Up and down straight draw

[wilTurkey56]

Hello all

Playing final table tourney, I was holding 56c, on the small blind. Weak player was on the bb, folded AQ suited twice so know they were only playing PREMIUM hands but I just called anyway (one other caller before me).

Flop came 34J rainbow. This was final table so blinds were big. 2k-4k, I had approx. 50k. I bet 16k and someone bet 3/4 of my stack. I pushed as I was committed.

He had J, my straight didn't come. J's wins

Right or wrong move? (I was on a paid bubble)

Should I have checked first, which may have cuased him to check. If he'd bet first should I have called? Should I have made bigger bet? Should I have folded when he re raised?

 

[Staneff]

You should have bet like 8-12k so when you get raised you can easy muck your cards and wait for the next hand. There`s nothing wrong in playing suited connectors but in this situation you must not make this move. Open-ended straight draw is not a big hand until you get the straight. I dont think check is good move here, but it`s just my opinion. Some people dont like betting here too. 1-2 times BB bet is pretty good idea. On raise you should have folded this.

 

[wilTurkey56]

thinking about it thats not a bad suggestion. I suppose when betting I need to think to myself if he re raises will I be comfortable in calling or going all in? Had I not have been committed then I would have instantly folded after his bet. he was quite an aggressive player too, but I need to learn to look at who is still in the hand rather than just playing my cards (I'm new to live tourneys, even newer to cash)

 

[Arjonius]

What were the rest of the stacks? This can matter quite a bit when you're on or near the bubble.

Without knowing this, the KISS play is to fold. Yes, there's a decent chance you can see the flop for only 1/2 a bb. But you only have 12.5bb, you're unlikely to hammer the flop, catching one pair (the most likely positive flop) won't put you in an easy to play situation, you're likely pot-committed any time you flop enough to put more chips in the pot, and most of the draws you might flop will be behind.

And look what happened. You ended up in a situation where you felt compelled to call off your stack even though you had to be behind.

 

[SuicideKing27]

check call on flop and see what the turn brings, by leading out betting nearly 40% of your stack you're basically telling him you have the J

or a monster draw and are pot committed... you were up against two players OOP. Was there at least one club on the flop(possible BD Flush)? If

not IMO check call the flop, fold the turn if no club or 2,5,6,7 come up, and on to the next hand.

 

[thatgreekdude]

you shouldn't be limping suited connectors when you are 12bbs deep, there value only comes from multi way pots when players are sitting 100bbs+ deep, at 12bbs you should be playing shove/fold, on the flop you should either check/fold or i'd prefer to check/jam that way you maximise your fold equity and we still have outs if we get called. As Arjonius said though stack sizes would help paint a clearer picture.

 

[Jacki Burkhart]

I would either shove preflop as a bluff with a back up plan (mostly because the BB is so tight)

or I would fold. (this is probably what I'll do most of the time)

If stacks were deeper I would definitely limp from the SB as the BB is unlikely to raise me out due to his style.

ok...that said now we're on the flop in a limped pot with a decent draw on a board that is unlikely to have hit any of our opponents too hard.

Since the pot is limped I wouldn't expect too many Jacks to be in the mix but if they are, they are probably not strong Jacks...something like J8-JT. So, if I lead this flop I'll just shove hoping to fold out any medium strength hands that beat me like J8 or A4. If I get called by a hand like JT then I've got back-up outs but my point in shoving is to win what is likely an "orphan" pot with a semi-bluff. The reason I shove instead of make a bet is that most reasonable bet sizes pot commit you, and smaller bet sizes look weak and are more likely to get called, or you get bluffed off.

But, my preferable way to play this pot is to check and hope for a free card. If the BB bets out, we can just fold to his tight range. If the other limper bets his position and bets small we can hope he is just trying to steal the pot and shove. A check-shove will look like a J at least and so if he doesn't have a J he will probably fold, and even if he has a weak J he still might fold if his flop bet was small enough to not pot commit him.

Again, this is all really hard to analyze without stack sizes, but that's my initial thoughts.