More High Roller Cheating.

pocketace222

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The good news for me is I don't play high roller tournaments or satellites. Now that does however make me wonder how many groups out there are doing this at the lower buyin levels. It makes me sick these guys get away with it over and over and over. I mean these guys are more than likely getting paid more than buyins to most tournaments like get real stop scamming. All the skill in the world and your cheating


Some may recall a flurry of accusations were made at the end of last year. I believe Chris 'Big Huni' Hunachin kicked it off after he called out a few individuals about a lot of scams and cheating which has been ongoing for a while. This appeared to be underlined by GG Poker kicking tens of players off the site including a few rumored notables.

Well, Ali Imsirovic has stunk up the room yet again - I'll let the reports speak for themselves. It would appear some pros have had enough of such antics having a blind eye turned on them.

At this point over the last several months Chris Hunichen, Fedor Holz, Matt Berkey, Justin Bonomo and Alex Foxen have all spoken up and though this round of accusations was directed at Imsirovic, Bonomo's rather cryptic reference to one player is Jake Schindler (which really kills me as he's a favorite player of mine that I knew had been accused of online antics).

Really pathetic when these guys are making millions.

https://www.pocketfives.com/article...-of-cheating-at-live-and-online-poker-638144/

https://highstakesdb.com/news/high-...ses-ali-imsirovic-of-live-and-online-cheating
 
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HaroldHouse

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All of these accusations make it hard to trust any game or site.
 
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Because he can.

imo, many poker players are selfish, self-centered, immature narcissits.

The basic poker mentality is 'screw over the other player' 'deceive the other player' 'take AS MUCH as you can get from the other player' (< aka. maximize profits). I recall starting out playing online back in 2007. I chose to play tournament style poker (sng, mtt-sng & mtt) over cashgames because I honestly hated the feeling I would get when winning pots on cash tables. Tournaments felt different... it was 1 buyin, and more like a lottery.

I think you are absolutely right.

I was very naive about such people at first because I did not come from a gambling background and was interested in the mentality it took to play poker well as much as anything else. Of course I then caught up with the various poker site failures and scandals and in another way (perverse maybe) I am still fascinated by such characters.

However, unless and until the industry makes a serious ongoing effort to weed certain people out when their stunts are exposed people are going to constantly question the industry itself.
 
Poker_Mike

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I think you are absolutely right.

I was very naive about such people at first because I did not come from a gambling background and was interested in the mentality it took to play poker well as much as anything else. Of course I then caught up with the various poker site failures and scandals and in another way (perverse maybe) I am still fascinated by such characters.

However, unless and until the industry makes a serious ongoing effort to weed certain people out when their stunts are exposed people are going to constantly question the industry itself.


The stories would make a good book.
 
Kenzie 96

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Because he can.

imo, many poker players are selfish, self-centered, immature narcissits.

The basic poker mentality is 'screw over the other player' 'deceive the other player' 'take AS MUCH as you can get from the other player' (< aka. maximize profits). I recall starting out playing online back in 2007. I chose to play tournament style poker (sng, mtt-sng & mtt) over cashgames because I honestly hated the feeling I would get when winning pots on cash tables. Tournaments felt different... it was 1 buyin, and more like a lottery.

FYP, :eek:

imo, many people are selfish, self-centered, immature narcissists.
 
efranto2286

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I was lost of all this information... How interesting to know all this thanks for the post it was very interesting to be able to read them all :D
 
Alizona

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A long time ago I was playing on poker stars play chips (I'm American and can't play for real money), and totally forgot that equity calculators are prohibited on Stars. I opened up PokerStove and immediately the Stars software gave me a popup box warning me that equity calculators are banned. It told me I immediately had to sent them an email acknowledging that I understood the rule and that I wouldn't do it ever again.

So I wrote them the email, and after apologizing and promising as requested, I also put in a paragraph that said, "you know you're only penalizing the honest players, don't you? If an unethical player wants to use an equity calculator during play, they'll just run it on an unconnected laptop. So your rule only penalizes honest players while having no real effect on the dishonest ones."

The site ignored my comment obviously, no response at all. They have no solution to stop it, that's the absolute fact. And it's not just equity calculators, its ANY "RTA" software that has this issue. There are many ways to run an unconnected computer with RTA on it but still be able to capture all the poker data off your table and input it automatically into the RTA software - for instance, just split the video cable off the internet-connected PC and run the split cable over to the unconnected laptop. Or use a camera focused on the computer monitor screen with "screen-scraping" optical character recognition software to input the poker table data into the unconnected laptop. It really is a total joke to think the unethical and immoral people can be stopped. Rules have good intent, but they really only stop the honest people (who likely aren't ever cheating anyway).

It's just like gun laws... you can put all the penalties in place you want, but only honest people abide by laws. Dishonest people (i.e. the criminals) are gonna have a gun no matter what laws are in place to prevent it. The old cliche is absolutely correct, it says "When guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns." And its the same with poker and RTA. This is one reason why I only grind freerolls and never deposit any "real money" of my own onto poker sites. It's just not worth the risk in my opinion, and besides, I enjoy the challenge much more when I have to begin from zero dollars and try to build my bankroll up from there. But I'm the oddball in that regard. Most don't have that kind of patience, and so they are risking money when they really have no idea what sort of disadvantage they may be facing in these online games.
 
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This weekend I spent a few hours checking back and forth through Tweet statements and videos released by one and all and have come to a few interim conclusions.

First I want to credit Chris Kruk as getting the ball rolling with some damning statements back in December (rather than Chris Hunichen) who was backed by Bert Stevens concerning a variety of widespread online scams. A year before Henry Kilbane had also leveled a withering attack at Bryn Kenney...yet these guys could not get any traction other than in private where they were commended by other pros for speaking up. The industry itself did not appear to care. So, some thoughts.

GG Poker

One thing I’d appreciate is if the poker press (I use the term loosely) could be bothered enough to investigate who actually owns GG Poker. There was a phase of operation from 2014, which GG has attempted to scrub, then the phase from 2017 to date. In eight years no one seems to have gotten to the bottom of the ownership question even though it is the biggest on line platform. One presumes there has to be transparency regarding GG Poker applying for licensing in the North American...so why does the poker press look disinterested in the matter?

GG Poker as an operator

At this point GG Poker can hardly be looked at as an innocent – the idea is laughable. Kenney took advantage, but did so of a system GG either instituted or agreed to institute – a pyramid system of agents and their ‘agencies’. They recruited pros who in turn would lure other pros/players to play on GG in return for rake.

What make this expose so engaging is it comes as GG in patently making inroads to appear as completely legit and enter the North American market. It going to be interesting to see if licensing bodies with the US and canada are paying attention to GG Poker’s dirty laundry or whether money talks and they will regard GG as freshly minted ‘legit’.

I pointed out many weeks ago GG had erased its origin story. Their current bio has them ‘founded’ some years later than they actually were and has no mention of promoting into Asia which they were doing exclusively. Early days they were operating in a grayer area than the likes of ACR have ever done. Quite how they got so much traction on a continent where poker is generally illegal is a mystery, but at this point I would assume that would also reveal multiple levels of dodgey.

The agent system was in play in Europe as well as the US with agents providing accounts to new members. These accounts/memberships circumvented any protocols in place regarding ID and compliance with restrictions imposed by gaming commissions such as the UK (GG poker is registered in the Isle of Man) let alone the legality of playing from the US. GG appears in it up to their eyeballs.

Those participating have described the set up as akin to another poker ‘skin’. In some cases agents had access to the balances and Bryn Kenney appears to have even had the ability to move funds around from one account to others. There have been accusations of Kenney also having ‘super user’ access but I think that far fetched. What has become clear is Bryn Kenney was not a partial owner and texts have been released where he is admitting to Zamani he is getting chopped from GG and is about to lose some $500,000, which sounds like a rake payment - certainly nowhere near the $2 million a week figure which was being touted.

However, this all appears part and parcel of how GG grew out of Asia into Europe and then grabbed a major slice of the US market whilst effectively hiding they were even operating Stateside.

Members who participated at GG under the ‘agents’.

The abuse Lauren Roberts suffered under Bryn Kenny was sickening. However, I had already asked how so many of these guys were playing on GG in the first place? Many had no legal entry to do so and using a VPN was the first questionable choice. Anyone engaging with GG via their ‘agents’ knew they were circumventing US law and (as above) protocols demanded by Euopean gaming commissions. They knew they were in a shady situation.

I am not saying ‘they had it coming’ but I would ask what were they thinking? After I registered with GG, I was verified, authorized to play. After a GG glitch I was de-verified. It took me over a week to resolve the matter. I had to resubmit everything a second time and then wait patiently. The matter was resolved amicably and I was twice offered profuse apologies from customer service. So I have direct experience with the protocols GG is publicly demanding from each and every new player who registers.

However, Lauren Roberts has now admitted she was playing under dubious circumstances and Kristin Bicknell and Alex Foxen have also publicly outed themselves. Among those playing in the high roller games Cary Katz and also Justin Bonomo have been identified. Never one to let a scandal pass him by, Bill Perkins has now claimed he lost a million in these games as well. Lauren Roberts is seen to have played in a thousand such sessions - at peak degen, she bought into five $25k games in one day. Is anyone even bothering to pretend they were playing all these sessions form outside the US at this point?

Further, one has to ask where was the due diligence when the wsop decided to partner up with GG to present their online tourneys during the World Series? I could ask the same of PokerGO and their cross promotions but that would not be serious question.

Daniel Negreanu

Naturally, many have chuckled as Daniel Negreanu, the ‘Face of GG’ has barely passed any comment on the GG fiasco as it has unveiled. As GG ambassador Negreanu has presented as though he brought GG to the fore under his own steam. For the past few years he has often used the term ‘we’ rather than ‘they’ when it comes to the implementation of policy and promotions at GG as though he was at the center of decision making. My opinion? Standard Daniel Negreanu self-puffery. But I have a bone to pick.

I don’t believe Negreanu is the type to have involved himself on any level with the smutty ‘agents’ practices which peaked under Bryn Kenney. But when Negreanu joined GG there was overlap with Negreanu entering the GG front door and Kenney exiting the back door. In fact when GG announced they had banned tens of players for using RTA etc. the original GG Tweet laughingly still featured Bryn Kenney in the graphics, along with Negreanu, Fedor Holz, Felipe Ramos and Elky (Sept 2020).

So I would presume Negreanu knew there were all types of shenanigans and shady **** taking place at GG. He chose to turn a blind eye? I remember Negreanu discussing how high roller play had migrated to GG on the DAT podcast. He never asked who and how they were playing legally?

When Negreanu does come to discuss it - I am sure Adam Schwarz and Terrance Chan are not going to let the matter slide on the DAT podcast – I’ll predict Negreanu will assume the pose many a sponsored pro whose site has come under question have taken. ‘I know nothing. I am just a pitchman removed from the day to day operations. I am as shocked as you are’. He'll reposition from the center of anything GG.

(Edit – Adam Schwarz just joked via Tweet about the need to discuss matters but as he is suffering a second round of Covid, they skipped the last two DAT podcasts)

Finally -

Ironically, GG Poker is my favorite poker platform and I will still play there as a) I swim in the shallows b) I presume they have cleared up their act as they strive to enter the US market legitimately c) I am not sure why being ethical to the point of self-exclusion within the poker world makes any sense.

I believe the more interesting aspect at this juncture is to whether there will be any fallout of real consequence to any of the parties involved. My guess would be little if any. Many will hope it blows over and is consigned to the dustbin of history.
 
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Alizona

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Outstanding work DS3! Big thumbs up for you. I never even considered the possibility of VPN being involved in the GG "scandal" where they banned 40 bigname pros, perhaps the reason for some of those bans was not RTA at all but rather pros playing illegally (meaning, against the terms and conditions of the poker sites) from their American home base? I'm a fan of one of those pros who was banned and he has always proclaimed his innocence of the accusation he was using RTA... but hmmm... perhaps he's truthful on that but he knows he cannot bring up the real reason for his ban or it would just cause more problems for himself? One additional clue is that after he was caught up in the ban wave, he then signs with ACR as a sponsored pro, and of course ACR *IS* (cough cough) "legal" to be played from USA IP addresses... and I'll also just mention the curious case of Chris Moneymaker, who in the past year or so also decided to leave the non-USA Poker Stars for the much more USA-friendly ACR sponsorship... Chris was his usual open self when he said he was sick of traveling to canada each time he wanted to play in a big tournament series on Poker Stars, but it makes me wonder if he too was abusing the VPN technique and was either caught (my speculation) or was getting worried he might be caught and decided to pre-empt any problems by leaving on his own?

Anyhow, these are entirely my own opinions, but you definitely opened my eyes to this additional possibility. Again, superb work DS3!! :cool:
 
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Outstanding work DS3! Big thumbs up for you. I never even considered the possibility of VPN being involved in the GG "scandal" where they banned 40 bigname pros, perhaps the reason for some of those bans was not RTA at all but rather pros playing illegally (meaning, against the terms and conditions of the poker sites) from their American home base? I'm a fan of one of those pros who was banned and he has always proclaimed his innocence of the accusation he was using RTA... but hmmm... perhaps he's truthful on that but he knows he cannot bring up the real reason for his ban or it would just cause more problems for himself? One additional clue is that after he was caught up in the ban wave, he then signs with ACR as a sponsored pro, and of course ACR *IS* (cough cough) "legal" to be played from USA IP addresses... and I'll also just mention the curious case of Chris Moneymaker, who in the past year or so also decided to leave the non-USA Poker Stars for the much more USA-friendly ACR sponsorship... Chris was his usual open self when he said he was sick of traveling to canada each time he wanted to play in a big tournament series on Poker Stars, but it makes me wonder if he too was abusing the VPN technique and was either caught (my speculation) or was getting worried he might be caught and decided to pre-empt any problems by leaving on his own?

Anyhow, these are entirely my own opinions, but you definitely opened my eyes to this additional possibility. Again, superb work DS3!! :cool:

Thank you Alizona!

Of course one thing which became clearer through this recent debacle concerning what had taken place at GG was it would appear to have taken place over two periods (by that I mean the more egregious and blatant acts).

The first being phase being through Bryn Kenney (and again, I'll underline that GG can't be regarded as innocent or 'removed' themselves) where ties seemed to be severed sometime in 2020. Impossible to tell when precisely because the matter was covered up until a journalist pressed GG on whether Kenney was still with them after he disappeared from their promotional materials (similar to Dan Bilzerian's exit)

The second episode was revealed by GG themselves during the next year when they themselves announced they had removed 40 accounts and warned another 40 whom they suspected of using RTA.

At both points some public accusations had been made at Kenney and then later Ali Imsirovich and Jake Schindler although GG did not/has not gone public with any names.

Naturally, what we know is somewhat limited and over the longer term I do not expect GG to be more forthcoming especially regarding the 'agents' phase as they were complicit and all they would do is expose themselves. I would speculate after they closed that chapter (presuming they did) then they would be completely aware of other parties abusing the system - using VPNs and then stables of horses to run over unsuspecting players in high stakes whilst also using RTA. And as I said, the interesting issue from a detached perspective is this was all taking place (the more recent allegations) when GG has partnered with the WSOP and has undertaken a push to obtain licenses to operate in North America.

So we can only presume at this juncture they have cleaned up their act as they strive to become such a major player. If they haven't, then I'd guess they are presently conducting a somewhat fevered in house spring clean as these matters have become more and more public.
 
Poker Orifice

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A long time ago I was playing on Poker Stars play chips (I'm American and can't play for real money), and totally forgot that equity calculators are prohibited on Stars. I opened up PokerStove and immediately the Stars software gave me a popup box warning me that equity calculators are banned. It told me I immediately had to sent them an email acknowledging that I understood the rule and that I wouldn't do it ever again.

So I wrote them the email, and after apologizing and promising as requested, I also put in a paragraph that said, "you know you're only penalizing the honest players, don't you? If an unethical player wants to use an equity calculator during play, they'll just run it on an unconnected laptop. So your rule only penalizes honest players while having no real effect on the dishonest ones."

The site ignored my comment obviously, no response at all. They have no solution to stop it, that's the absolute fact. And it's not just equity calculators, its ANY "RTA" software that has this issue. There are many ways to run an unconnected computer with RTA on it but still be able to capture all the poker data off your table and input it automatically into the RTA software - for instance, just split the video cable off the internet-connected PC and run the split cable over to the unconnected laptop. Or use a camera focused on the computer monitor screen with "screen-scraping" optical character recognition software to input the poker table data into the unconnected laptop. It really is a total joke to think the unethical and immoral people can be stopped. Rules have good intent, but they really only stop the honest people (who likely aren't ever cheating anyway).

It's just like gun laws... you can put all the penalties in place you want, but only honest people abide by laws. Dishonest people (i.e. the criminals) are gonna have a gun no matter what laws are in place to prevent it. The old cliche is absolutely correct, it says "When guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns." And its the same with poker and RTA. This is one reason why I only grind freerolls and never deposit any "real money" of my own onto poker sites. It's just not worth the risk in my opinion, and besides, I enjoy the challenge much more when I have to begin from zero dollars and try to build my bankroll up from there. But I'm the oddball in that regard. Most don't have that kind of patience, and so they are risking money when they really have no idea what sort of disadvantage they may be facing in these online games.


But how was GGPoker able to ban 40 accounts for RTA use & compensating over 4,000 players with 1.175 million that was confiscated.
fwiw, some well-known Twitch streamers were banned from GG at that time
 
Poker Orifice

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Have you watched the Doug Polk & Joey Ingram Youtube re: Brynn Kenney interview with Pokernews?

Looked up a few players on GG... from those $5k Blade games. Most cease playing Apr.2020

Lauren's account was -$2.5 million. Many others also at -$1 mill or more

I thought this list of entrants was humorous...
(KenBrynney, Bryn Kenney, & SpynKenney).
 

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DS3

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In a previous post I used the term poker press - and then said I use the term loosely. Little did I anticipate when I went to catch up on matters I would find that Sarah Herring had interviewed Bryn Kenney on behalf of Poker News.

As Adam Schwarz pointed out on Twitter...’I don’t want to bag on Auntie Chardonay….but if you have to say you are good friends with this person before the interview starts, you are probably not the person to be doing it”.Herring also admitted she got hold of Kenney last week to see how he was okay. Good grief.

I’ll spare going into too much into detail – suffice to say, it was an hour plus of Bryn the Benevolent. Though Herring asked some ‘tough’ questions Bryn essentially evaded and waffled around whenever it suited and, as much as I can recall, Herring never once asked for clarification until prompted at the end by viewers and then Bryn refused to do so when asked about a crucial point.

The gigantor issues which Herring failed to address herself were -

Not once bothering to ask about the agency set up at GG and rake back scenario.

Not a single question about how were the likes of Lauren Roberts etc. were playing on GG or the use of VPNs etc.

No clarification on the funds Roberts was using and how Kenney said they were his and yet Herring could not even clarify what he meant. His account? He transferred to her or loaned to her how?

It was a farce. However, don’t trust me just go to the comments underneath to see the majority opinion because most felt it a complete waste of time.

My thoughts are this is where the poker industry really needs to get its act together. Sarah Herring is a pleasant interviewer for anything light and insignificant. But this is going to be the best take on this sordid matter that poker news fronting for the industry can present?

It's a multi-billion dollar industry and this is the standard of reportage.
 
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Watched the Doug Polk and Joey Ingram breakdown after the Kenney interview and of course they brought some sanity to the day.

That said, a little disappointing as only Joey walked up to the line of calling GG Poker out for complicity a couple of times but then did little to underline it. No discussion about members using VPNs to access the site as so many evidently were. All was discussed as though GG was legal within the US market. It wasn’t and it still is not in the majority of states.

Then on to the DAT podcast with Adam Schwartz, Terrance Chan and Daniel Negreanu to discuss the cheating allegations.

Terrance Chan made the best point regarding a poker blacklist as Daniel was sort of arguing it was tricky. No not really. casinos refuse service, ban people, who they suspect are card counting at blackjack. They reserve the right to do without proof, and even though card counting is not a crime. Yet they can’t agree to telling suspect poker players they do not want their business?

As wryly predicted above, Negreanu knows nothing about the scams or cheating at GG Poker. He’s never seen a GG list of banned players He admitted hearing the rumors about Imsirovic and Schindler but because his profile is so big, he can’t throw rumors around for fear of getting sued. Yet confusingly he admitted to previously bigging both of them up. Regarding Bryn Kenney, he maintains he knew nothing, absolutely nothing about any of his shenanigans.

But, the most disappointing thing of all, not a single mention (once again) of exactly how all these US residents were playing on GG Poker. That is not to be touched with a barge pole at this point. Such a key industry player we’ll completely skirt the idea of laying blame at their feet? Extremely disappointing because at this point it is evident there was a culture of allowing any number of dubious practices to take place on the site.

Again, to be clear, GG is currently my favorite site and I do not wish them ill. But the fact they were complicit in allowing an awful lot of questionable activities to be take place on their site needs to be called out. They need to feel a certain pressure to completely clean up their act and maintain a level of integrity. The fact that now Polk, Ingram, Negreanu, Schwarz and Chan all avoided truly taking them to task was pretty deflating.
 
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Alizona

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In a previous post I used the term poker press - and then said I use the term loosely. Little did I anticipate when I went to catch up on matters I would find that Sarah Herring had interviewed Bryn Kenney on behalf of Poker News.

You confirmed my own thoughts on the matter, when I saw this interview as the big headline on Poker News the other day, I just rolled my eyes and didn't bother to give it a listen. I knew it would just be a softball game, not hardball. I rolled my eyes and moved on.

I've been thoroughly disgusted with online poker and the community for over a decade. When Black Friday happened, most players just shrugged and moved on, and I've never been able to accept their ignorance or their lack of passion to fight back against the hypocritical government taking away our freedom and our right to spend our entertainment dollars as we so choose. The top-level pros have the bankroll to just fly to mexico or Canada and so they kept right on going without much upset. They had no worries whatsoever. The rest of us are the ones who got screwed, and we got ZERO backup from ANYONE. Nary a soul has ever spoken out against the government for their absurd actions. And it continues to this very day. Poker is filled with utter losers in my opinion. Spineless cowards and wet-rag personalities. But its really no surprise I guess - this is a game of selfish "me first" attitude by its very nature, which doesn't lend itself to community or togetherness. Forums like this one are a rarity, but notice how there are no professionals here except the few that are sponsored (i.e. paid) to be here. The Sarah Herrings are put out there to put on the appearance that "all is well, poker is a great sport and pasttime." Yuck. She's the proverbial lipstick on the pig. LOL

Enough of my rant. It changes nothing and nobody wants to hear it anyway. :D
 
Shells

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I've been listening (mostly) to the Only Friends Podcast with Matt Berkey to get some kind of update on the latest 'scandals' of the recent past. These can tend to be a bit lengthy but I really do enjoy their takes on anything poker - pretty good entertainment in my opinion. :)

AND I will definitely have to check in with Joey and Doug's take on this, too.

Thanks for keeping us up to date with the high stakes goings-on.
 
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I've been listening (mostly) to the Only Friends Podcast with Matt Berkey to get some kind of update on the latest 'scandals' of the recent past. These can tend to be a bit lengthy but I really do enjoy their takes on anything poker - pretty good entertainment in my opinion. :)

AND I will definitely have to check in with Joey and Doug's take on this, too.

Thanks for keeping us up to date with the high stakes goings-on.

Matt Berkey made some great points yesterday.

First, he made a similar point to myself - there are many peripheral issues coming out, some important and others not so much as this story lengthens. But, surely, the crux of the matter is GG's laissez faire attitude behind the scenes and it would be reassuring to know this had been addressed.

But another point about how widespread dubious activities are at the high roller level was well made.

Berkey had played in an online WSOP 5K small field high roller the past Sunday. It was won by Sean Siefert who Berkey described as not seen for 5 years. This was not entirely accurate as I checked his WSOP cashes and he has played at lower stakes with some regularity. But, as Matt Berkey had said, suddenly he pops out of nowhere and wins a 5K against many of the best players. Berkey was pretty convinced he was not the one playing his account. And perhaps Berkey's suspicions were further raised by the fact he claimed another two players in the field had absolutely no record of previous results anywhere. Suddenly, those two had just appeared from nowhere with a 5K buy-in. It would seem that the WSOP is not known for rigorous security regarding their own line tourneys either (Doug Polk also briefly alluded to this during the Zamani interview I believe).

There needs to be a pivot here. Outing individual players feels worthy in the short term, but really the problem lies with the sites and entities which facilitate the misbehavior. When discussing the possible multi-accounting in that WSOP online tourney, someone asked the question 'well what are they going to do about it?' which was met with a resounding 'nothing!'...which was the point Polk appeared to have made already.

It seems ridiculous but necessary public conversations such as this are now having to be held to force changes.
 
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You confirmed my own thoughts on the matter, when I saw this interview as the big headline on Poker News the other day, I just rolled my eyes and didn't bother to give it a listen. I knew it would just be a softball game, not hardball. I rolled my eyes and moved on....

:D

You were right.

Apparently, Bryn Kenney would only agree to an interview if it was with Sarah Herring and no one else. Kenney refused Doug Polk.

Regarding complacency, I agree with you also. Some have come to Herring's defense as it was a 'difficult' interview/situation. Baloney. This was a serious matter and for PokerNews this was a fail - everyone deserved better. I check in with PokerNews on an almost daily basis to see the results of tourneys but in real world terms it is little more that a PR vessel for the industry.

But, as noted above this is a multi billion dollar industry which has just been outed (for the umpteenth time) of having millions scammed from its players.

Frankly, I have no idea whether things will truly improve or not. This current debacle is engaging and I have felt compelled to my thoughts out on the forum. But if I am really honest I think poker will just rumble along in the longer term at the same seedy level as always.
 
Alizona

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You were right.

Apparently, Bryn Kenney would only agree to an interview if it was with Sarah Herring and no one else. Kenney refused Doug Polk.

Regarding complacency, I agree with you also. Some have come to Herring's defense as it was a 'difficult' interview/situation. Baloney. This was a serious matter and for PokerNews this was a fail - everyone deserved better. I check in with PokerNews on an almost daily basis to see the results of tourneys but in real world terms it is little more that a PR vessel for the industry.

But, as noted above this is a multi billion dollar industry which has just been outed (for the umpteenth time) of having millions scammed from its players.

Frankly, I have no idea whether things will truly improve or not. This current debacle is engaging and I have felt compelled to my thoughts out on the forum. But if I am really honest I think poker will just rumble along in the longer term at the same seedy level as always.

Bart Hanson gave his own take on the cheating scandal today, his youtube channel is "CrushlivePoker" and its easy enough to go look it up if interested in watching. From his channel name, he's quite obviously a live pro - he also does commentary for Hustler Poker too, Bart is a great analytical player who is superb at explaining concepts and dissecting hand histories... in brief, his take is that online poker is already dead, it's just dying a very slow death due to the impact of RTA software... and in-line with his personality, he is hoping it will result in a resurgence of live poker. Of course, that only works if you actually live near a good casino, which isn't the case for many of us, and that's why we play online instead. But Bart is correct, there's just no way to prevent this sort of "RTA" software and no way to be entirely certain someone isn't using it... my solution has always been to play for the lowest stakes, but obviously that means I'm not playing for money, I'm simply playing for the love of the game and to hone my skills. Always been okay with that, but many don't share my attitude in that regard. :D
 
D

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Bart Hanson gave his own take on the cheating scandal today, his youtube channel is "CrushlivePoker" and its easy enough to go look it up if interested in watching.... :D

Hah! Bart Hansen's clip came up in my feed also, so I had watched it - but others should watch it too! Shortish clip but highly recommended

His take on a single state such as Michigan having a gaming commision with the technical ability or desire to monitor online pranks was completely on point- it isn't going to happen.

He also noted WSOP online tourneys have a really poor reputation.

As before, I agree on a couple of other points. Online poker is not going to die because (like yourself) many of us have little access to live venues. But I am a natural skeptic so I have always been hesitant since I slowly dipped my toes in the poker waters.
 
D

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PokerNews followed up with a podcast about the Sarah Herrings interview with Bryn Kenney and it in turn was as disappointing as the original interview.

Naturally the premise put forward by Sarah Herring and Chad Holloway was that they were caught between a rock and a hard place. No you were not. You present as a news service to the poker community and whilst some such as myself have seldom taken the ‘news’ idea seriously, you actually had a chance to handle the matter with integrity but you did not.

Sarah Herring - ‘I knew I was going to be eating a shit sandwich...part of me which did not want to do it but I felt obliged to do it’. Chad Holloway admits Bryn would only talk to Sarah Herring, his friend and no one else. That apparently did not send a big enough red flag up the pole for you to reconsider the interview.

At least Jesse Fullen, the producer was pretty open that it was a fail...’it was rough, I just kept shaking my head, he was definitely prepared for this interview...I mean I have kids and sometimes I’ll ask them a direct question ‘did you do this?’ and they will just talk forever trying to get me to forget what I asked...yeah, I have read plenty of Tweets and we should have held him harder to the fire’.

Sarah Herring then doubles down on Kenney being verbose and she could never get from him what people wanted….’It’s not my responsibility at this point, its up to him to say what he wanted to say’. Etc. etc. etc.

The fact is PokerNews is run like Entertainment News, it does not even approximate news when it comes to matter such as this and the programming is riddled with promotional and sponsor driven content. Once independent to a degree (founded by Tony G) it is now owned by Stars Group Canada which is owned by Flutter Entertainment (which of course owns pokerstars). This is a multi-billion dollar industry which deserves better reporting. The poker industry should be capable of reporting on a matter such as a large fraud via a news service that has some independence and integrity- not be dictated to by the (alleged) fraudster that he will talk to no one but his good friend.

And, not for nothing, I am sure most have realized that after the initial brouhaha, this week I am not aware of anyone in the industry stridently calling for action to be implemented immediately regarding cheating.

Business as usual for now.
 
zorro222_zorro222

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I just hope the truth comes out, one way or another
 
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the higher it is the more possibility of cheating is there
 
thedarkman

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Ultra high stakes poker is obscene. If people can afford to play $100/$200 cash games, they can do something useful with their money.
 
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