Chipper_Tracy42
Enthusiast
Silver Level
- I beg to disagree here, you are SO OBLIGATED to give it back to the cashier. Fine, she made a mistake, but it IS NOW YOUR RESPONSIBILITY TO CORRECT THAT MISTAKE!!!! I'm with MediaBlitz here, and i feel the same way on what he feels- shocked and dismayed at the comments and current results of the poll. I was raised as a catholic- regardless if I'm a Christian or not, THE RIGHT THING TO DO IS TO RETURN IT!!! That is not yours, and taking it is just as good as stealing that $20 chips..
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NvrBlufn
Rock Star
Silver Level
Don't keep it if you notice in time. I know this isn't the place to talk about luck, but I have had a similar situation okay and I made the wrong choice and it cursed me. I took money from a nice person, a complete stranger I would never see again, and at the time figured it into my profits for the day. What a killer session I was thinking to myself! What a fool is what I know now. My life (and my luck!) has literally been through the wringer twice ever since and I vow never to make the same mistake again. I never want anyone here to suffer some of the same ups and downs I have either. Put it this way, would you rather take money now and stop winning at the tables?? Or is it better to have an honest/healthy mindset about money always, never succumb to greed and jealously, and consistently receive lovely riches again and again in life? Easy decision right? I'm not going to keep the $20 if it gives me hella grief in the main event... Come on let's keep this in perspective!
S
ScottishMatt
Legend
Silver Level
- I beg to disagree here, you are SO OBLIGATED to give it back to the cashier. Fine, she made a mistake, but it IS NOW YOUR RESPONSIBILITY TO CORRECT THAT MISTAKE!!!! I'm with MediaBlitz here, and i feel the same way on what he feels- shocked and dismayed at the comments and current results of the poll. I was raised as a catholic- regardless if I'm a Christian or not, THE RIGHT THING TO DO IS TO RETURN IT!!! That is not yours, and taking it is just as good as stealing that $20 chips..
I have the freedom to shirk that responsibility if I want.
It's the right thing to do if you base your decisions upon morality, but no one bases their every decision upon morality.
We aren't taking anything.
Chipper_Tracy42
Enthusiast
Silver Level
-Yes,You are! And whether you are basing your decisions on morality or not, returning that extra chips (which are not yours on the first place) is still the right thing to do! And you consider the error of the cashier working hard to earn a living a good fortune that fell into your lap?!? tsk, tsk.. Well, to each his own, then.
I already said my piece and i'll no longer elaborate on this.
PoKeRFoRNiA
Legend
Bronze Level
- I beg to disagree here, you are SO OBLIGATED to give it back to the cashier. Fine, she made a mistake, but it IS NOW YOUR RESPONSIBILITY TO CORRECT THAT MISTAKE!!!! I'm with MediaBlitz here, and i feel the same way on what he feels- shocked and dismayed at the comments and current results of the poll. I was raised as a catholic- regardless if I'm a Christian or not, THE RIGHT THING TO DO IS TO RETURN IT!!! That is not yours, and taking it is just as good as stealing that $20 chips..
There's no authority that'll punish the op for not returning the chip. There are no consequences for not returning the $20 chip. Is it moral? No. But should you return it? yes. Does the op HAVE to? No. But I do believe in karma of what goes around comes around.
Btw, I'm an atheist. I don't believe in religions and I don't believe in god. But regardless, I do believe in morality and I like to put myself in others shoes to see what it would be like if they treated me. If I dropped my money and someone didn't return it to me, then too bad, I can't do anything about it because it'll my fault from the start. If he picked it up during my absence and didn't give it to me, there's nothing else I can do. But just the way I would like it if people returned their money, as people did in the past, I do the same and pay it forward.
J
jackaoliver
Rock Star
Silver Level
Think about it this way, if you give it back to the cashier then you will be seen as a trustfull individual, Therefore next time you are shorted then they will believe you and you are likelly to give you your money.... ttrust works both ways
M
matiusaa
Visionary
Silver Level
The amount extra of $$ you were given does not define if you should keep them or not. If I knew they have given me 20$ more, I would have returned them, because then I would feel guilty about it. If I would have found them on the floor I would have keeped them, but I knew who they belonged to, and I think that is morally wrong
loafes
Legend
Silver Level
I'm a poor 18 year old who cant even afford $20 to make a deposit. My first thought was just keep it, the casinos prey on gamblers providing -ev games and rake in tons so its no big deal. But then seeing peoples responses got me thinking about the employe and considering it does affect the employee as well it's probably best just got do the decent thing and return it.
S
ScottishMatt
Legend
Silver Level
A
Aricamposjr
Rising Star
Bronze Level
I'm with MediaBLITZ too.
In my opinion, if you know that $20 belongs to that person, you should give that person the money back.
Choosing "Not to act" don't take off your fault. Because you knew what you're doing or not doing, so it's a concious act (or no act)
In my opinion, if you know that $20 belongs to that person, you should give that person the money back.
Choosing "Not to act" don't take off your fault. Because you knew what you're doing or not doing, so it's a concious act (or no act)
Mr Sandbag
Legend
Silver Level
Well, guys, I did in fact return the $20.
I'm not going to judge anyone, but I was kind of surprised at the responses in this thread. Here's my take on it:
If I had not returned the money, I set a standard not only for myself but for my peers. When I make a mistake, I'd appreciate it if someone else helped me out and corrected it, but if I took the money, I'd have absolutely no right to be angry or disappointed if one of my errors was taken advantage of. We may think the casino is stingy, greedy, and a bunch of thieves, but we still go there, play their games, and use their services. We would expect them to correct the mistake if we were given too few chips, so why shouldn't we be expected to give back the extra?
Are poker players really any different than casinos? When we sit at a table, we look for the weak players, and do whatever we can to take their money. We justify it (and rightly so) by telling ourselves they have sort of "given us permission" to exploit them, defeat them, and take their money if we can. A casino is the same way, just on a larger scale. When we walk into a casino, we know about the poker rake, the slot machines that are tighter than others, and the table games that are designed to give the casino the long-term edge. When you play, you have "given permission" to the casino to take your money just like the weakest poker player at the table has given you the right to take his.
At the end of the day, the employees in a casino are people like us, with lives, spouses, friends, family, hobbies, etc. They are hired to do a job and are paid to follow the rules strictly. Who are we really sticking it to by taking that extra $20?
I'm not going to judge anyone, but I was kind of surprised at the responses in this thread. Here's my take on it:
If I had not returned the money, I set a standard not only for myself but for my peers. When I make a mistake, I'd appreciate it if someone else helped me out and corrected it, but if I took the money, I'd have absolutely no right to be angry or disappointed if one of my errors was taken advantage of. We may think the casino is stingy, greedy, and a bunch of thieves, but we still go there, play their games, and use their services. We would expect them to correct the mistake if we were given too few chips, so why shouldn't we be expected to give back the extra?
Are poker players really any different than casinos? When we sit at a table, we look for the weak players, and do whatever we can to take their money. We justify it (and rightly so) by telling ourselves they have sort of "given us permission" to exploit them, defeat them, and take their money if we can. A casino is the same way, just on a larger scale. When we walk into a casino, we know about the poker rake, the slot machines that are tighter than others, and the table games that are designed to give the casino the long-term edge. When you play, you have "given permission" to the casino to take your money just like the weakest poker player at the table has given you the right to take his.
At the end of the day, the employees in a casino are people like us, with lives, spouses, friends, family, hobbies, etc. They are hired to do a job and are paid to follow the rules strictly. Who are we really sticking it to by taking that extra $20?
NvrBlufn
Rock Star
Silver Level
Suppose the amount in question was more than a life-changing sum?
What if you walked away from the cage and noticed a $5000 or a $10K chip colored in your stack?!
Granted that is highly unlikely as those chips are usually loud enough to be seen across the room but just for the sake of argument...
1) How awesome would that be?
2) Would you give that one back?
You know now that you are probably going to cost someone at the cage their job, either the one who mishandled your chips or their supervisor. That person may have mouths to feed and/or have worked very hard to get and keep their position (hey, don't we all?) The point is that this situation is not about just taking a little money away from the big rich casino, even though they can afford to cash in your chip.
I feel like we all know it is dishonest. If it requires you to be sneaky then you probably shouldn't be doing it.
For instance, you can't just turn around and put the one chip on the counter in front of the cameras and the same cashier and ask for $10,000 in cash, right?!
Well guys, I will say it again. Having learned my lesson before and taking this kind of an opportunity to disappear into the night with nearly $500 that did not belong to me (I'm being very candid sharing this with you guys because it taught me an important lesson in life).... I would not take anything ever again.
Imagine Aces cracked for the rest of your life (LOL) or never flopping a set again. How would you feel? What if the poker gods just destroy you day in and day out AND that $10,000 becomes your only big score ever and you cannot get ahead in life? Wealth without work is problematic. Go win the money or go make it another way, but don't take it thinking it will solve any of your problems or put you ahead in life. It DOESN'T
What if you walked away from the cage and noticed a $5000 or a $10K chip colored in your stack?!
Granted that is highly unlikely as those chips are usually loud enough to be seen across the room but just for the sake of argument...
1) How awesome would that be?
2) Would you give that one back?
You know now that you are probably going to cost someone at the cage their job, either the one who mishandled your chips or their supervisor. That person may have mouths to feed and/or have worked very hard to get and keep their position (hey, don't we all?) The point is that this situation is not about just taking a little money away from the big rich casino, even though they can afford to cash in your chip.
I feel like we all know it is dishonest. If it requires you to be sneaky then you probably shouldn't be doing it.
For instance, you can't just turn around and put the one chip on the counter in front of the cameras and the same cashier and ask for $10,000 in cash, right?!
Well guys, I will say it again. Having learned my lesson before and taking this kind of an opportunity to disappear into the night with nearly $500 that did not belong to me (I'm being very candid sharing this with you guys because it taught me an important lesson in life).... I would not take anything ever again.
Imagine Aces cracked for the rest of your life (LOL) or never flopping a set again. How would you feel? What if the poker gods just destroy you day in and day out AND that $10,000 becomes your only big score ever and you cannot get ahead in life? Wealth without work is problematic. Go win the money or go make it another way, but don't take it thinking it will solve any of your problems or put you ahead in life. It DOESN'T
Mr Sandbag
Legend
Silver Level
I'd give it back without hesitation.
And I don't believe in karma, but it was quite a profitable session after I gave that money back.
kidkvno1
Sarah's Pet
Bronze Level
dj11
Legend
Silver Level
For $20, no, I would delude myself that there was a promo going on that I was unaware of and write it off as that. After all, it might be likely that I will leave it all in the casino anyway.
If it was a larger amount, as in the cashier was dishing out $100 chips instead of $1 chips (it could happen), I might be tempted to return it. They got cameras and that sort of mistake could be found out pretty quick.
If it was a larger amount, as in the cashier was dishing out $100 chips instead of $1 chips (it could happen), I might be tempted to return it. They got cameras and that sort of mistake could be found out pretty quick.
N
Noamaw
Enthusiast
Silver Level
In my opinion it doesn't make a differenice if its 20, 500 or 1000000 it is stealing and if you don't draw the line at zero then the line tends to slide slowly and you can find yourself thinking its ok to counterfeit money cuz the employee has an insurance!!
Bottom line give it back you didn't pay for it/earn it!
Bottom line give it back you didn't pay for it/earn it!
Chipper_Tracy42
Enthusiast
Silver Level
- ^^ + 1,000
A colleague of mine told me a story that happened to him a year ago. He was dealt AK of diamonds so he raised, a guy from the blinds re-raised him, i don't know how much but to make the story short they were heads up and all in pre-flop. His opponent has AQ of hearts. My colleague had him dominated. Flop was J93r. Turn was a 9. At the turn, my colleague was hoping/praying that no Queens, Jacks or Threes hit the river. But Poker Gods didn't answer him, as a three hits. So, it's a split pot, but the dealer inadvertently ship all the chips to him, never noticed that it was indeed a split pot. The poor guy from the blind also didn't noticed it either as he thought he lost the pot and left. Ditto with the remaining players on the table. Maybe they weren't paying too much attention. What did my colleague do??? You guess it right, He did not do anything because the pot was so big and thinking it was not his fault and an opportunity presented itself - he took the chips. What happened next after that was all downhill from him. Not only that he lost all his chips on hand, he also lost all his remaining money when he re-buy. It's not that he plays awful or that he's a bad player that is not the issue here. We all know what it is!
S
ScottishMatt
Legend
Silver Level
Don't come in here with that bullshit. Attempting to instil some imaginary justice upon reality through the concepts of morality and karma is a complete and utter fallacy.
So he lost all his chips . . . Whoop De Doo!
There isn't one serious poker player on this forum who hasn't dealt with variance greater than the minute quantity that you are professing karma has dealt as a form of justice.
So he lost all his chips . . . Whoop De Doo!
There isn't one serious poker player on this forum who hasn't dealt with variance greater than the minute quantity that you are professing karma has dealt as a form of justice.
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Chipper_Tracy42
Enthusiast
Silver Level
- I forgot to add that what happened to him when he took that chips is not the real issue either. What happened to him after that is immaterial. Whether he won or not. I could even care less of what happened to his next poker session either. The real issue here is TRUST.
We have our own values and beliefs Scottie, if i hurt your feelings with my comments I apologize. And i don't want to illicit violent reactions from here either. To Each His Own, right. I'm done with this, and i'm not here to argue with you anymore. Same thing with everyone else. If ever you don't like any of my comments, take it as a grain of salt. We are all adults here. Let's move on.
S
ScottishMatt
Legend
Silver Level
What a nice post. It's good to have a mature outcome, something that seems rare as of late
And no worries, I didn't have any feelings invested in our little back and forth. There is no need to apologise.
I take it from the trust part that you no longer trust said colleague?
zEric7x
Visionary
Silver Level
...yeah...I would keep the money and not care.
edit OK I thought about it some more and I might return it if I am good mood or I might just run out of there if I am in a bad one. I know that sounds lame but when I get angry I can see me taking it.
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