Not a Donk Move, is it?

[josh_dei8]

Far as I can tell, I don't think I was wrong. Short handed, strong preflop raise to narrow the field. Correct me if I'm wrong. I asked for ananlysis on another forum and looking for feed back here. Is KJ suited that bad of a hand UTG at a short handed table.

PokerStars Game #22117436183: Tournament #121096851, $1.00+$0.20 Hold'em No Limit - Level IV (50/100) - 2008/11/17 9:31:19 ET
Table '121096851 1' 9-max Seat #9 is the button
Seat 2: ptcv (5590 in chips)
Seat 5: Mispelld (2480 in chips)
Seat 6: jandlhart8 (1650 in chips)
Seat 7: nelliesman93 (1010 in chips)
Seat 9: aacevedo (2770 in chips)
ptcv: posts small blind 50
Mispelld: posts big blind 100
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to jandlhart8

jandlhart8: raises 600 to 700
nelliesman93: folds
aacevedo: calls 700
ptcv: folds
Mispelld: folds
*** FLOP ***

jandlhart8: checks
aacevedo: bets 2070 and is all-in
jandlhart8: calls 950 and is all-in
Uncalled bet (1120) returned to aacevedo
*** TURN ***

*** RIVER ***

*** SHOW DOWN ***
jandlhart8: shows

(a flush, King high)
aacevedo: shows

(a pair of Nines)
aacevedo said, "lucky donk"
jandlhart8 collected 3450 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 3450 | Rake 0
Board

Seat 2: ptcv (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 5: Mispelld (big blind) folded before Flop
Seat 6: jandlhart8 showed

and won (3450) with a flush, King high
Seat 7: nelliesman93 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 9: aacevedo (button) showed

and lost with a pair of Nines

 

[c9h13no3]

Wow, your preflop play is horrible. Your M leve is 11, so I like a raise to about 275. Any more than that, and you're committing too much of your stack to really have much play postflop. Open shoving wouldn't be bad either, but you're a little deep for that. This raise to 6xBB is just in between, and really bad.

Postflop, who cares as long as the money goes in, but I like just shoving.

 

[Steveg1976]

He shoved on a flush board with two over cards to his pair and he is calling you a donk, I wouldn't worry about it.

also, nice check on the flop which totally set him up, well played imo other than preflop see c9's post for that.

 

[gns2003]

I don't know what kind of raises were folded to there in that tourney preflop. You want to make the standard preflop raise thats not called with KJ. Not the best hand, but worth a raise. Post flop he's just mad that you had the hand and he got caught shoving his chips away. I like your play overall. A little high preflop raise depending on normal play in that tourney. But generally good play overall (better to be over aggressive than under aggressive).

 

[ncscout]

There is no doubt to me who the donk is. I could see making a small bet in his place but not allin with the flush showing and him with just the 9. There were also cards over his 9s to pair. I think you slow played good after the flop. I like face cards suited myself but I can see why you didn't raise more preflop. With your chip stack the raise you made was a good percentage of your chips. Good hand and well played.

 

[DeNyd]

i love slow playing flushes...i usually always fold when a possible flush is on the board because i know other people use this strategy..kinda stinks cuz i know i get bluffed outa many pots!!

 

[KLock7]

I would've either made a smaller raise(4x the BB), pushed, or folded. You're raise was way too big. If you didn't hit the flop like you did, you would've been forced to fold and ship a chunk of your stack away. I think the word "DONK" is used way too much lately. The way it gets thrown around, apparently there isn't a single person who really knows how to play well.

 

[scragbag]

What was your P.O.A if villain shoved pre floppy? Fold? Call and coin flippin'? You commited far too much PF. I personally would never raise in this situation, we're basically raising with 40% of our stack left with a hand that is easily dominated. Next time take into consideration how much you're going to have left after your raise just incase you get shoved in cuz you commited yourself this hand.

As for post flop, meh villain should have checked folded tbf, that's what i'd probably do in that position but basically his semi bluff got called with the best hand. Does that make me far too passive?!?

 

[FatBasset]

To me it looks like you are the second shortest stack in a 9 man sng that's half way over. I agree with some of the previous posters that if a raise of 3-4 BB was taking down pots uncontested then that should have been your raise. Gives you chance to fold if re-raised. I'm not sure I would push pre-flop in this type of tourney because you will get called most of the time with any PP and any Ace. In this particular hand, I think your over raise pre-flop kept the villain from pushing because you had pot committed your self.

 

[ph_il]

Only a donk would call with 2nd nuts on that flop.

 

[jrosekcs]

Lol...the donk calling the smarter play "donk"...nice....he was stupid shoving his 9's post flop....if he was going to do that he should have done it preflop....woulda have most likely got you to fold that hand at that point....well played sir

 

[SystEmsuX]

I don't like either of your plays preflop. You raised too much, imo, and he probly should've reraised (or less preferably folded) instead of calling.

 

[brett987]

pocket 9s arent that good i will only raise that much if u have Kings and Aces....that was a very bad play by you

 

[bballbaust]

I think it was a pretty god play since you had the flush on the flop and he pushed with the the 3rd lowest pair. Don't see ne donk move in there

 

[gabstaeltoper]

preflop bet is too big imo, if a player reraise you, you often must call with the weakest hand

 

[Effexor]

Wow, your preflop play is horrible. Your M leve is 11, so I like a raise to about 275. Any more than that, and you're committing too much of your stack to really have much play postflop. Open shoving wouldn't be bad either, but you're a little deep for that. This raise to 6xBB is just in between, and really bad.

Postflop, who cares as long as the money goes in, but I like just shoving.

^^^ This ^^^

The PF raise was almost half your stack which was just terrible. Do you understand why?

On the flop I'd just shove it in, but the c/c was fine too. However you feel at the time is the best way to get as many chips into the middle

 

[E-Dub]

As the OP mentioned, he posed this same question on another poker BB and I replied there. I'll give the same response here -- pretty donktastic play preflop all things considered, OK value maximization after hitting your gin cards, even more donktastic play by the OP's opponent.

 

[kenef]

what donk move ?!!!

I don't see any other way to play this one, both pre flop and the slow play after.

Your stack was left with just about 15 blinds so KJ suited is a good hand to make a big pre flop raise with an eventual all in if someone re-raises.

This waas your hand. The donk is the guy who goes all in with pockets even after the flop covers him totally. :deal:

 

[scragbag]

I don't see any other way to play this one, both pre flop and the slow play after.

Your stack was left with just about 15 blinds so KJ suited is a good hand to make a big pre flop raise with an eventual all in if someone re-raises.

This waas your hand. The donk is the guy who goes all in with pockets even after the flop covers him totally. :deal:

Fold?

15bb in an SnG is fine, you only start worry about stacking with mediocore hands with 10bb or less. This hand played out perfectly this time, but over the long run, the variance will donkey punch you in the teeth playing hands like this OOP.

 

[kidkvno1]

Originally Posted by kenef
I don't see any other way to play this one, both pre flop and the slow play after.

Your stack was left with just about 15 blinds so KJ suited is a good hand to make a big pre flop raise with an eventual all in if someone re-raises.

This waas your hand. The donk is the guy who goes all in with pockets even after the flop covers him totally.

^^^ true
He was the donk pushing on a hand that he only had 4 outs to win it, great play. And pushers hate it when you trap them in to a hand.

 

[TiltMonkey999]

Haha..I don't see his point in calling you a donk why wouldnt you call with a suited J K..Thats a pre all in hand in some cases..But 99..He shouldnt be calling anyone a DONK except himself..he saw to high possible pairs than him and also..they were many more possibilities for a flush if another heart came up..He was trying to bluff at the pot and you caught him..Nice Move and you got him good..He's just upset..I wouldn't worry at all..Good Post
Take Care
Ray

 

[viking999]

Am I the only one who thinks that the villain's flop bet wasn't that bad? He has a pair and a flush draw. Usually, either the pair or the flush draw is live. He can't be up against AK, AJ, KJ (not of hearts), or a lower pair? Even if he's up against AQ, AA, or KK without a heart, he has 11 outs and should never be folding the flop even if you shove all-in (maybe for moving into the money, but this is 5 handed, not the bubble). There are only a couple of hands that have him crushed. Plus, the pot is 1550 and all-in was only 950 AND you were the one at risk, not him. I think his only mistake was not shoving preflop, which was admittedly a huge mistake.

And yeah, the preflop raise was atrocious. Do you ever get called by a hand you beat? And do you really need to raise 7x on a pure steal? 4x is usually more than enough. And I would usually do 3x.

 

[slycbnew]

Part of Josh's question is whether KJs is that bad a hand to play at a short handed table - like Viking, I see this as a steal attempt rather than a legitimate raising hand UTG even at 5 handed (what am I going to do in response to a re-raise/shove?), would see this as reasonable (maybe) on the button 5 handed in an unopened pot - like several others in this thread, I don't like the pf raise size, but I'm curious what others think about KJs UTG 5 handed?

 

[Halibel]

K-J preflop shorthanded is good, but not good enough to play it the way you played it.

especially being utg

 

[thetrimguy]

most of the time yes KJ is a horrible hand UTG but in your case i think you played it right depending on the info you have collected about your table can tell you most of the time if you made the right play i think that the gentalman donk in your case was just simply mads because he felt he should have won the pot GOOD PLAY