.

But the most common recommendation is to shove with any prime hand when you get down to 15 BBs or less. If you're playing to make money, the money is all the way at the top of the finale table (Unless you're happy with the min-cash).
There are also other factors in play here, namely and especially the info you have gathered on the players behind you. It could be that everybody was playing tight at that point, but it's also possible that there's a maniac with chips......

There is more to say, but I don't want to make this too long, at least you stayed alive and got some cash. And what happened at showdown ? Don't tell me they both had AX and you would've won 🤪.

Good luck man :).
 
pentazepam

pentazepam

Legend
Platinum Level
Joined
Oct 31, 2008
Total posts
1,471
Awards
2
SE
Chips
212
You get it in of course. You can't get a much better situation. The fact that it's so short-stacked makes it possible that the other players can have all sorts of lower pairs and AX or suited broadways.

In a cash game, 200BB deep you can think about folding KK against some players - but in a MTT almost never. And short in a MTT: No, No,No. Just NO.
 
Fofa

Fofa

Rock Star
Platinum Level
Joined
Aug 28, 2023
Total posts
361
Awards
1
BR
Chips
59
In this situation i dont run... i go for the game :x
 
Pavel1203733

Pavel1203733

Visionary
Platinum Level
Joined
Sep 23, 2018
Total posts
882
Awards
3
Chips
42
Hello.
I think this move is not bad. I played a lot of hands during the same situations and lost all my chips in the end.
 
Poker Orifice

Poker Orifice

#2 in y'er pantz?
Platinum Level
Joined
Jan 19, 2008
Total posts
25,385
Awards
6
CA
Chips
254
You get it in of course. You can't get a much better situation. The fact that it's so short-stacked makes it possible that the other players can have all sorts of lower pairs and AX or suited broadways.

In a cash game, 200BB deep you can think about folding KK against some players - but in a MTT almost never. And short in a MTT: No, No,No. Just NO.

This ^

And... Something to keep in mind going forward, going for a 'min-cash' is a losing way to play MTT's. Here you have a MONSTER in an ideal spot to more than triple up(??). Going forward with a 45bb stack, giving you lots of opportunity to abuse the bubble (or to survive a future all-in scenario)
 
MK_

MK_

Legend
Platinum Level
Joined
Sep 14, 2022
Total posts
1,058
US
Chips
351
I understand wanting to cash but that was painful to watch, you have him covered and you have Kings.... Are you waiting for Aces?, this line of thinking this was anything but a shove in that situation will cost you money in the long run. Don't settle for a min cash, get it in there👍
 
jasioo

jasioo

Rock Star
Bronze Level
Joined
Oct 1, 2023
Total posts
135
Awards
2
PL
Chips
139
In my opinion, you only made one mistake and I don't mean folding KK. The mistake is that you are afraid of losing money, so I conclude that you are playing in tournaments that you cannot afford.

You can't win if you are afraid to lose.

If you weren't afraid of losing your buy-in, you would 100% go all-in on this hand
 
kaynbergo

kaynbergo

Rock Star
Platinum Level
Joined
Nov 24, 2022
Total posts
261
Awards
1
UA
Chips
98
you had an average stack that you could confidently go all-in to the bubble, but there's a chance to lose, that's poker
 
M

major pissadas

Enthusiast
Silver Level
Joined
Jul 22, 2010
Total posts
52
Awards
1
Chips
14
Hi major,
First of all, I'm no expert or pro, just going to say what I think.

There are two ways to look at this situation:

Some players would look at it with a conservative approach, meaning they would prefer not to gamble and get to the money first, hoping the 14 BBs could be enough to stick around with and outlive the 26 players left. The other reason is that there are players left to act behind you and they have you covered, any one of them could shove to isolate (Seat 3 for instance), forcing you to put in the rest of your chips.

But the most common recommendation is to shove with any prime hand when you get down to 15 BBs or less. If you're playing to make money, the money is all the way at the top of the finale table (Unless you're happy with the min-cash).
There are also other factors in play here, namely and especially the info you have gathered on the players behind you. It could be that everybody was playing tight at that point, but it's also possible that there's a maniac with chips......

There is more to say, but I don't want to make this too long, at least you stayed alive and got some cash. And what happened at showdown ? Don't tell me they both had AX and you would've won 🤪.

Good luck man :).
I can't recall their hands but I would've tripled up
 
M

major pissadas

Enthusiast
Silver Level
Joined
Jul 22, 2010
Total posts
52
Awards
1
Chips
14
Thank you for the replies.

Recently, I've been the bubble or close to it so often, and several times with KK, that I just wasn't sure this time if I should take the risk. It certainly didn't feel right to fold KK and the min cash didn't help me at all since I'm currently on a downswing which makes me question everything.
 
3

300HPGOD

Legend
Platinum Level
Joined
Feb 13, 2018
Total posts
1,456
Awards
11
Chips
93
This is a no brainer jam and even if you were on the stone cold bubble this is an easy jam. You have roughly 14 BBs here so you are not that deep and you get the 2nd best starting hand you can get. You should be fist pumping as soon as you see the KK and should be jamming no matter what happens in front of you off this stack size. Yes, as others have mentioned if were much deeper and much more action in front of us then we can start to factor in the likelihood of aces but in this spot, with 14 BBs this is a shove without a second thought.
 
M

major pissadas

Enthusiast
Silver Level
Joined
Jul 22, 2010
Total posts
52
Awards
1
Chips
14
This is a no brainer jam and even if you were on the stone cold bubble this is an easy jam. You have roughly 14 BBs here so you are not that deep and you get the 2nd best starting hand you can get. You should be fist pumping as soon as you see the KK and should be jamming no matter what happens in front of you off this stack size. Yes, as others have mentioned if were much deeper and much more action in front of us then we can start to factor in the likelihood of aces but in this spot, with 14 BBs this is a shove without a second thought.
Yeah, it was a mistake by me
 
Igor Popadyk

Igor Popadyk

Legend
Platinum Level
Joined
May 7, 2015
Total posts
1,115
Awards
7
Chips
81
if your goal is to get into the prize, then you played correctly, if you win the tournament, then my opinion is that you should play call
 
akmost

akmost

Rising Star
Loyaler
Joined
Feb 2, 2017
Total posts
1,976
Awards
2
GR
Chips
111
I like the answers here guys and I agree!
Don't go for the min cash in MTTs the juicy prizes are in the final table!!

GL
 
S

Sopt

Rock Star
Platinum Level
Joined
Feb 21, 2023
Total posts
376
Awards
1
SI
Chips
147
Your aim is the final table not the min cash tbh. Just play your good hands, no risk no reward. :D
 
AndyFio

AndyFio

Rock Star
Platinum Level
Joined
Jan 5, 2021
Total posts
305
Awards
1
Chips
66
Hello, I think you did the right thing in this situation, because if you had raised first, you would have played from a position of strength, and since there were already two raises before you, then there could well be aces somewhere or at least one ace, which is quite dangerous for you. Also, kings are much stronger against one opponent, and in this hand you would potentially have two of them, which would significantly reduce your chances.
 
dallam

dallam

Legend
Loyaler
Joined
Aug 2, 2018
Total posts
3,091
Awards
28
Chips
118
Unless you not fireing your whole BR on this MTT, it's a push (But as it's a 5.5 it's all good).
UTG+1 just isolated the limper, this range is a jut a bit wider than MP1, who could pull the triger with AA, KK, QQ, JJ, AK or AQs. If you manage to outlast UTG only, you are staying. I get that 3-way is uncomfortable, but along with AA this has to be still a confident push for the chippies, and it might be reduced to 2-way as well :)
 
R

Recreationalplayer

Visionary
Platinum Level
Joined
Aug 29, 2021
Total posts
864
Awards
1
Chips
171
KK is allin push. You can fold if you don't want to embrace any variance and just survive the bubble.
 
RustyRed83

RustyRed83

Legend
Platinum Level
Joined
Sep 2, 2018
Total posts
1,013
Awards
2
Chips
116
I dont play tournaments to min cash, it is not a good mindset to have. As is evident here, it makes you play scared poker. Final table is where the money is, that should be the aim. It should be the complete opposite mindset around the bubble, this is the point in the tournament you need to take advantage of, those that are playing scared poker to min cash, stealing blinds, 3-betting, and most certainly not mucking kings.
 
luckyfish98

luckyfish98

Visionary
Platinum Level
Joined
Jul 7, 2019
Total posts
688
Awards
1
LV
Chips
40
I loose with that not matters what I have even AA buble destroy everything
 
Mr.$t0k

Mr.$t0k

Rock Star
Platinum Level
Joined
Aug 11, 2016
Total posts
410
Awards
3
UA
Chips
66
I think if you want to win this tournament you need to go ALLIN
 
dzsire

dzsire

Legend
Platinum Level
Joined
May 8, 2021
Total posts
1,057
Awards
2
HU
Chips
135
Many of my tournaments have ended thanks to bubble-phase-high-pairs. After a lot of experience, one can let go of such premium cards without hesitation in this phase.
If you play for several hours, you can think about whether you will be patient and come out of the competition with a positive balance, or take a risk, but in this case you will fail everything, including the buy-in and the many hours of patient play.
 
maronza1

maronza1

Rock Star
Platinum Level
Joined
Oct 31, 2021
Total posts
347
Awards
4
BW
Chips
181
That was a bad play, playing poker is taking a risk. If you dont go all in with second best hand in poker then why are you playing that tournament. Unless you were too deep stacked thats when you would let that hand pass, but since you are short stacked and you shouldnt fold KK. What were you thinking about the opponents, that they had AA?
 
Top