Pot control confusion

[BEEFMADRAS]

Hi all
Can you help?
I was playing a 45 player sng on stars and got to the final table. There was 4 of us left all with about 15-20 bbs. I am in the bb with AKs. The action folds to the sb and they raise 3.5 bbs, I in turn shoved all in. Sb calls and shows pocket 10s anyway I lost the hand but i was fairly happy with my play.
But something is bugging me- Should I have flat called for pot control? In this situation guys what would you do? A flat call saves your stack, a raise makes you pot committed and an all in as you can see loses you the tourney.
And before anyone says it no I prob wouldnt have posted this if I had won the hand!!! but i welcome your answers

 

[drgilbert4]

I may have flat called there and waited for the flop. There is not a lot of play left after the flop in this hand, so if you miss and you don't think you can make him fold by shoving, you can just fold to any bet. If you ended up having to fold, you still have one more shot at doubling up and staying alive. That being said, it is more likely that I would have shoved the same as you did because if you win this hand, you are a favorite to win the tourney.

 

[Stu_Ungar]

No.

You arent deep enough.

You were at worst a slight underdog.

However if there were no A or K on the flop you would have to fold to a bet or giveup after investing about 20% of your stack.

If there were an ace or K on the flop you probably wouldnt double up; he would fold a lot of his range.

You arent deep enough to play any form of pot control.

 

[BEEFMADRAS]

So is it shove for you stu?

 

[Stu_Ungar]

15-20BB against a sb open shove AK!

 

[jdeliverer]

Hi all
Can you help?
I was playing a 45 player sng on stars and got to the final table. There was 4 of us left all with about 15-20 bbs. I am in the bb with AKs. The action folds to the sb and they raise 3.5 bbs, I in turn shoved all in. Sb calls and shows pocket 10s anyway I lost the hand but i was fairly happy with my play.
But something is bugging me- Should I have flat called for pot control? In this situation guys what would you do? A flat call saves your stack, a raise makes you pot committed and an all in as you can see loses you the tourney.
And before anyone says it no I prob wouldnt have posted this if I had won the hand!!! but i welcome your answers

Easy shove - you know he's going to bet the flop and he'll almost certainly be pot committed. Your hand isn't strong enough to prefer that over the fold equity of a shove preflop. You don't want to be wasting a quarter of your stack if a bad flop hits and you can't continue.

 

[absoluthamm]

Absolutely. Along with that I would have open-shoved if I was the SB with the pocket 10s as well...

 

[NCfoldem]

Oh, like "wow" man .. I'm soooo confused right now. I definitely need better pot control.

 

[norriscjn]

I would have done the same thing. He coud of had ace rag and that what it looked like

 

[akaCLINT]

definetly shove with 15 BB..., with AK you are up for a flip against any pair other than AA and KK and ahead of the rest..., go 4 it and if you win you take it down...

GL

aC

 

[dwolfg]

Absolutely shoving in that situation is the best option.

 

[Rldetheflop]

definite shove there. By this stage of the tourney stealing is going on big time so most of the time there you catch a thief with his hand in the cookie jar and pick up his raise. The majority of the rest of the times your at worst a flip. Plus there is enough fold equity that you can get some middle pairs to fold.

 

[rounder22]

Your play was definately the right play you shove you have fold equity, if you call you have no idea where you are in the hand if it comes no ace or king.

 

[engman]

I think you should have flat called. I think if you get that far, you should never push unless you already have a made hand. AK is a strong hand, but in the end it is still just ace high. I would have called and if not hit and the guy raised. I would have folded. When you get that far, you do not need to unnecessarily push, unless your pushing into someone with a smaller stack or if you have a small stack. Good luck on future tournaments.

 

[absoluthamm]

I think you should have flat called. I think if you get that far, you should never push unless you already have a made hand. AK is a strong hand, but in the end it is still just ace high. I would have called and if not hit and the guy raised. I would have folded. When you get that far, you do not need to unnecessarily push, unless your pushing into someone with a smaller stack or if you have a small stack. Good luck on future tournaments.

You've never read any articles or books on SnG's have you? This completely disregards the any push/fold strategy that a successful SnG player wins by... Read Collin Moshman's Sit 'N Go Strategy, you have a lot to learn

 

[bonflizubi]

I think you should have flat called. I think if you get that far, you should never push unless you already have a made hand. AK is a strong hand, but in the end it is still just ace high. I would have called and if not hit and the guy raised. I would have folded. When you get that far, you do not need to unnecessarily push, unless your pushing into someone with a smaller stack or if you have a small stack. Good luck on future tournaments.

No offense- but this is the WORST advice ever if you want to win.
All the money is in the top 3. You are at the final table. play aggressive, play to win. If there is ever a spot to take a flip it is here. And besides, a good % of the time that shove isn't called, or is called by say AQ AJ and you are way ahead.

Calling on that short a stack is a major leak. you can't trap with AK on 15bb. You want to flat kings or aces? OK. But giving up 2- 2.5bb to flat a flop that you are going to miss 2/3 of the time and be faced with a c-bet 75% of the time is a complete -eV play. All yo uare likely doing is making yourself even shorter- and at this point your fold equity is so important to keep - you need to be a threat to other stacks. (precisely why many of those guys raising into you are folding - especially if it's from late position).

engman- do you play a lot live I guess? seems like a live play to just call there.