Is this a horrible move to make? (busted out on bluff)

[zilzizuzaz]

-5.50 9-player sng.

-4 players remaining

-blinds 40/80

-I'm BB, with 3300 in chips (short stack was 2700)

-holding K10o

-button raises with 4200 in chips or so

-he's literally raised the button every opportunity he's had to do so in this spot. He raises 3xbb, i re-raise (this is where I figure the most critical mistake was made) to 650 wanting to end the hand right there.

-he calls, flop comes QQ5, I shove utg, and he calls with KQ.

Side-note: the shortstack after the hand typed "rofl" to which I replied: "someone is excited to win 4 bucks", to which he replied: "nah, just funny cuz you sukkk".

Three hands later (I continued to watch the table), he busts out bluffing off his entire stack with jack high on the turn.
dbags name on carbonpoker is (mod edit: name removed)

 

[horizon12]

Few did not understand hand...

Only understand what you need preflop fold KTo and in flop not bluffing , only check/fold or standart bet 30% of the pot...

 

[RamdeeBen]

If he's raising so often on the BTN, you want to keep in his dominated range of hands. We shouldn't be bluffing with KTo in this spot imo, especially when in BB, closing the action taking the hand heads up and we're getting a better price. Calling seems the correct play.

Your shove on the flop is beyond terrible. What are you trying to achieve with it? Given how dry the board is, you rep nothing. You would never shove with a value hand and certainly wouldn't shove with trip Q's...so yeah basically I just call as wide as A high in this spot if you take this line vs me.

Even though I don't like your 3B pre flop your biggest mistake is the flop shove as opposed to your 3B pre, not the other way around.

 

[okeedokalee]

Against players who are loose by all means become a calling station, but re-raising I believe to be a mistake because you were betting all-in and risking the $4 on what at best was a perhaps 60-40, a guy that loose was calling wide but there were still many hands he could have had that were ahead of your k/10u.

 

[WiZZiM]

If you feel the need to play back here. An alternate to 3betting is to call and check raise or donk bet the flop. Both are cheaper and effective.

As played. Raise to max 500 preflop and half pot the flop. No need to risk our entire tournament here at 40/80 with so much time left...


The only other thing left to mention is that vs loose openers hands like kt have real value postflop and are likely more profitable to play by just flatting. 3bet value hands and mix in a few hands that dont have value in flat calling like 85o or whatever. These hands play just like the kt but you dont get attached to it as much postflop.

The reason why flatting hands like kt can be good vs loose openers is that if we 3bet we fold out things like t8 k6s etc. So have a think about your ranges you really should have default ranges that you can go to for loose openers and tight players as well. If you want me to provide a few examples or if this is not clear let me know

 

[WiZZiM]

If he's raising so often on the BTN, you want to keep in his dominated range of hands. We shouldn't be bluffing with KTo in this spot imo, especially when in BB, closing the action taking the hand heads up and we're getting a better price. Calling seems the correct play.

Your shove on the flop is beyond terrible. What are you trying to achieve with it? Given how dry the board is, you rep nothing. You would never shove with a value hand and certainly wouldn't shove with trip Q's...so yeah basically I just call as wide as A high in this spot if you take this line vs me.

Even though I don't like your 3B pre flop your biggest mistake is the flop shove as opposed to your 3B pre, not the other way around.

Bah. I really need to read the posts before I post.. basically said the same thing as (ram?)...

 

[Jacki Burkhart]

Agree with WiZZiM and Poker Ben.

KT has enough value to flat and then bluff catch if you catch a piece of the flop, or donk if you miss.

The other thing I'd add is that the bubble of a SnG is a time when "First in Aggression" has a lot of value. Sometimes even if you know exactly what a big stack LAG is up to, you can't really do anything about it with less than a premium hand because they "got the jump on you" so to speak. ICM makes it such that first one to try to win the pot usually does, unless 2 monster hands clash...

In this particular spot, because you're deep enough (sorta, for a SnG) and you don't want to just let him run you over, you could flat pre, donk the flop and then fold to his next show of aggression.

 

[hffjd2000]

Not knowing the result, I would rather pass from the start.

 

[jj20002]

well maybe the outcome was undesirable, but the way you played was OK, you were representing a low pair or Ax if the flop were came JJ5 instead of QQ5 i could bet the villain had fold and you had won the pot but unfortunately he got the trips (unless he had 55 or any other pair or AK i dont see other hand he had paid you and coming from a LAG who is playing a lot of hands like KQ, which is a great hand to open but not a pair and not Ax)

 

[JaxA]

If he's raising so often on the BTN, you want to keep in his dominated range of hands. We shouldn't be bluffing with KTo in this spot imo, especially when in BB, closing the action taking the hand heads up and we're getting a better price. Calling seems the correct play.

Your shove on the flop is beyond terrible. What are you trying to achieve with it? Given how dry the board is, you rep nothing. You would never shove with a value hand and certainly wouldn't shove with trip Q's...so yeah basically I just call as wide as A high in this spot if you take this line vs me.

Even though I don't like your 3B pre flop your biggest mistake is the flop shove as opposed to your 3B pre, not the other way around.

This is a better worded version of the answer I was going give. Lol

 

[CactusCat]

Generally any move where you get it in drawing stone cold dead or to backdoor straight is horrible. Also, the crassness of the bluff - just open-shoving on a dry board first to act once called, isn't that great. The Raymer Stop and Go play just looks like a desperation move.

I think 3-betting preflop is fine *with* the intention of ending the hand right there.

But the heck happened on the flop? You said you wanted to end the hand right there, then tooled out with a shove. Not even a c-bet.

If you had check-called then checkraised all in on the turn or river, it'd at least have been a more elegant and sensible bluff consistent with a slowplayed queen or an overpair with a higher likelihood of generating folds. Then I don't think it would have been as bad a move even though he happened to have a queen this time.

Even though he had a wide range and was extremely active, once he *calls* your 3-bet, at that point you should give him a real hand. All pocket pairs higher than 5s and AJ are calling.

Also, K10 plays well postflop. If you're taking a stand, I'd look to call him, make a decent top pair, and call him down. In this case, you were dominated, but it would have been no fault of yours if you hit a king and busted.

The shortstack busting on jack high you mocked made a much better and understandable play. He's short - if he gives up on the pot with, relative to him, a high stack to pot ratio, he's done. If there's even a 10% chance he takes the pot down he has to take the shot. Plus, he made his move on the turn rather than panic-shoving the flop when he missed.

When great players go out on a bluff, they do it in a calculated manner. They price themselves in by getting dead money into the pot before they shove, and this requires more than one street.

 

[KUN_AGUERO_KROOS]

yeah, it was a bad play. I`ve done this kind of play many times. You know the guy is raising with nothing and you want to do sth about it. But the thing is that you didn`t have to do that. U had more than 40bb, you need to learn to control the pot size