$1.50 NLHE MTT Turbo: $ NLHE MTT Turbo: Is my double barrel here warranted?

T

tomasdig

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I'm at this 45 player sitngo, final table 4-handed. I'm the chip leader with 25 BBs and I get J-10o on the button. SB is a LAG, stats are 41/30 after 30 hands. Not much, I know, especially on a final table short handed.


pokerstars - 500/1000 Ante 60 NL - Holdem - 4 players
Hand converted by Holdem Manager 3

CO: 12,946 (12.9 bb)
Hero (BTN): 25,243 (25.2 bb)
SB: 22,505 (22.5 bb)
BB: 6,806 (6.8 bb)

4 players post ante of 60, SB posts 500, BB posts 1,000

Pre Flop: (pot: 1,740) Hero has :jc4: :10h4:
fold, Hero raises to 2,000, SB calls 1,500, fold

Flop: (5,240, 2 players) :4c4: :5h4: :as4:
SB checks, Hero bets 2,620, SB calls 2,620

Turn: (10,480, 2 players) :qd4:
SB checks, Hero bets 5,240, SB calls 5,240

River: (20,960, 2 players) :10s4:
SB checks, Hero checks

Results: 20,960 pot (0 rake)
Final Board: :4c4: :5h4: :as4: :qd4: :10s4:

SB shows :6s4: :ac4:: (One Pair, Aces)
(Pre 54%, Flop 97%, Turn 91%)

Hero mucks :jc4: :10h4:: (One Pair, Tens)
(Pre 46%, Flop 3%, Turn 9%)

SB wins 20,960

My take on it is the flop favours my range over SB, so I decide to take a stab at it. Turn gives me some outs on a straight draw, so I double barrel. And the check on the flop is OK, I guess. If he was calling down with a 5 or a 4, I might take it, but I don't think I'm getting him to fold an ace or queen here.

Perhaps I should've checked behind on the flop, and called a turn bet. What do you guys think?
 
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eetenor

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I'm at this 45 player sitngo, final table 4-handed. I'm the chip leader with 25 BBs and I get J-10o on the button. SB is a LAG, stats are 41/30 after 30 hands. Not much, I know, especially on a final table short handed.


PokerStars - 500/1000 Ante 60 NL - Holdem - 4 players
Hand converted by Holdem Manager 3

CO: 12,946 (12.9 bb)
Hero (BTN): 25,243 (25.2 bb)
SB: 22,505 (22.5 bb)
BB: 6,806 (6.8 bb)

4 players post ante of 60, SB posts 500, BB posts 1,000

Pre Flop: (pot: 1,740) Hero has :jc4: :10h4:
fold, Hero raises to 2,000, SB calls 1,500, fold

Flop: (5,240, 2 players) :4c4: :5h4: :as4:
SB checks, Hero bets 2,620, SB calls 2,620

Turn: (10,480, 2 players) :qd4:
SB checks, Hero bets 5,240, SB calls 5,240

River: (20,960, 2 players) :10s4:
SB checks, Hero checks

Results: 20,960 pot (0 rake)
Final Board: :4c4: :5h4: :as4: :qd4: :10s4:

SB shows :6s4: :ac4:: (One Pair, Aces)
(Pre 54%, Flop 97%, Turn 91%)

Hero mucks :jc4: :10h4:: (One Pair, Tens)
(Pre 46%, Flop 3%, Turn 9%)

SB wins 20,960

My take on it is the flop favours my range over SB, so I decide to take a stab at it. Turn gives me some outs on a straight draw, so I double barrel. And the check on the flop is OK, I guess. If he was calling down with a 5 or a 4, I might take it, but I don't think I'm getting him to fold an ace or queen here.

Perhaps I should've checked behind on the flop, and called a turn bet. What do you guys think?

Thank U 4 Posting.

Do you know what ICM is? It applies here to your choice of putting in this much of your stack in this spot.

The SB is a LAG yet every choice we make is a standard choice that works better versus tighter villains.

Preflop standard raise size with J10 vs a V that calls hands that dominate us why?
Flop half pot bet size vs a V that calls with a wide range.
Turn half pot bet size vs a V that calls more often.
River check back vs a V that could show us 65.

We should be thinking about how best to win this tournament first and this hand second.

Attacking a big stack LAG with a weak holding with 2 short stacks on the table is not necessary.

bluffing in a standard line vs a LAG is not what our strategy should be.
We want to be more creative vs this type of player.
For example -check back flop bluff turn with the intention of over betting river as a bluff.
Not what I would do in this spot for ICM considerations.

We also want to limit our bluffs vs V that call more often.
So we can easily check flop -fold turn to protect our ICM chip lead in this spot.

Hope this helps
:):)
 
F

fundiver199

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Preflop
I agree with Eatenor, that this hand is all about understanding the ICM situation and your opponent. You call him a "LAG", and sure he is playing many hands, and he is also mostly playing them aggressively preflop. But for most people a "LAG" is a good player. Its a Daniel Negreanu, Phil Ivey or Tom Dwan. People, who are very tough to play against, because they are good postflop, and they are difficult to put on a hand, because they can have AA or 54s and play it the same way.

This guy however is simply playing to many hands, and he is not very good. You can use words like bad reg, aggressive fish, play machine, maniac, and these are all more fitting for a player like this than LAG. Which is important, because as eetenor say, you chose to play your hand in a rather GTO way. Which is not, what you want to do against bad players.

The overall situation here is, that there are two big stacks, which are almost equal, and a very short stack, who is now in the big blind. In this spot the goal of everyone else is to get the short stack busted and to avoid playing against each other. Also when big blind is this short, you are likely to end up playing for all his chips, if you enter a pot against him, and then its kind of nice to have something with a little more equity than JTo.

So I think, its better to just fold here. Only good things can come from folding. SB will likely jam and put BB all in, and if BB fold, then everyone else is a little closer to a payjump. If SB call, he might bust, and then you have the payjump already. And even if he dubble up, this is also good. Now you are the clear chipleader, and you get rid of a bad situation, where the player on your direct left is very loose and can threaten your stack. Instead you get a really easy situation, where you can play push-fold and put a lot of pressure on all of them.

Flop
I agree, that C-betting this kind of dry A high flop can often give a lot of folds, and it can be fine to do it with almost your entire range. But again it will matter, if this play machine actually want to fold to C-bets? You should have some idea after watching him play 30 hands on a final table. If you are going to C-bet, maybe a slightly smaller size can also get the job done.

Turn
Given the ICM situation and stack sized I check back here and take the free card. Yes in theory he should have some hands like 66-99, that might peel one but fold now, but this is where, I think, you lean a bit to much on GTO against a player like this. You dont want to get check-jammed on, at its pretty likely he has a hand like, what he had, which he is then not going to fold.

River
Checking back is fine. After hitting a pair your hand is to much in between for betting to accomplish anything.
 
T

tomasdig

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Attacking a big stack LAG with a weak holding with 2 short stacks on the table is not necessary.

While I agree with everything you said, I'm taking this as my main learning opportunity here. I'm familiar with ICM, I just fail to pay attention sometimes. I think I was distracted during this hand, so I didn't think about how much villain would defend and call a C-bet here. It's one of the main things I'm working on. Thank you.

The overall situation here is, that there are two big stacks, which are almost equal, and a very short stack, who is now in the big blind. In this spot the goal of everyone else is to get the short stack busted and to avoid playing against each other. Also when big blind is this short, you are likely to end up playing for all his chips, if you enter a pot against him, and then its kind of nice to have something with a little more equity than JTo.

So I think, its better to just fold here. Only good things can come from folding. SB will likely jam and put BB all in, and if BB fold, then everyone else is a little closer to a payjump. If SB call, he might bust, and then you have the payjump already. And even if he dubble up, this is also good. Now you are the clear chipleader, and you get rid of a bad situation, where the player on your direct left is very loose and can threaten your stack. Instead you get a really easy situation, where you can play push-fold and put a lot of pressure on all of them.

You're absolutely right. Once again, I just get distracted sometimes and rush into an action without really looking at the table.

Thank you both for your comments!
 
jaworek1405

jaworek1405

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Hello, I sketch in that I agree mostly with guys. We are chipleader in the tournament, but we don't win yet this tournament. Everything can change. I also think that here better fold JTo in this situation, because on the big blind is player who has almost 7bb. I don't want to raise JTo on this player, because, yes you are chip leader, but your advantage isn't too big against second and even third player can menace you if you lose this hand. So better fold JTo and wait for better hand, I think that Ato would be a little better hand to raise on this player. Second think, we play against player from the small blind and I think that better play check on this flop, because we have air and if we check the flop, later usually we get some action on the turn from the opponent. If he hit something on the flop, he usually will bet on the turn and I think we have to respect it. So If the turn and the river will not help us we should give up this hand and wait for better situations to win the chips. GL :)
 
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zuker

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Sep 16, 2010
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Bettin on A high flop with JT is bluffing. I don`t think villain have enough folds here so Cbetting here is questionable.
 
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