now would you have called or folded????

[kidkvno1]

snellefritsie is at seat 0 with 1500.
teecher is at seat 1 with 1480.
mstngrch is at seat 2 with 1500.
RedSox6996 is at seat 4 with 2740.
kidkvno1 is at seat 5 with 1440.
mccalan3761 is at seat 6 with 1870.
Midvale7 is at seat 7 with 1500.
sunshinepeg is at seat 8 with 1500.
fastlou is at seat 9 with 1470.
The button is at seat 4.

kidkvno1 posts the small blind of 5.
mccalan3761 posts the big blind of 10.

snellefritsie: -- --
teecher: -- --
mstngrch: -- --
RedSox6996: -- --
kidkvno1: Kd Ks
mccalan3761: -- --
Midvale7: -- --
sunshinepeg: -- --
fastlou: -- --

Pre-flop:

Midvale7 folds. sunshinepeg folds. fastlou calls.
snellefritsie calls. teecher calls. mstngrch folds.
RedSox6996 calls. kidkvno1 raises to 70.
mccalan3761 folds. fastlou calls. snellefritsie
calls. teecher calls. RedSox6996 calls.

Flop (board: 5d 2h 5s):

kidkvno1 bets 140. fastlou raises to 780.
snellefritsie folds. teecher folds. RedSox6996
folds.

I want to know what would you place him on before i even show his hand???
I am in the cutoff with blinds at 5/10...

 

[RickH2005]

snellefritsie is at seat 0 with 1500.
teecher is at seat 1 with 1480.
mstngrch is at seat 2 with 1500.
RedSox6996 is at seat 4 with 2740.
kidkvno1 is at seat 5 with 1440.
mccalan3761 is at seat 6 with 1870.
Midvale7 is at seat 7 with 1500.
sunshinepeg is at seat 8 with 1500.
fastlou is at seat 9 with 1470.
The button is at seat 4.

kidkvno1 posts the small blind of 5.
mccalan3761 posts the big blind of 10.

snellefritsie: -- --
teecher: -- --
mstngrch: -- --
RedSox6996: -- --
kidkvno1: Kd Ks
mccalan3761: -- --
Midvale7: -- --
sunshinepeg: -- --
fastlou: -- --

Pre-flop:

Midvale7 folds. sunshinepeg folds. fastlou calls.
snellefritsie calls. teecher calls. mstngrch folds.
RedSox6996 calls. kidkvno1 raises to 70.
mccalan3761 folds. fastlou calls. snellefritsie
calls. teecher calls. RedSox6996 calls.

Flop (board: 5d 2h 5s):

kidkvno1 bets 140. fastlou raises to 780.
snellefritsie folds. teecher folds. RedSox6996
folds.

I want to know what would you place him on before i even show his hand???
I am in the cutoff with blinds at 5/10...

1st ,Stephen, you're NOT in the CO, you're the SB--fastlou is MP1--and in MP1 he should have at least 22-55 to limp, if he had higher than that he shoulda raised--so I puthim on at least a small pair--he prolly hit with the 5-2-5, giving him a possable FH or even quads. And I woulda come out with a stronger raise pre-flop with K-K---I would honestly fold here!

 

[Joe Slick]

Although it's possible that he may have hit the flop, it is unlikely. I would put him on a medium overpair, maybe 88, 99, or TT. However, you missed the flop entirely so your KK is not nearly as strong as it was preflop. I have to agree that a fold is the right thing here. There's no sense in putting your tournament life at risk here. I also have to agree that your raise preflop wasn't big enough.

 

[mrjohnson911]

the people above me have basically said what there is to do...
im just wondering what kind of tournament this was, cause i ve seen it quite often that people will make that kind of play with any pair from 88 to AA, limp then call a raise, and then pushing it on the flop with undercards....

i think this is a fold but you could easily still be ahead... my guess is you called or pushed... so i m interested in what he had..

 

[kidkvno1]

sorry on that rick, and i was not thinking right you will see why....

kidkvno1 folds. fastlou is returned 640
(uncalled).

fastlou opts to show 2c Jh.
fastlou has 2c Jh 5d 2h 5s: two pair, fives and deuces.

I was so pissed when i seen his hand! Well need less to say he got knocked out about 4 hands later...

 

[RickH2005]

sorry on that rick, and i was not thinking right you will see why....



I was so pissed when i seen his hand! Well need less to say he got knocked out about 4 hands later...

NOW I see--he really didn't know WHAT he was doin'--I figured if he did, he would at least have a set---but you got sucked out on, Stephen! It's really hard to play against non-players!:smile:

 

[kidkvno1]

oh you don't even know how pissed i was, i justed sat there the whole time thinking on what i could put him on, and at best i was thinking 555 or AA. and then he showed a J2. then after he got knocked out i put in the chat box the donkeys are to stay out in the barn LMAO and eat there hay:listen::rofl::idea:

but seeing it now it was funny tho i am starting to think how many have been doing the same thing in the CC freerolls i think i need to look at the hand data, And who knows maybe i can find some of the hands that i haved played and post them.
I will say this i have no clue how i even lasted that long in that game when everyone kept getting AA KK QQ and yet the whole time the only pocket pairs i had see was QQ No AA no KK no AK. so i can still get deep in to a game with out AK KK AA :embarasse

 

[josh_dei8]

I would have put him on pp 7-10. With him overbetting, I would think the flop didnt help him. But at such an early stage in the game, who knows what he could be playing with no read on him. After he showed, I would have that note to use to my advantage later in the game. But since he was out 4 hands later, somebody else knew how to take advantage of him.

 

[robwhufc]

oh you don't even know how pissed i was, i justed sat there the whole time thinking on what i could put him on, and at best i was thinking 555 or AA.

Just use a bit of 2nd levl thinking. If YOU had 55 or 22 and had flopped a full house or quads against a preflop raiser, then how would you play it? Would you raise big so that opponent folded, or would you call/ min raise to try and keep your opponent in?

I know you've posted already, but how many better flops are there for KK, really? Absolute no brainer call

 

[robwhufc]

However, you missed the flop entirely so your KK is not nearly as strong as it was preflop. .

On a 5 5 2 rainbow flop, KK is stronger than it was preflop.

 

[Jayson745]

I agree that a bigger preflop raise would have saved you chips there. I know the general rule of thumb is 3-4X the bb, but when the bb is only 10, I would have probably made it 110 to go.

 

[ph_il]

Just use a bit of 2nd levl thinking. If YOU had 55 or 22 and had flopped a full house or quads against a preflop raiser, then how would you play it? Would you raise big so that opponent folded, or would you call/ min raise to try and keep your opponent in?

I know you've posted already, but how many better flops are there for KK, really? Absolute no brainer call

This.

On a 5 5 2 rainbow flop, KK is stronger than it was preflop.

And this.

Rob beat me to it.

 

[i desire love]

Really bad laydwn here....
1) If he has aces he raises preflop

2) He hits a monster, no way he reraises you on that flop. U had to know u have himb eat here..

 

[Arielstorm]

With a hand like KK I would have raised a lot more. You never know what kind of players you have there. I would have folded the hand, he could have called with anything giving the small raise. IE suited connectors, or ducks. Defiantly fold the hand.

 

[Kashtree]

I agree with the fold here. Depending on how well you know the player, I would have put him on something like A5. Its a good fold because its early in the tournament. Saving those chips allows for more marginal calls in future rounds. You probably could have moved him off the hand with a larger preflop raise or a larger bet after the flop. However, he has position and this is the danger of playing raised pots out of the small blind. Even being a donk he was able to use his position as leverage against your stronger hand and bluff his way out of a bad call.

 

[RichKo]

Depending on what kinda tournament it was...if it was a freeroll, I think your PF raise was fine, especially that early(since it's usually donk infested). In regular freerolls, I don't care what you raise preflop, they will call 20x bb w 35o, so if it was a freeroll...fold, you don't want to risk it when some turd could have called you with 35o, if not, hopefully you're playing someone who can play, and that bet looks like an attempt to steal from you, and call or re-raise. By the way was it a freeroll or not.

 

[bazerias]

I would have probaly put him on an over pair and shoved when they reraised that big...sounded like a scared reraise. if they had 22's or the 5 maybe would've tried to get more money not scare you out of the pot.

 

[KillerBoo]

In a RM tourney, I woulda called the bet, (it screams out "Dont call me please") and reraised his turn bet if he still wanted to bluff at it. In a freeroll... A5, K5 is very likely, especially since you only made such a weak preflop raise. Even though a huge bet like that on the flop indicates either A2 or a mid pocket pair, since its a freeroll any stupid move is likely.. even a set.

 

[Toris]

I have to agree - if this was a freeroll, there's no telling WHAT a donk will do, so you have to ask yourself ... "do I play right or do I stay in the tournament - even if it means a bad laydown?" I've folded some big hands to donks just so I don't get knocked out by some moron playing a 7/2 offsuit. They weed themselves out eventually.

 

[kidkvno1]

I did think i had him beat, but i have been beat with J2 before.. I did put him on high cards and should of raised more... What was odd was the faq he got J2 the very next hand and hit a jack and did the same thing again. I should of pushed back that was an over bet on his part
thanks

 

[sportznut55]

I know this is pretty after the fact, but here's my 2 cents:
First, you're raise was pretty decent ($70 into a $55 pot), but with several callers, maybe too light. Since this isn't hand #1, only you know how loose this table is. If you knew it was loose, make the raise bigger. Otherwise, not bad.
Here's the problem as I see it. You're pre-flop raise showed strength. You have $450 pot and you bet first out of the gate (Small Blind). You showed tremendous weakness with a $140 bet. You were asking for a re-raise! This could be good if you want to get more chips, but this was not the case for you. You were dipping your toe in the water. And when someone splashed back, you ran away. Now, hindsight is 20/20, but with that many callers and a decent sized pot, you need to show strength. Bet at least 50% of the pot. However, I would've bet at least 75% of the pot to show I had a serious hand (Not Ak that missed). Now, if you get a reraise, you may be in trouble.

PostScript: If it's a freeroll, you will have great luck with pushing all in preflop. According to Percentage of Pots Won with Hold'em Hands Ranked by Percent in the GoCee.com Poker Center, you will win 82% with KK versus 1 player. With 5 (4 limpers + BB) players in the hand, you are bound to get one sucker.

 

[Wonka22]

what's funny about this is that I just read a post about when to show or muck your bluff......he for sure should have mucked that bluff....

 

[ninet7]

fold unless you can see the king he probably flopped a set a/5 my guess not a fan of kk no matter how i play it seems ill loose to A rag mostly

 

[kidkvno1]

Thanks, Someone else tried that move and this time it did not work tho what was funny was that was one hell of a bluff....

 

[chrismonk123]

i woulda raise more pre-flop and. i woulda called on the flop as kinda thought he would have the 2. if he had the 5 he would made u bet or min raised!