$1.50 NLHE MTT: Facing raise with TP King kicker on a paired board

[RamdeeBen]

I've not really noticed anything out of order with villian, didn't seem to spazzy.

Anyway, it's a 18man with top 4 getting paid and I have my eye on the short stack.

I raised here expecting folds because they didn't seem to spazzy, anyone but thought if called, It's not a bad hand 4 handed.

When the board comes down I'm sure I'm good here and I wonder when I bet out, because the board is paired he thinks I'm just c-betting? He's has equal stack so If we stack of (chances are he's ahead if he shoves me or calls my shove) and I think the main reason I fold here is based on the short stack still in and ICM.

Is it correct to fold here?

I'm sure his raising range here given stack sizes and him committing himself basically leaves me thinking I'm beat? Thoughts? He is never raising under pairs is or flush draws on a paired board is he?

pokerstars No-Limit Hold'em, 1.5 Tournament, 200/400 Blinds 25 Ante (5 handed) - PokerStars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

BB (t5395)
Hero (UTG) (t5389)
MP (t3593)
Button (t11772)
SB (t851)

Hero's M: 7.43

Preflop: Hero is UTG with K

, J

Hero bets t880, 3 folds, BB calls t480

Flop: (t2085) 9

, J

, 9

(2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets t1042, BB raises to t2084, Hero folds

Total pot: t4169

 

[WiZZiM]

With the ante, whats our effective stack size?

If you answered around 10 BB's then you would be correct, so it's shove or fold pre-flop time, with the short stacker, it's an easy fold i would assume.

 

[RamdeeBen]

I don't get you..

We are both very well evenly stacked.

 

[baudib1]

wtf shove pre

 

[WiZZiM]

wtf shove pre

what about the shorty. This is the bubble isn't it?

 

[jbbb]

~10BB pre i'd probably just shove. If you get raise AI PF are you snapping or folding to wait for SB to get hit by blinds? Also as played I think you have to call the flop too

 

[RamdeeBen]

wtf shove pre

hmf?

UTG shove? I have to get through a big stack on the button who has 2x my chips and easily has me covered. He's calling A,10+ and any pair here. I also have someone with an equal stack size to me and then on top of that I have I have one mega tiny small stack who will bust within the next few hands and another shortie.

It's on the bubble with only 4 being paid I don't think it's correct to shove here most times.

 

[RamdeeBen]

~10BB pre i'd probably just shove. If you get raise AI PF are you snapping or folding to wait for SB to get hit by blinds? Also as played I think you have to call the flop too

Normally yeah, if we're all effective average stacks or I'm one of the shorties but with one big stack to act and someone even in chips with me, I chose not too.

If I get raised AIPF by the big stack, I fold and maybe even fold to the equal stack based on ICM because we know shortie will always be folding in hope I call and either one of us bust out first.

Besides which, I can't see someone who has an equal stack size as me also knowing someone has 2 BB left to be shoving wide and I'd have to assume I'm behind to a decent high pair or I'm massively dominated A,J/A,Q+ /K,Q+

Of course I'm always calling if all stack sizes are different and I'm a shortie or just average stack, well I'm actually just shoving AIPF already..but with the current stack sizes not sure.

You say as played, I should call but in all honestly I can't ever see him again due to ICM and and a massively shorter stack to bust in the next few hands to be bluffing me of with a min raise. He's far too commited that once he min raises me that he has me beat in my eyes.

 

[WiZZiM]

I'd just fold and let the shortie get all in with the BB a huge % of the time. With your stack size you have to be very risk averse in these situations. You are second in chips, and winning these blinds doesn't really change your equity situation much at all. Raising this in a $1.50 game is just asking for a weird/bad situation, people call too much.

The guy flat called you OOP from the blinds, he really doesn't have to have us beat here that often. He could have a lot of smaller PP's or weaker J's for us to get it in postflop. However, we really shouldn't be putting ourselves in these positions to begin with.

 

[baudib1]

Look at the equity dump from the start of the hand here to folding here and then assume shortie shoves on btn with you in BB next hand.

 

[WiZZiM]

Are you talking about the situation where Shorties gets it in and doubles up then shoves on the btn next hand?

 

[Pascal-lf]

shove or fold pre, probably folding cos of shortie

 

[jbbb]

Normally yeah, if we're all effective average stacks or I'm one of the shorties but with one big stack to act and someone even in chips with me, I chose not too.

But isn't raising and folding to a shove, or raising and folding on a non-perfect flop a total waste of chips? Gotta agree with Pasc on this, raise or fold pre.