Sun Tzu's Art of War Applied to Poker

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Excerpt #12

Poverty of the State exchequer caues an army to be maintained by contributions from a distance. Contributing to maintain an army at a distance causes the people to be impoverished.
 
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Poverty of the State exchequer caues an army to be maintained by contributions from a distance. Contributing to maintain an army at a distance causes the people to be impoverished.

When you play a tournament you can not be far-removed from what is going on. You must be intently aware of every play: you can not be passive and expect your chip stack to remain healthy. Passively playing any tournament will only assure your failure to take it down. Never play a tournament if your mind and attention are "somewhere else"
 
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Excerpt #13

On the other hand, the proximity of an army causes prices to go up; and high prices cause the people's substance to be drained away.

When their substance is drained away, the peasantry will be afflicted by heavy exactions.

With this loss of substance and exhaustion of strength, the homes of the people will be stripped bare, and three-tenths of their income will be dissipated; while government expenses for broken chariots, worn-out horses, breast-plates and helmets, bows and arrows, spears and shields, protective mantles, draught-oxen and heavy wagons, will amount to four-tenths of its total revenue.

Hence a wise general makes a point of foraging on the enemy. One Cartload of the enemy's provisions is equivalent to twenty of one's own, and likewise a single PICUL (a unit of measure equal to a little over 130lbs) of his provender is equivalent to twenty from one's own store.
 
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On the other hand, the proximity of an army causes prices to go up; and high prices cause the people's substance to be drained away.

Playing in a tournament is not free. There is the buy-in but even on top of that, there is a cost to staying around. The Blinds and Antes ensure that there is no "free lunch" in poker. the longer you wait in a tournament before making a move, the more chips you allow to waste away. The more chips that are thrown away to blinds and antes without you actively playing, the less powerful you as a player become (your chips are your power in poker!)

When their substance is drained away, the peasantry will be afflicted by heavy exactions.

And of course when your chip stack dwindles to below 10BB or even 15BB, this gives your opponents an opportunity to pounce on you and heavily tax your lethargic style of play.

With this loss of substance and exhaustion of strength, the homes of the people will be stripped bare, and three-tenths of their income will be dissipated; while government expenses for broken chariots, worn-out horses, breast-plates and helmets, bows and arrows, spears and shields, protective mantles, draught-oxen and heavy wagons, will amount to four-tenths of its total revenue.

At this point you are weak (short stacked), you are developing the mindset of one who has been beaten (as it seems the world is coming after your short stack of chips); now you are completely vulnerable to your opponents' whims. You are owned with not much hope for a comeback. Any pots you do win can barely keep up with the blinds and antes. All this because you decided to wait too long before making your move. Is it better to bust out like this or to bust out fighting fiercely toe to toe with your opponents always being sure to put your strength (chip stack) to proper use? Lackadaisity is your enemy at the poker table; be active from the beginning of a tournament and stay active all throughout.

Hence a wise general makes a point of foraging on the enemy. One Cartload of the enemy's provisions is equivalent to twenty of one's own, and likewise a single PICUL (a unit of measure equal to a little over 130lbs) of his provender is equivalent to twenty from one's own store.


The key point here is your opponents' chips are actually more valuable than your own. Why? Because your chips were given to you while your opponents' chips must be pounced at to become yours. You seek to acquire your opponents' chips and hence increase your own power at the table. By sitting back and watching the action rather than actively participating in it, you set yourself up for failure as increasing blinds and antes come around.

This is not to say there are not times to lay in wait: in fact, it will often behoove you to allow the most aggressive of your opponents dig their own graves: wait patiently and fold until you have a hand that will more likely than not trap these most aggressive players. But surely at a table where everyone is playing very tightly, YOU MUST be the aggressor: you can not allow your chipstack to dwindle while you wait around for the perfect hand because at a tight table, that perfect hand will probably not be paid off anyways. At the poker table as in war, there are no such things as "perfect conditions" You must work with what you have. Working with what you have DOES NOT mean allowing your chipstack to significantly dissipate via blinds and antes before becoming active.

After all, if you are active throughout an entire tournament then this means you are as active with your weak holdings as you are with your strong holdings and so opponents will see no discernable variation in your play. Compare and contrast this with the situation where you are only active when you actually have a good hand and you will see that it is a losing strategy: even the most novice players will notice that after many hands of folding you now suddenly start betting......so there is another argument for staying active from the beginning of a tournament right down until the end!
 
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punctual

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Excerpt #14

Now in order to kill the enemy, our men must be roused to anger; that there may be advantage from defeating the enemy, they must have their rewards.

Therefore in chariot fighting, when ten or more chariots have been taken, those should be rewarded who took the first. Our own flags should be substituted for those of the enemy, and the chariots mingled and used in conjunction with ours. The captured soldiers should be kindly treated and kept.

This is called, using the conquered foe to augment one's own strength.

In war, then, let your great object be victory, not lengthy campaigns
 
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Now in order to kill the enemy, our men must be roused to anger; that there may be advantage from defeating the enemy, they must have their rewards.

We must play our poker tournaments passionately with an eye always on the prize. This quote of Sun Tzu's basically affirms that the soldiers in your army must have a reason for fighting: there must be a reward. We must keep our sights always on doing what it takes to achieve the win in a tournament. Passion must always permeate our every thought and move; we must not lose focus for the reward will be yours only if you make it yours!

Therefore in chariot fighting, when ten or more chariots have been taken, those should be rewarded who took the first. Our own flags should be substituted for those of the enemy, and the chariots mingled and used in conjunction with ours. The captured soldiers should be kindly treated and kept.

Upon making a good decision and significantly growing the size of your chipstack, reward yourself. Take a moment to pat yourself on the back for making good decisions; perhaps even take a break for a few hands as you bask in the glory of your good decision-making. You are now more powerful having made your opponents' chipstacks your own; all this because you made better decisions than they did!

This is called, using the conquered foe to augment one's own strength.

Every time you take an opponents chips, you make him weaker and you augment your own strength. Every move you make at the poker table should be designed to weaken thine enemy and strengthen yourself.

In war, then, let your great object be victory, not lengthy campaigns

Be efficient in your play. If your opponent will call your all in and you are sure you have the better of him, then push all in: do not bet less than what you are sure your opponent will call when you are sure you have the stronger hand. Aim to take your opponents down as quickly and as efficiently as possible; the longer you extend a tournament the more at risk of a loss your put yourself.
 
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Excerpt #15

The leader of armies is the arbiter of the people's fate, the man on whom it depends whether the nation shall be in peace or in peril
 
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Commentary

The leader of armies is the arbiter of the people's fate, the man on whom it depends whether the nation shall be in peace or in peril

You and you alone control your success or failure in a poker tournament. The conglomeration of your decisions, good and bad, culminate into either a win or a loss, a cash or a bust out. Do not attribute external influences over which you have no control to your wins or losses: in reality it is all you! I firmly believe that no matter what cards you are dealt, there is a binary decision tree which can lead you to success in every tournament you play. So, with the right strategy, you can take down every tournament you play. Focus on making correct decisions for your fate is truly in your own hands!
 
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Enjoying the reads, fine sir! Keep it up!
 
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Enjoying the reads, fine sir! Keep it up!

Thanks. I wasn't sure if anyone was reading. Even if no one is reading, writing down my thoughts seems helpful; I feel like I dig deeper into the text when I write down the ideas I have about how to apply the concepts to poker.

Anyways, I hope you get some benefit from it.
 
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Thanks. I wasn't sure if anyone was reading. Even if no one is reading, writing down my thoughts seems helpful; I feel like I dig deeper into the text when I write down the ideas I have about how to apply the concepts to poker.

Anyways, I hope you get some benefit from it.


I'm reading and enjoying too, CP. Sorry for not letting you know that.

I appreciate all of your thoughtful posts at CC, as well as our interaction at the table the other night.

I feel like I could learn a lot from you.
 
punctual

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I'm reading and enjoying too, CP. Sorry for not letting you know that.

I appreciate all of your thoughtful posts at CC, as well as our interaction at the table the other night.

I feel like I could learn a lot from you.

Thanks Bear. Absolutely NO NEED to apologize...lol. I would only want people to read the thread if it was useful to them not for any other reason; to expect anything other than that would be riDONKulous.

I don't know if I have any "secret of the universe" knowledge but I am sure glad to help anyone I can improve their game. While I do love poker and have decided to put my whole heart and soul into it over the past year, I am more generally a student of risk; I guess I'm trying to figure out whether there are any universal laws regarding risk. I believe that upon unravelling the mystery of risk one would essentially be unravelling the mystery of life for there isn't a facet of one's life that does not involve some kind of risk.
 
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Excerpt #16

In the practical art of war, the best thing of all is to take the enemy's country whole and intact; to shatter and destroy it is not so good. So, too, it is better to recapture an army entire than to destory it, to capture a regiment, a detachment or a company entire than to destroy them.
 
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In the practical art of war, the best thing of all is to take the enemy's country whole and intact; to shatter and destroy it is not so good. So, too, it is better to recapture an army entire than to destory it, to capture a regiment, a detachment or a company entire than to destroy them.

In poker, does it make sense to target those individuals who are not willing to put at risk their whole stacks over those who are willing to risk their whole stacks? You will notice the latter type of aggressive players putting all their chips in to protect against stealing or raising with larger than standard bet sizes (more than 5BB is considered large preflop).

It is preferable to propel yourself to the very top of the leaderboard in as few swoops as possible: getting to 1st place with the least number of moves possible should always be the goal (as we have learned from Excerpt #14 which purports that the goal should be victory, not long campaigns).

So when you have an aggressive player recklessly throwing chips in to steal blinds do not fret: in fact, you should be very hopeful and thankful that such a player exists at the table because such a player will always be willing to give you the action you need to increase your chip stack. Wait patiently to trap those kinds of players.

When no such players exist, however, you MUST still find a way to eat and so you BECOME that aggressive type until you notice the table getting looser; of course, do not be foolhardy in mano a mano confrontations with players who are usually tight: a tight player calling your big bet will usually mean only one thing: you are beat so do not go too far over the edge in your bets against him.

So while it is preferable to win as many chips as you can in the fewest "swoops" possible, if no such opportunity exists you must find a way to subsist nonetheless: therefore, if you are not the aggressor at the table your sights should be set on becoming the aggressor (i.e. taking all his chips) and if you are the aggressor at the table your sights should be set on carefully navigating a table of nits who will be lying in wait for the blunder that will bust you out of the tournament.
 
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Excerpt #17

To fight and conquer in all your battles is not supreme excellence; supreme excellence consists in breaking the enemy's resistance without fighting (victory without bloodshed).
 
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To fight and conquer in all your battles is not supreme excellence; supreme excellence consists in breaking the enemy's resistance without fighting (victory without bloodshed).

Actively prey upon opponents who freely give away their chips. To win with the least amount of effort is considered supreme excellence. To conquer thine foe before the battle even begins is supreme excellence (stir up fear in the opponent's heart). Begin a tournament with your opponents already knowing in their hearts that YOU will prevail over them; this is supreme excellence!
 
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More likely answer is she got paid to be in that pic.



.

Most likely what happened. Its mind boggling cause she is actually smart, business savy. She made her own successful biz. All business people read this book.
 
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Reply to the Art of War

This post references the time of August 15th when it was originally was posted.Thank you to Punctual for posting, this reader has enjoyed what has been posted so far, much more to read. The Art of War is governed by five constant factors, to be taken into account in one's deliberations, when seeking to determine the conditions obtaining in the field.

1. the Moral Law
2. Heaven
3. Earth
4. The Commander
5. Method and Discipline

1. The Moral law causes the people to be in complete accord with their ruler so that they will follow him regardless of their lives undismayed by any danger. From this writer’s perspective, moral law is a binding contract that leaves a person no choice to have freedom of movement or thought by his or her own thought process of right or wrong. To only follow, to be unafraid of danger when only following would lead this writer, possibly to their own demise because to make true and pure movements of faith in battle; this has to come from one’s own freedom of thought. To achieve faith at the table or in life; the writer cannot be bound by a contract from a moral law of the ethical.

2. Heaven signifies night and day, cold and heat, times and seasons. The writer is working on faith at the table, Heaven would symbolize true faith and the journey to heaven has not yet been achieved. To think of moving into faith would mean they have left the ethical, and this writer would have made steps to go beyond the knight of resignation from the finite of the impossible to the infinite of thought and movement at the table from achieving faith. Achieving this faith would allow this writer to think beyond any earthly thought, to go beyond tomorrow, or beyond the universe, or to go back to yesterday; meaning the writer goes beyond one’s self and is no more or no less than himself at any one point in time. This would only cease to exist if the writer ceased to exist. Now the writer would never fall short of one’s own possibility in life or at the table. The true existence of being “for itself” would be achieved, instead of being “in itself” because being “in itself” is just like a rock no more or no less it is just a rock and never changes; this writer does not want to be a rock at the table that can be kicked around.

3. Earth comprises distances, great and small; danger and security; open ground and narrow passes; the chances of life and death. Earth represents the battles at the table the writer must go through on a journey towards what he seeks that is beyond the earth he is bound to. Going through these battles the writer has many crossroads to consider. Hoping he will not turn back or choose the wrong path; then only to fall into despair from the battles that bear the scars of the journey. Turning around or choosing the wrong path could lead the writer into the abyss, if this writer stares to long into the abyss; this could rob the writer the pure thought and movement to pick the proper path back to faith. The writer’s game goes through many journeys and to stay on the right path is a constant challenge.

4. The Commander stands for the virtues of wisdom, sincerity, benevolence, courage, and strictness. To understand the story, so far, then understand one person is the one army of battle. The necessary experience must have been gained to have achieved what is represented by the definition of “The Commander”. Battles won at the table have translated to skill of play that will lead the confident commander into future battles. Instinct and mental fortitude will lead the commander to make the proper plays against their opponents. Thus, at some point the commander has stopped being reactive at the table to being active with their play; meaning the commander is thinking on more levels than any opponent he will face. This also can be observed as the movements in battle have come from pure thought gained from experience that lets the commander make the proper play at the table without thought of making a mistake; thus, faith of pure play at the table is achieved. Trusting one’s self will let skill take over in battle when the decisions are the toughest. Do not allow the opponent take this from the commander. Do not fall into the trap and play the opponent’s game, play the commander’s game; after all the commander is better at the game than any of their opponents.

5. By Method and Discipline are to be understood the marshalling of the army in its proper subdivisions, the graduations of rank among the officers, the maintenance of roads by which suppliers may reach the army, and the control of military expenditure. The final battle to link this term to the writers thought process is challenging to say the least. Understanding these concepts to relate to one person and this person is still just an army of one and not an army of many people that have one commander because it is just one person leading chips into battle. The chips are just vessels of pure movement that is an extension of one person’s thoughts that are moving forward to the center of the table. The chips have no moral value. The value of the chips is the writer’s representation of the story being told at the table. Thus, if the writer tells a good story and can read a good story; the writer then has no trail in which to be tracked and their play has successfully been disguised. For example, in bluffing when the writer does not tell the story properly then the bluff did not work leaving them with either having to make the best hand or fold. When the writer reads a good story then the proper play can be made even if this means folding and only paying the minimum. However, the chips of the writer hold more value than that of their opponents. Meaning the writer wants to accumulate chips and not give them back, and not necessarily take people out of the tournament.

Lastly, to disguise a strategy or any play at any given time; the element of surprise of a polarized play leaves the opponent to be constantly guessing against the writer for a time of which the writer has opportunity to take advantage of the opponent. This will lead the opponent into no pure movement of survival. Out thinking an opponent or just wounding them over and over is just as effective as taking them out. The mental anguish of a wounded opponent that is mentally beaten from thought also leads to having control over the tougher opponents at the table the writer will have to battle later. Being disguised by who the writer actually is at the table will let the pure movements of play be untraceable to their opponents that should lead a weary opponent into despair or failure. Whether the writer plays within the ethical or the religious he understands that at any given time and place at the table; the sheep sometimes will slay the butcher and this is the reality in which the writer lives. To underestimate an opponent the writer then would be forfeiting their faith.
 
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Correction

After thinking about the response, the writer was actually wrong with the assessment of "Moral Law". The social contract which is binding from moral law is what the ethical is bound to. To say this writer goes by no "Moral Law" when it comes to poker is false. The binding contract of the social and the ethical in poker society is what the writer is doing when he plays within the ethical only when the writer steps into the religious does the this have no bounds but will come back to the ethical and still will be bound by the "Moral Law".


Then to go one step further, "Heaven" then would also not change because "Heaven" then would represent what is signifies and the definition then would be true because of the "Moral Law". For example, all of what "Heaven" represents would be exactly as it is described only this would change when the writer enters the religious. However, this is a stretch to link such a thing because of what both terms originally mean and signify to the reader. But one's thoughts are what they are and to think beyond the possible to what could be is always what this reader strives to accomplish.
 
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BearPlay

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We're missing you, CP.

Hope all is well with you, buddy.
 
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I found a book regarding the relation between 'art of war' and poker.

[ame="http://www.amazon.com/Tournament-Poker-And-The-Art/dp/081840647X"]Tournament Poker And The Art Of War: David Apostolico: 9780818406478: Amazon.com: Books[/ame]
 
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We're missing you, CP.

Hope all is well with you, buddy.

Sorry had to go on a brief hiatus; i decided to take a spontaneous trip to the hamptons and I actually left all electronic devices at home! Sometimes I just need to step away from the stress of work and smell the roses!

I'll be continuing the Sun Tzu thread shortly (probably today)
 
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After thinking about the response, the writer was actually wrong with the assessment of "Moral Law". The social contract which is binding from moral law is what the ethical is bound to. To say this writer goes by no "Moral Law" when it comes to poker is false. The binding contract of the social and the ethical in poker society is what the writer is doing when he plays within the ethical only when the writer steps into the religious does the this have no bounds but will come back to the ethical and still will be bound by the "Moral Law".


Then to go one step further, "Heaven" then would also not change because "Heaven" then would represent what is signifies and the definition then would be true because of the "Moral Law". For example, all of what "Heaven" represents would be exactly as it is described only this would change when the writer enters the religious. However, this is a stretch to link such a thing because of what both terms originally mean and signify to the reader. But one's thoughts are what they are and to think beyond the possible to what could be is always what this reader strives to accomplish.

You have an interesting perspective on Sun Tzu's work. It seems your interpretation is more theoretical and vague than precise and practically applicable. I am trying to interpret the work in an applicable way so that I may actually put some of the concepts to use at hte poker table: for poker is a "war" in a sense: you versus everyone else. Who better to look to than Sun Tzu on matters of war?
 
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Excerpt #18

The highest form of generalship is to balk the enemy's plans;

the next best is to prevent the junction of the enemy's forces;

the next in order is to attack the enemy's army in the field;

and the worst policy of all is to besiege walled cities.
 
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