$.75 NLHE MTT: $.75 NLHE : Should villain be calling my 3bet here?

[tzuriel]

Hand History driven straight to this forum with DriveHUD Poker Tracking Software

KK doesn't come very often. He's been calling/raising with A-rag all day and when he calls my 3bet pre I assume he's got another Ax hand that he can't fold. 2 Queens on the flop make it less likely that he has AQ here and he probably 4bets PF with a hand like that. I am only worried about QJ, QT, maybe Q9 with this guy. Holding KK I didn't think he would have KQ.

I thought my Cbet was pretty standard but the flop was really unlucky as it turns out.

Would you have played this differently? Is calling a 3bet PF with QJo standard or ultra-loose? Granted, I am on the BTN so maybe he thought I was trying to steal. I think I would play this the same next time, though. Is that the right play?

I'm not even sure I would have raised PF with QJo like he did.

I think I made the right decision and it was just a bad runout.

NL Holdem $0.71+$0.07 (900.00BB)
EP ($88932)
MP ($203997)
HJ ($49885)
CO ($90604)
HERO ($103632)
SB ($54195)
BB ($60564)
UTG ($109228)

Dealt to Hero: K♦ K♣

UTG Raises To $1915, EP Folds, MP Folds, HJ Folds, CO Folds, HERO Raises To $7315, SB Folds, BB Folds, UTG Calls $5400

Hero SPR on Flop: [5.78 effective]
Flop ($16670): 4♠ Q♣ Q♠
UTG Checks, HERO Bets $13802 (Rem. Stack: $82515), UTG Raises To $101913 (allin), HERO Calls $82515 (allin)

Turn ($214900): 4♠ Q♣ Q♠ A♦

River ($214900): 4♠ Q♣ Q♠ A♦ T♦

Spoiler

UTG shows: J♥ Q♦

UTG wins: $209304

 

[eetenor]

Hand History driven straight to this forum with DriveHUD Poker Tracking Software

KK doesn't come very often. He's been calling/raising with A-rag all day and when he calls my 3bet pre I assume he's got another Ax hand that he can't fold. 2 Queens on the flop make it less likely that he has AQ here and he probably 4bets PF with a hand like that. I am only worried about QJ, QT, maybe Q9 with this guy. Holding KK I didn't think he would have KQ.

I thought my Cbet was pretty standard but the flop was really unlucky as it turns out.

Would you have played this differently? Is calling a 3bet PF with QJo standard or ultra-loose? Granted, I am on the BTN so maybe he thought I was trying to steal. I think I would play this the same next time, though. Is that the right play?

I'm not even sure I would have raised PF with QJo like he did.

I think I made the right decision and it was just a bad runout.

NL Holdem $0.71+$0.07 (900.00BB)
EP ($88932)
MP ($203997)
HJ ($49885)
CO ($90604)
HERO ($103632)
SB ($54195)
BB ($60564)
UTG ($109228)

Dealt to Hero: K♦ K♣

UTG Raises To $1915, EP Folds, MP Folds, HJ Folds, CO Folds, HERO Raises To $7315, SB Folds, BB Folds, UTG Calls $5400

Hero SPR on Flop: [5.78 effective]
Flop ($16670): 4♠ Q♣ Q♠
UTG Checks, HERO Bets $13802 (Rem. Stack: $82515), UTG Raises To $101913 (allin), HERO Calls $82515 (allin)

Turn ($214900): 4♠ Q♣ Q♠ A♦

River ($214900): 4♠ Q♣ Q♠ A♦ T♦

Spoiler

UTG shows: J♥ Q♦

UTG wins: $209304

Thank you for posting.

Why would you think that sizing was standard on that board?

Our 3 bet says we have AA KK QQ AK AQ in our range. So if the Villain has worse why would they call?

We want the V to call so we bet small not 80% pot. We also want to protect vs a Q so again small bet. Only an A is an over card -that is a 3 outer so we do not need to protect with a big bet.

The V could have 44 there and AA and many Qx because you are so deep preflop.

When we 3 bet the above range and our V check shoves our flop bet how likely are they bluffing?

Hope this helps

 

[fundiver199]

Preflop
3-betting KK is obviously the standard play, and sizing is fine as well.

Flop
This is a very dry board. Sure a flushdraw is present, but they tend to matter less in 3-bet pots, because ranges are supposed to be pocket pair heavy. And other than the possibility, our opponent could have a flushdraw, this is a classic way ahead or way behind spot. Either they binked the flop with a QX hand or 44, and then we are toast drawing to 2 outs. Or they dont have any of those hands, and then they have 2-3 outs at most. So as Eatenor say, we want to use a small betsizing here like no more than 40% pot at the most. A size, where maybe they feel, they have to peal one with their AJ, and they certainly wont fold a pocket pair.

We never want to create a situation in poker, where we are betting for value, but if we get action, we are not doing well. And while we will probably be ahead of the range, that call even a large flop bet, are we also ahead, if we bet again on the turn and river? Probably not so our hand is simply not strong enough to start building such a large pot. We could even check behind here to induce bluff, if we are playing against a spewy individual.

We do go large though, and now the Villain check-jam for around 2 times the pot. You need around 40% equity to break even in pure chip EV, so it boils down to, how spewy they are. Are they able to show up here with a hand like JJ and play it like this? If the best case scenerio is, that we are up against the nut flushdraw, then this is a fold, because then we are either crushed or against a hand with 12 outs, and we are simply not getting a good enough price.

In general I will say, that massive overbets in the micros tend to be for value, so I think, our default here should definitely be to fold. Yes its annoying to fold to a maniac, but even maniacs can make a hand, and if he is calling our 3-bet to wide, that actually put more QX in his range. So while he has more air, he also have more value, we lose to, and that is probably the more important factor here.

 

[tzuriel]

I have so much more work to do to get better at this game. Thanks for the continued patience and advice eetenor and fundiver!

 

[Sidetracked]

UTG played his hand atrociously badly. QJo to a good sized 3 bet out of position. What can you say? He hit gin and got your stack. Bummer, but invite him to a cash game table and get your $ back.

 

[zuker]

Easy fold after push on paired board.
Don`t try to understand fishes` mind. Their ranges, reasons ans so on. Just play stright.