$1 NLHE MTT: $1 45man, ATo semi FT - fold or call?

[chakalaka]

pokerstars, $0.91 + $0.09 - Hold'em No Limit - 60/120 (15 ante) - 8 players
Replay this hand on CardsChat

UTG: 616 (5 bb)
UTG+1: 3,457 (29 bb)
MP: 870 (7 bb)
MP+1: 1,434 (12 bb)
CO: 1,253 (10 bb)
BU (Hero): 2,708 (23 bb)
SB: 3,409 (28 bb)
BB: 1,572 (13 bb)

Pre-Flop: (300) Hero is BTN with A♣ T♥
5 players fold, Hero raises to 240, 1 fold, BB 3-bets to 1,557 (all-in), Hero calls 1,317

Hi guys!

I put this hand to ICMizer and it shows me that I should call like 3,5% JJ+, AQs+, AKo+ and is it correct or I marked something wrong?

 

[jaworek1405]

Hello, I play these sit and go for 1$ on 45 players like you. Every option is possible, even tight fold pre flop can be good. I usually make tight fold in situation like this, because on the big blind is player who is a short stack, he has about 13bb and it is a great situation to go allin against raise from the button. In these tournaments are many aggressive players who in situation like this they will go allin against your raise from the button. I play these tournaments everyday and I know that very often players will go allin in this situation like this. So one option is tight fold pre flop. Second option is raise and later fold won't be a big mistake, because his allin is for about 50% of your stack and he has some folding equity on you. On the other hand if you have less than 20bb in stack the best option is allin pre flop and win the blinds. GL

 

[Esmir]

Hello!
In this situation, we must solve several problems.
1.What range of big blinds will allin go with (in fact, the range of hands is not that great)
2. Do we want to see a coin flip?

ICMizer is right, the decision is borderline, with a small fold advantage, about 0.65%.

What have you decided?

 

[chakalaka]

Hello, I play these sit and go for 1$ on 45 players like you. Every option is possible, even tight fold pre flop can be good. I usually make tight fold in situation like this, because on the big blind is player who is a short stack, he has about 13bb and it is a great situation to go allin against raise from the button. In these tournaments are many aggressive players who in situation like this they will go allin against your raise from the button. I play these tournaments everyday and I know that very often players will go allin in this situation like this. So one option is tight fold pre flop. Second option is raise and later fold won't be a big mistake, because his allin is for about 50% of your stack and he has some folding equity on you. On the other hand if you have less than 20bb in stack the best option is allin pre flop and win the blinds. GL

Thanks! So almost everything is good decision? What I see on these sng that players are so incredible tight! Even with 10bb they or/fold which is something new and strange for me. Is it a new concept? I didn't know it, maybe because of break.

By the way - I didn't see you yesterday I think

 

[chakalaka]

Hello!
In this situation, we must solve several problems.
1.What range of big blinds will allin go with (in fact, the range of hands is not that great)
2. Do we want to see a coin flip?

ICMizer is right, the decision is borderline, with a small fold advantage, about 0.65%.

What have you decided?

Hi!

1. I see his shoving range like this: 22+,A2s+,K9s+,QJs,A2o+,KJo+,QJo but maybe I'm wrong.
2. Do we? We are 13 effective bb, so we still have a chips even if we lost. You prefer in this spot just fold?

I decided to call he showed me total s**t.

 

[fundiver199]

You must put ICMizer into MTT mode. Otherwise the program will assume, you are on the final table, and in a 45 man 8 players left is the actual bubble. So this is why, the NASH equilibrium will show very tight ranges. In this situation however there were still multible tables left, and then ATo is a sigh call given positions and stack sizes. You are not thrilled, he jammed, but calling is a less bad option than folding.

 

[Esmir]

Hi!

1. I see his shoving range like this: 22+,A2s+,K9s+,QJs,A2o+,KJo+,QJo but maybe I'm wrong.
2. Do we? We are 13 effective bb, so we still have a chips even if we lost. You prefer in this spot just fold?

I decided to call he showed me total s**t.

I'm sure you made the right decision, in a similar situation I called too.

 

[VovanBaron]

I think this call is quite good but it can be bad if your opponent push very tight, so in nash you can call but in reality it depends on your opponent range!

 

[erik_lima]

It depends of the style of the opponent. There are some opponents very tight, so the fold against this kind of player would be totally normal.

 

[fundiver199]

I plugged this scenario into ICMizer telling the program, that 42 players were left, since this seem to still be early in the tournament. Could have been down to 4 tables already, but this hardly makes a big difference, when only 7 places pay. Anyways as expected the NASH ranges are very wide. Hero opening 45% of hand, Villain jamming 35% of hands, Hero calling 25% of hands just to keep the numbers round. 25% is any pair and any ace, so ATo is well within Heros calling range, and its not close at all.

However there are some players, who might defend their blinds mostly by calling in a situation like this, and who might only be jamming really good hands. If we lock Villain jamming range at 10%, then Hero need at least AJ to call. However you would need to be very sure to make such a big exploit like this, since Hero would be folding like 85% of his range, which again would make bluffing extremely profitable for Villain.

If I take ICMizer out of MTT mode, then the ranges change dramatically. Hero is now only supposed to open 10% of hands even on BTN, and as a result Villain is only supposed to jam 7%, and Hero call 4%. And this is basically because, on the bubble there is so much incentive for everyone to avoid playing big "flips" and let someone else collide first. However with 4-5 tables left everyone needs to chip up to cash, and then you should be more than happy to play for 13BB with ATo BTN vs. blinds.

 

[chakalaka]

I think this call is quite good but it can be bad if your opponent push very tight, so in nash you can call but in reality it depends on your opponent range!

I know but Villian is unk reg for me, so it's hard to give him other range than "typical" in this kind of situtation.

Thanks!

 

[chakalaka]

You must put ICMizer into MTT mode. Otherwise the program will assume, you are on the final table, and in a 45 man 8 players left is the actual bubble. So this is why, the NASH equilibrium will show very tight ranges. In this situation however there were still multible tables left, and then ATo is a sigh call given positions and stack sizes. You are not thrilled, he jammed, but calling is a less bad option than folding.

Thanks! I'm gonna to analyse hands, so it will be helpful advice!

and then ATo is a sigh call given positions and stack sizes - indeed

 

[chakalaka]

I plugged this scenario into ICMizer telling the program, that 42 players were left, since this seem to still be early in the tournament. Could have been down to 4 tables already, but this hardly makes a big difference, when only 7 places pay. Anyways as expected the NASH ranges are very wide. Hero opening 45% of hand, Villain jamming 35% of hands, Hero calling 25% of hands just to keep the numbers round. 25% is any pair and any ace, so ATo is well within Heros calling range, and its not close at all.

However there are some players, who might defend their blinds mostly by calling in a situation like this, and who might only be jamming really good hands. If we lock Villain jamming range at 10%, then Hero need at least AJ to call. However you would need to be very sure to make such a big exploit like this, since Hero would be folding like 85% of his range, which again would make bluffing extremely profitable for Villain.

If I take ICMizer out of MTT mode, then the ranges change dramatically. Hero is now only supposed to open 10% of hands even on BTN, and as a result Villain is only supposed to jam 7%, and Hero call 4%. And this is basically because, on the bubble there is so much incentive for everyone to avoid playing big "flips" and let someone else collide first. However with 4-5 tables left everyone needs to chip up to cash, and then you should be more than happy to play for 13BB with ATo BTN vs. blinds.

Thanks! It was semi FT, there was 4 or 5 players left to cash that's why I decide to call. Probably on the bubble I probably will fold this hand.

 

[fundiver199]

Thanks! It was semi FT, there was 4 or 5 players left to cash that's why I decide to call. Probably on the bubble I probably will fold this hand.

That is a really weird stack distribution, since all the chips were then on the other table (there is a total of 67.500 and only around 15.000 on your table). Its also very unusual for a 45 man to be down to 2 tables, when blinds are still only at 120/60. Right now I am actually playing a 3,5$ 45 man on Stars, and with blinds at 200/100 we are still 18 players left. So are you really sure about this? Maybe you confused this with a hand from a different tournament?

 

[chakalaka]

That is a really weird stack distribution, since all the chips were then on the other table (there is a total of 67.500 and only around 15.000 on your table). Its also very unusual for a 45 man to be down to 2 tables, when blinds are still only at 120/60. Right now I am actually playing a 3,5$ 45 man on Stars, and with blinds at 200/100 we are still 18 players left. So are you really sure about this? Maybe you confused this with a hand from a different tournament?

Sometimes it happens, you know. But I remember it was like a semi final table. But of course I could be wrong.

 

[fundiver199]

Anyways it probably does not matter much. Even if it was down to 16-17 players with all the big stacks at the other table, that still mean, 9-10 more had to go, and you would very likely be one of those, unless you accumulate more chips.

 

[SoulMan87]

I think in the most cases you have even better hand here, so call for sure.

 

[andrestc]

I think opening is fine, planning to call vs BB and probably folding vs SB.

If this was the stone bubble, I don't mind open shoving here.

 

[Vallet]

You made a minimum raise on the preflop. A player in the big blind with a short stack may think that you are trying to steal the blinds. He may have low pairs or his cards may be worse than yours. For example A9, JQ, QK. So you have an important reason to make a call.

 

[ZenGreen]

Well.. what was your intent. was your intent to stack a dude for 13bb or to steal some blinds with a marginal hand. IF WE ARE TRYING TO STACK SOMEONE FOR 13bb, then WHY ARE WE NOT OPEN SHOVING

Me.. I have 23bb and feel I can try to steal the blinds and fold as Im not sure this guy is jamming A9o over me here. soo...

If I have 17bb, Im probably open shoving, if i decide to get in the hand

I dont think your intent was to race off 13bb here so then ,,,

I fold here .. if this happens again then I know I got GOT.. but from what I know here. I tried to steal, im not comflating the problem with dropping 11bb more (OR I WOULD OF JUST OPEN SHOVE THE WHOLE 23BB)