I need someone to explain to me if in this move was correct

jonaselloco

jonaselloco

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Hello friends
Well, first of all, I'd like to tell you that my style of play is average, let's say I don't consider myself to be an aggressive player or a weak one, rather I would say that I try to be a thinking player. But sometimes, like in this case, I get this kind of moves that I would need from a more experienced player who would tell me at least what I'm asking.

The situation is this... I am in a cash tournament in poker stars in which 1230 participants enter, hour and a half of the tournament there are 486 left and I am in position 236, the minimum payment of the tournament was in position 72 if I remember correctly so let's just say it was fine.

In one hand I'm in the big blind, let's say my stack was 8 big blinds. One in middle position opens with 1 blind, the one in small blind calls his half blind and I decide to check.

My hand was :5c4::4d4: really just a checking hand. The flop is :5h4::4s4::6d4:. The one with the small blind bets 1 blind to which I, without waiting for the one in middle position to act, just paying to see a draw, I raise 2 blinds. The one in middle position folds and the one in the small blind calls only.
At that time, when raising the bet, I had in mind that my opponent could have either a higher pair than the flop cards or a possible straight draw since there was no flush draw.

On the turn the card is a :qd4: which my opponent checks and I decide to go all in with my remaining 6 blinds. My opponent thinks and then calls. His cards were :10c4::10s4:. He only had 3 possibilities, that another 10 would come up, that a Q or a 6 would come up on the river, otherwise if this didn't happen the hand was mine.

River card..... :6h4: ....... community :5h4::4s4::6d4::qd4::6h4:..........The :10c4::10s4:...... I :5c4:.:4d4:..... .. Consequence ...... I went to have a snack hahahaha :mad:

Let's say that it is not a play that happens to me every day but it usually happens to me quite often and precisely me being in the big blind..... Many times the play goes well and many times it goes wrong.

That's why I come back to my question..... Did I play well??? I played bad??? My opponent was lucky????

What would you have done in this same situation?

Tell me to continue learning, despite playing years ago one day by day continues to learn.

A hug for everyone from Algarrobo - argentina 🇦🇬
 
Gritz18

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Here are my thoughts:
1 - I believe that in this situation you didn't play completely wrong, I would have just done something different, since you were short on chips and the board came wet on the flop, I would have gone all-in before the tuner, not to give the opportunity villain's hand to improve.
2 - The villain of the pair of 10, played wrong, I don't know how much he had in chips, but he had to make a reise, or depending on how many chips he had gone all-in.
3 - If the villain of the pair of 10 had more chips than you, most of the time it always beats the card of the villain who has more chips, the poker site doesn't want the tournament to last too long.
It's just my opinion, I don't own the truth, just what I see daily on the tables.
I wish you luck, may you get good results at the tables.
 
Luvepoker

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To be honest I agree with Gritz, You did not play completely wrong here but I would have played it differently. The SB did not play this hand very well tho.

The flop is wet and not very good for hands like tens. Assuming there are antes at this point there were 4 BB in the pot and 5 after the SB bets the flop. The SB could have smaller pairs top pair and alot of straight draws here. I would have jammed all in on the flop to either take down a nice pot compared to our stack size or get all there chips in now. You bottom 2 pair is nice but its venerable for sure.

As for the guy with tens. 1st error was not raising the limper. 2nd was that super small bet. I understand his call of you min bet but even there its strange move but by the time that turn hit and then you jam what did he really think he was beating there.
 
kunkgreen

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Given the size of your stack, I don't think there's room for mini-bets, or working around it.
I believe that the shove would be the best option, as it would be called with worse hands (2overs and the like), or it could even cause overpairs to fold due to their flop connection. (of course it depends if your remaining 7bb is significant for the other players in the situation)

I agree with the others above on the rest too!


I hate it when they force me into a hand with limpers and an enveloping flop comes.
I haven't analyzed my game yet, but I'm sure there's going to be a huge leak there.
I mean, we should defend the bb (in this case it wasn't even a defense but) many times, but I always feel vulnerable in these situations, where after surviving for so long in the tournament I let myself go for a marginal hand in the bb and that still connected to the flop to ultimately lose.
It doesn't always happen, but it sucks when it does!

...ahh and of course your opponent got lucky too. But until he had some 'good' outs.
 
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fundiver199

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Your flop raise was to small. But with a stack this short, all the chips have to go in on the turn, so line wise you played the hand fine. Just as a general rule of thump, whenever you get your chips in with more than 50% equity, there is usually no reason to worry about having done something wrong. Sometimes the winning hand will change on the flop, turn or river, and thats simply part of the game.
 
jonaselloco

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Here are my thoughts:
1 - I believe that in this situation you didn't play completely wrong, I would have just done something different, since you were short on chips and the board came wet on the flop, I would have gone all-in before the tuner, not to give the opportunity villain's hand to improve.
2 - The villain of the pair of 10, played wrong, I don't know how much he had in chips, but he had to make a reise, or depending on how many chips he had gone all-in.
3 - If the villain of the pair of 10 had more chips than you, most of the time it always beats the card of the villain who has more chips, the poker site doesn't want the tournament to last too long.
It's just my opinion, I don't own the truth, just what I see daily on the tables.
I wish you luck, may you get good results at the tables.
Hello brother, thank you very much for your answer.
Yes, I think the same as you, I think I didn't play bad at all
Your thought of all in is very positive, at a certain moment I also thought of going all in when I saw the flop, well I will take into account your teaching
If the villain doubles my stack, you may be right on the issue that the system doesn't care about tournaments being too long and kicking the short stack out of the game. I hadn't thought about it because I still believe in a certain transparency in the system, but you may be right.
A big hug
 
Gallarado777

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there is a program for this you need to download and it will show your errors
 
jonaselloco

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To be honest I agree with Gritz, You did not play completely wrong here but I would have played it differently. The SB did not play this hand very well tho.

The flop is wet and not very good for hands like tens. Assuming there are antes at this point there were 4 BB in the pot and 5 after the SB bets the flop. The SB could have smaller pairs top pair and alot of straight draws here. I would have jammed all in on the flop to either take down a nice pot compared to our stack size or get all there chips in now. You bottom 2 pair is nice but its venerable for sure.

As for the guy with tens. 1st error was not raising the limper. 2nd was that super small bet. I understand his call of you min bet but even there its strange move but by the time that turn hit and then you jam what did he really think he was beating there.
Hello brother thanks for your answer.
If in truth, as I said to Gritz, with whom I also agree a lot, the way the SB really plays means that I am disoriented.
I on a 10 10 in SB minimally raise up to a 3bet having only two opponents, a BB and the middle one who called.
Let's say he played a hand that could have cost him dearly had the 6 not come on the river.
In truth, the call made by the SB was very risky and nothing more than that went well for him.
I take into account your advice about the all in when seeing the flop the same thing that Gritz told me
A big hug
 
jonaselloco

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Given the size of your stack, I don't think there's room for mini-bets, or working around it.
I believe that the shove would be the best option, as it would be called with worse hands (2overs and the like), or it could even cause overpairs to fold due to their flop connection. (of course it depends if your remaining 7bb is significant for the other players in the situation)

I agree with the others above on the rest too!


I hate it when they force me into a hand with limpers and an enveloping flop comes.
I haven't analyzed my game yet, but I'm sure there's going to be a huge leak there.
I mean, we should defend the bb (in this case it wasn't even a defense but) many times, but I always feel vulnerable in these situations, where after surviving for so long in the tournament I let myself go for a marginal hand in the bb and that still connected to the flop to ultimately lose.
It doesn't always happen, but it sucks when it does!

...ahh and of course your opponent got lucky too. But until he had some 'good' outs.
Hello brother thanks for the answer
If you really, Luve and Gritz agree on my low bet on the turn concept to take into account for me.
You and I also agree that the SB did not play well with 1010
You're right, these forced BB hands bother me too with cards that one in another condition than SB or BB would discard, and well you have to play them although I would sincerely prefer not to play them hahaha :) they would avoid headaches in the future.
A big hug
 
hilary antonik filho

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I also agree with Gritz, on the flop I would go all-inn, I wouldn't give chance to bad luck
 
BelFish

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It would be a lesson to him (your opponent) if he lost with his tt without shoving against a stack of less than 12BB ))

If you ever find yourself in an opponent's position in a similar spot, then simply shov your hand (which is eligible for shoving in this position according to the push/fold chart) with an effective stack of less than 12BB.
 
jonaselloco

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there is a program for this you need to download and it will show your errors
Hello brother thanks for the answer
Do you know of any particular program?
Greetings from Algarrobo - Argentina
 
jonaselloco

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I also agree with Gritz, on the flop I would go all-inn, I wouldn't give chance to bad luck
Hello brother thanks for your answer.
If more than less you agree with all the other guys who helped me interpret this play.
The automatic play when seeing the flop was all-in and let him think hahahaha :)
A big hug and greetings
 
jonaselloco

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Your flop raise was to small. But with a stack this short, all the chips have to go in on the turn, so line wise you played the hand fine. Just as a general rule of thump, whenever you get your chips in with more than 50% equity, there is usually no reason to worry about having done something wrong. Sometimes the winning hand will change on the flop, turn or river, and thats simply part of the game.
Hello brother thanks for your answer
If what you say is consistent with the rest of the friends, that my stack was to go with all the pieces inside and then the villain thinks.
Thank you for your advice and your reading of the game
A big hug and greetings :)
 
jonaselloco

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It would be a lesson to him (your opponent) if he lost with his tt without shoving against a stack of less than 12BB ))

If you ever find yourself in an opponent's position in a similar spot, then simply shov your hand (which is eligible for shoving in this position according to the push/fold chart) with an effective stack of less than 12BB.
Hello brother thanks for your answer.
If seeing it as if I were on my opponent's side with those cards and in that position I always raise my hand to 2bet or 3bet with more reason as the play came was to do it.
Although just today I was reading an article in which a great player explained how in these times there are many new players who limp or call limp in different positions at the table and he said that the risk was enormous and that he has even seen it done with :ks4::kh4: or :ad4::ac4: hands to get a big return many times. And he said that those hands end up being a big headache for most of those who make those simple calls with hands that could get great benefits. He said that for him it was too passive a game.
But anyway, just thank you for your advice brother and at least know that my play was not so bad hahaha :)
Greetings and a big hug
 
mushthebush

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Awkward hand and trully awkward spot. Unlucky is all I can say. Wrong place at the wrong time.

I would've also gone all in on the flop or fold. Tough to fold two pair.
 
eetenor

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Hello friends
Well, first of all, I'd like to tell you that my style of play is average, let's say I don't consider myself to be an aggressive player or a weak one, rather I would say that I try to be a thinking player. But sometimes, like in this case, I get this kind of moves that I would need from a more experienced player who would tell me at least what I'm asking.

The situation is this... I am in a cash tournament in poker stars in which 1230 participants enter, hour and a half of the tournament there are 486 left and I am in position 236, the minimum payment of the tournament was in position 72 if I remember correctly so let's just say it was fine.

In one hand I'm in the big blind, let's say my stack was 8 big blinds. One in middle position opens with 1 blind, the one in small blind calls his half blind and I decide to check.

My hand was :5c4::4d4: really just a checking hand. The flop is :5h4::4s4::6d4:. The one with the small blind bets 1 blind to which I, without waiting for the one in middle position to act, just paying to see a draw, I raise 2 blinds. The one in middle position folds and the one in the small blind calls only.
At that time, when raising the bet, I had in mind that my opponent could have either a higher pair than the flop cards or a possible straight draw since there was no flush draw.

On the turn the card is a :qd4: which my opponent checks and I decide to go all in with my remaining 6 blinds. My opponent thinks and then calls. His cards were :10c4::10s4:. He only had 3 possibilities, that another 10 would come up, that a Q or a 6 would come up on the river, otherwise if this didn't happen the hand was mine.

River card..... :6h4: ....... community :5h4::4s4::6d4::qd4::6h4:..........The :10c4::10s4:...... I :5c4:.:4d4:..... .. Consequence ...... I went to have a snack hahahaha :mad:

Let's say that it is not a play that happens to me every day but it usually happens to me quite often and precisely me being in the big blind..... Many times the play goes well and many times it goes wrong.

That's why I come back to my question..... Did I play well??? I played bad??? My opponent was lucky????

What would you have done in this same situation?

Tell me to continue learning, despite playing years ago one day by day continues to learn.

A hug for everyone from Algarrobo - Argentina 🇦🇬
To study this hand we have to break down each action we made and ask why would we do one thing over another- Preflop call is 100% correct
Flop why min raise? What is a min raise used for most of the time? Was this the spot to use that sizing? What range of hands were we targeting with a min raise- Min raises are used to confuse our V-did we need to do that with an 8bb stack? Will the V call with a wide range if we shove? If the V leads a draw but then folds it to the shove is that not a good thing? this is just a cooler- as others said you shove flop and lose to the TT as it is never folding but neither is a 7x hand or A6 etc
 
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