Freeroll culture has hurt poker....

[CHILOWWW]

It is the dream that we have many players, but it is not easy and less undisciplined, daily training, without positive mentality and patience is the most important. in the race to be professional the obstacle d edejar things we previously interested more like playing football and spending time with friends is somewhat complicated but eventually if controlled not to fall into vice and know allocate time is be professional is a goal that can be accomplished either short or long term, is often not luck that helps our cards are the best and that's why this game needs much study and dedication

 

[A2345Razz]

Newer players losing their bankroll should think of it as tuition costs.

They pay the more experienced players by giving up their bankrolls in exchange for valuable poker lessons.

This was common knowledge/belief a decade ago when poker flourished; I am not sure when the notion of losing a bit at the beginning of your career became odd; probably around the time the games started getting smaller/worse as every metric shows them to be doing ONLINE right now.

I think it's true the play from freerolls bleeds into the real money games a bit and ruins the integrity of the game for some, but it also is one of the best ways to bring new players into the game, and a lot of new players might think the style of play they see is the norm.

I agree, which is why I AM NOT AGAINST freerolls IN GENERAL.

I am against "freeroll culture,," which is not synonymous with FREEROLLS.

People need to actually take the time to figure out what I meant/mean by FREEROLL CULTURE and then formulate an opinion on it....

Agree with most of the concepts discussed here. However, I have actually cashed in the freerolls which allowed my to enter a few micro games and then cashed that into a few bonus games and bingo... I'm at about $25 in ACR. I have not deposited ever in ACR (they keep calling me :0 ). But why deposit when I continue (albeit slowly) to build my stash this way?

To accelerate your growth and allow you to play more/better games/tourneys of course.

I disagree about the freeroll culture ruining poker. I think that it actually helps to draw in people that would have never deposited in the first place if not for the freerolls. I found this to be the case for the older generation. I have a few uncles who play poker with play money and after winning like $1 in freerolls they feel the excitement of betting with real money and then they deposit when their freeroll money runs out. I think this was the original idea of having freerolls in the first place. And let me tell you, it's working as intended.

Right, which is why I AM NOT AGAINST ALL FREEROLLS.

**sigh**

There is a lot of different ways to derive a monetary gain from athletics. I think most people figure if you practice enough then I would say that most people are looking to get a college scholarship out of the time and money spent which would be the reward. I would not say that most figure they will some day play professionally but I see poker very similarly. People will play for all kinds of reasons from recreational, way to escape, mind health, pay a few bills, etc. I also disagree that anything has hurt poker, I really see the recent growth of the game publicly as only the beginning of a very long period of the game. Seems like there is always a new name on TV winning the next huge tournament which shows that people can come out of nowhere. It is not always the same small group seen on TV and never anyone else. I also disagree with the use of a collective "we" so that somehow im included in have sold dreams or something. I havent done any of that. I like how freerolls give people a chance to win without having to deposit money. They also give people a reason to log-on and I usually play some cash games while im in a freeroll which generates profits for the site. The freerolls are obviously paid out as promotions from the site's profit which in turn gives someone a chance without a deposit. I know from first hand experience, there are all kinds of things that can go wrong after winning a few bucks from a freeroll. The player might build it up a little but then go on a downswing and lose it all, but at that point, want to play more without having to somehow cash in a massive freeroll and make a deposit. That is just an example of how freerolls actually increase deposits. On the other hand, if a player is good enough to cash in a freeroll, practice bankroll management and be both good enough and lucky enough to never go bust and win thats great and more power to them but most beginners wont have the ability to do that. Also, freerolls are a chance to practice without having to put in much like play money. I think 500 to play .01/.02 is too much. At a .40 minimum buy-in $40 is really enough to have a 1% buy-in as to not risk to much but the concept suggested here is that, beginners should buy in for like 500 bucks and play $1 BB so that i can get rich, and i completely disagree with entire post. It makes no sense to me at all.

So much fail in this wall O'text, but the worst of the worst is you stubbornly/sadly clinging to the idea that people play sports- in most cases- in order to get scholarships. Have you seen a HS football game?

You think those millions of white kids who run 5.3 40s think they're getting scholarships once they turn 16 ?

Why do they keep investing tonnes of time and tonnes of energy/money into playing. Why, bc they ENJOY PLAYING FOOTBALL FOR THE SAKE OF FOOTBALL.

The 45 yr old guys playing and spending on golf every weekend to get away from the wife/work.....to you their main motivation is eventually becoming a pro?

This makes sense to you?

It's called a hobby, and we often spend money on supporting our hobbies to varying degrees.

Well, nice line of thought although I don't agree 100%, however yes, I play poker just for fun, have deposited some money, lost it all but still have fun with it! And I play freerolls because they don't make me feel bad when I loose and when I win, I can play other games and if I loose, well, I started with 0 anyway..

Poker for me is Fun! If I don't earn money from it, np, I had fun anyway. If I start winning, then well, I'm a happy bastard! ehehehe

Sounds like what I would hope many beginning players would be like in a healthy ecosystem.

 

[partz]

Its pretty hard to start gain serious money without depositing some cash first, but as I said its hard not impossible. My first deposit was about of couple of $ then i start gain some cash from the 100k tourney and so on. Now I have in mind to participate into a big torney like Sunday M as soon my income will pass the $1k barrier

 

[Jarod1231]

I really have to disagree with this... before black Friday I personally had turned freeroll winnings into a $2,000 bankroll on fulltilt

 

[MidMoMan]

That's great,but did you get to actually cash?

 

[A2345Razz]

Its pretty hard to start gain serious money without depositing some cash first, but as I said its hard not impossible. My first deposit was about of couple of $ then i start gain some cash from the 100k tourney and so on. Now I have in mind to participate into a big torney like Sunday M as soon my income will pass the $1k barrier

Sounds awesome....way better than grinding freerolls forever for at most 1/5th of minimum wage.

I really have to disagree with this... before black Friday I personally had turned freeroll winnings into a $2,000 bankroll on fulltilt

So what are we disagreeing on again?

Congrats on doing that....seems like a nice thing that happened.

Again, im not sure where we disagree?

 

[billbaffles]

I am allowed to completely disagree without being disrespectful but when the response is "so much fail in this "wail"o'text i know the type of person im interacting with and although i could continue with more explanation, there was nothing really pointed out about what i said that was "fail". I am well aware that people join clubs, go to church, play poker, etc. for a ton of social, physical, personal, and other various reasons, none of them being, play professionally. I disagree that beginners should ever have to deposit and should always freeroll in and play the lowest stakes to play higher levels. If you cant beat level 1, why would you ever buy-in to try to beat level 2. You grind 1/5th minimum wage to start, then you grind that up and move up, then grind that up, and move up, and eventually, you have lots of money. I agree that if beginners dont buy in for 500 bucks, you will never get rich, but since your abusive and disrespectful remarks about my post with labeling of course, that, would not make the least bit of difference, in your case, because I see your disrespectful type at the tables, all the time, losers. I kind of got the feeling initially, and from what i have read, like 90% of poker players dont win, so I would try not to take it heart and disrespect people, you are part of the masses. I would agree, that a complete beginner, with no knowledge of the game, sitting down, with $500 bucks, is your best chance, which is your whole argument, and for you, I dont disagree. I wont be posting anymore in this thread because I stay away from the labeling abusers in general, it is something that is good for my game. And yes, for players like you, the dream is over unless you make more of an effort instead of attacking winners like myself. I havent won a ton, but im up this year, let me get my calculator, 10,700% and Im slowly moving up in stakes. I may never get rich, but it sure is fun.

 

[A2345Razz]

Is he ok?


FTR, I am a winning player and a quick perusal of sharkscope or OPR can show you some of my stats for MTTs.

The fact remains there are significant reasons one would in fact deposit even without much expectation of winning right away and those have been addressed already.

If no one is depositing, and im not sure if the slower thinkers have caught on to this yet, there is going to be no poker as it is known now.

NO POKER WITHOUT SOME PEOPLE DEPOSITING......

I am truly shocked that people can't grasp that we need beginners to be depositing continually for the poker ecosystem to churn/operate.

I just am at a loss as to where these people think the money in the system comes from?

I am allowed to completely disagree without being disrespectful but when the response is "so much fail in this "wail"o'text i know the type of person im interacting with and although i could continue with more explanation, there was nothing really pointed out about what i said that was "fail". I am well aware that people join clubs, go to church, play poker, etc. for a ton of social, physical, personal, and other various reasons, none of them being, play professionally. I disagree that beginners should ever have to deposit and should always freeroll in and play the lowest stakes to play higher levels. If you cant beat level 1, why would you ever buy-in to try to beat level 2. You grind 1/5th minimum wage to start, then you grind that up and move up, then grind that up, and move up, and eventually, you have lots of money. I agree that if beginners dont buy in for 500 bucks, you will never get rich, but since your abusive and disrespectful remarks about my post with labeling of course, that, would not make the least bit of difference, in your case, because I see your disrespectful type at the tables, all the time, losers. I kind of got the feeling initially, and from what i have read, like 90% of poker players dont win, so I would try not to take it heart and disrespect people, you are part of the masses. I would agree, that a complete beginner, with no knowledge of the game, sitting down, with $500 bucks, is your best chance, which is your whole argument, and for you, I dont disagree. I wont be posting anymore in this thread because I stay away from the labeling abusers in general, it is something that is good for my game. And yes, for players like you, the dream is over unless you make more of an effort instead of attacking winners like myself. I havent won a ton, but im up this year, let me get my calculator, 10,700% and Im slowly moving up in stakes. I may never get rich, but it sure is fun.

 

[ProPoker723]

freerolls a waste of time in my view...

So many people playing who don't have a clue. very little skill is involved in free rolls. 8 times out of 10 the first hand you get the whole table goes all in. Then again on the next hand, and again. That does nothing for the game, luck is needed but the most is strategy, when this is not involved its ****. I enjoy cash games which are the best way to make money in the game, and having 1-2 times a week a tourney to mix this up.

That's just my view on freerolls and why...

 

[JaneMars312]

The most freeroll players are so crazy