$1 NLHE MTT Deep Stacked: turned top pair on a limped pot, am I overplaying my hand?

[tewwa94]

$1 NLHE MTT Deep Stacked: turned top pair on a limped pot, am I overplaying my hand?

I am ready to give up on the flop if it shows some aggresion, but I think on the turn there are so many flush draws and weaker aces. I think a 6, considering is a limped pot would bet right away since the pot is already somewhat wet.

PokerStars - 10/20 Ante 3 NL - Holdem - 8 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

MP: 73.9 BB
MP+1: 65.05 BB
CO: 165.15 BB
Hero (BTN): 72.4 BB
SB: 69.4 BB
BB: 74.4 BB
UTG: 81.2 BB
UTG+1: 73.5 BB

8 players post ante of 0.15 BB, SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 2.7 BB) Hero has A:heart: K:heart:

fold, fold, fold, MP+1 calls 1 BB, CO calls 1 BB, Hero raises to 5 BB, fold, BB calls 4 BB, MP+1 calls 4 BB, CO calls 4 BB

Flop: (21.7 BB, 4 players) 6:spade: 6:club: 4:spade:
BB checks, MP+1 checks, CO checks, Hero checks

Turn: (21.7 BB, 4 players) A:club:
BB bets 10.85 BB, MP+1 calls 10.85 BB, CO calls 10.85 BB, Hero raises to 67.25 BB and is all-in, BB raises to 69.25 BB and is all-in, MP+1 calls 49.05 BB and is all-in, fold

River: (226.95 BB, 3 players) K:diamond:

Hero wins 226.95 BB

 

[300HPGOD]

Pre flop raise sizing is fine but I would not go any smaller than that amount. On the flop, villains could be just checking to the raiser and I think checking is fine but I also think betting here is fine too to attempt to at least get heads up going to the turn. Draw arent going to fold but you might actually get 77 or 88 to at least consider folding in this spot. Factoring in no one bet before you I would doubt any player has a pocket pair anyway. I would not bet large but getting a random (if a random hand would call a 5x raise) hand like J10 to fold here has some value for equity denial. If you get raised then it is an easy fold. Do want to emphasize that checking is fine though and depending on opponents, I would check here but against villains I dont know and this board, I like trying to rep a big pair here and I would never check on this board in this spot with a hand like QQ.

On the turn when there is a lead and a caller I would put villains on a draw or Ax and there are potentially some monster hands slow playing in there as well. Raising as big as you did should make all Ax hands fold and draws fold since they are priced out leaving only the monsters to call. I totally get the argument of charging the draws and getting value from worse Axs but 44, 56 suited, 67 suited if a loose table is not out if the realm of possibilities here and worse hands should fold even though they may not. I think I prefer just calling here even though you are leaving some value on the table for this street. However, worse Ax should barrel on river where you can most likely call given the card that comes. The draws do get somewhat of a value but the bet was half pot which is at least charging them somewhat. If it was a smaller lead bet by the villain I would be on the raise train but I am going with only calling here.

 

[fundiver199]

Preflop
Isolation size is fine. Getting 3 callers is a bit "OMG", but I guess, its sign of a good game.

Flop
Against 3 or more opponents we should not be C-betting light. Its just to likely, someone has something, they want to continue with. So totally on board with checking back. Its also important to note, that if someone has a 6, you are essentially drawing dead already.

Turn
You improve to top pair, but you still lose to a 6, and everyone stills wants to play. This is actually a pretty tough spot. However I do feel, we can begin to discount 6X just a little bit, since the lead from BB was somewhat small, and the other two guys just called. Maybe BB can have it, but would the other two guys not have put in a raise on a board with two flushdraws? So I am not going to fold here, and I guess, I can get on board with jamming hoping, that they all have some kind of draw or a worse AX hand.

 

[daddybrooks]

Good analysis already, so don't really need to go into that any further, other than if it was me in that situation, when the BB jammed all in behind me I would for sure be sweating the draw and praying he didn't call with some crap with a 6. Glad you walked away with it, but if you don't mind, i would like to hear what BB and MP+1 thought was worth chasing with? My guess is that BB had flush draw and MP+1 had either a middle pair like 10's or J's or just got caught out with A,x of some sort, but like i said, just curious.

 

[eetenor]

I am ready to give up on the flop if it shows some aggresion, but I think on the turn there are so many flush draws and weaker aces. I think a 6, considering is a limped pot would bet right away since the pot is already somewhat wet.

PokerStars - 10/20 Ante 3 NL - Holdem - 8 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

MP: 73.9 BB
MP+1: 65.05 BB
CO: 165.15 BB
Hero (BTN): 72.4 BB
SB: 69.4 BB
BB: 74.4 BB
UTG: 81.2 BB
UTG+1: 73.5 BB

8 players post ante of 0.15 BB, SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 2.7 BB) Hero has A♥ K♥

fold, fold, fold, MP+1 calls 1 BB, CO calls 1 BB, Hero raises to 5 BB, fold, BB calls 4 BB, MP+1 calls 4 BB, CO calls 4 BB

Flop: (21.7 BB, 4 players) 6♠ 6♣ 4♠
BB checks, MP+1 checks, CO checks, Hero checks

Turn: (21.7 BB, 4 players) A♣
BB bets 10.85 BB, MP+1 calls 10.85 BB, CO calls 10.85 BB, Hero raises to 67.25 BB and is all-in, BB raises to 69.25 BB and is all-in, MP+1 calls 49.05 BB and is all-in, fold

River: (226.95 BB, 3 players) K♦

Hero wins 226.95 BB

Thank you for posting

The dynamics of the preflop betting vs weak players does not preclude a player with 6x checking. This player type might expect you to bet flop with AA-JJ and think that they need to check raise big to protect 6x 4 ways on this flop.

Hope this helps

 

[azforlife]

Pre flop raise sizing is fine but I would not go any smaller than that amount. On the flop, villains could be just checking to the raiser and I think checking is fine but I also think betting here is fine too to attempt to at least get heads up going to the turn. Draw arent going to fold but you might actually get 77 or 88 to at least consider folding in this spot. Factoring in no one bet before you I would doubt any player has a pocket pair anyway. I would not bet large but getting a random (if a random hand would call a 5x raise) hand like J10 to fold here has some value for equity denial. If you get raised then it is an easy fold. Do want to emphasize that checking is fine though and depending on opponents, I would check here but against villains I dont know and this board, I like trying to rep a big pair here and I would never check on this board in this spot with a hand like QQ.

On the turn when there is a lead and a caller I would put villains on a draw or Ax and there are potentially some monster hands slow playing in there as well. Raising as big as you did should make all Ax hands fold and draws fold since they are priced out leaving only the monsters to call. I totally get the argument of charging the draws and getting value from worse Axs but 44, 56 suited, 67 suited if a loose table is not out if the realm of possibilities here and worse hands should fold even though they may not. I think I prefer just calling here even though you are leaving some value on the table for this street. However, worse Ax should barrel on river where you can most likely call given the card that comes. The draws do get somewhat of a value but the bet was half pot which is at least charging them somewhat. If it was a smaller lead bet by the villain I would be on the raise train but I am going with only calling here.

Good insight but your reason for flatting on the turn is not sound & I highly disagree! Going by your own analysis, a bet that keeps the Ax in & draws in is more optimal, disagree with the allin by OP as well

 

[300HPGOD]

Good insight but your reason for flatting on the turn is not sound & I highly disagree! Going by your own analysis, a bet that keeps the Ax in & draws in is more optimal, disagree with the allin by OP as well

You have a point but going to the turn we are 65 BBs effective roughly. With 10BBs already bet what sizing can we make that is not committing to us? Its why I think this spot is a jam it all in or just call spot and I dont like jamming as that will make Ax and draws fold. We could min raise I guess here but that is not deterring any draws behind us and then leaves us in a tricky spot when the draw does come in on the river. When we call, its passive yes but I feel like we can also hit the ejector button easier too. Min raising is not really charging the draws either (although I concede the point to you that we get some more value from it if that whats they have).

I feel like if we are going against Ax that Ax probably needs to be somewhat of a decent kicker for villain to call both turn and river bet from us with it (maybe giving villains too much credit) so I feel like if we call turn and draw comes in we can ditch this hand with less pain and when the draw does not come in we can still get a street of value from any Ax that is out there. I want to be clear though I am not dismissing your point as there are valid reasons to raise here I just believe the stack depth is the key in this hand so if we are raising it would make the most sense to just go with it.

 

[63burner]

Restraint, no overplaying.

Got AK suited, and didn't go crazy and try to isolate, or force anything, that's some good poker. Paired the K, and didn't over-bet. In my eyes you didn't overplay at all; it was well played.

 

[theANMATOR]

Played well until the spaz out overbet jam on the turn - you got lucky this time - next time you will run into a naked 6, 6/4s (unlikely) or even 44s

 

[theANMATOR]

Also one other thing - you must not be converting the hands correctly - the opponents holdings are not listed in this thread nor your other ones.

 

[theANMATOR]

** incorrectly