Set over Set situations...

[Ronaldadio]

Here was a hand from today....CAN YOU SAY COOOOOLER!!! LMAO!!!

This is a cooler to an extent, but its a very draw heavy board. I think, if there was real money involved or your tourney life was on the line, folding any of those hands would have been a good move - regardless of the outcome.

What I don`t know, however, is how the money got in - all in preflop, all in on flop, etc. - I`m guessing raise with KK, 2 callers. Then chips all in on the flop?

 

[cAPSLOCK]

This is a cooler to an extent, but its a very draw heavy board. I think, if there was real money involved or your tourney life was on the line, folding any of those hands would have been a good move - regardless of the outcome.

What I don`t know, however, is how the money got in - all in preflop, all in on flop, etc. - I`m guessing raise with KK, 2 callers. Then chips all in on the flop?

There WAS real money involved. But that is no real consideration. "Folding any of those hands" is a TERRIBLE idea in my opinion.

Of course all the money got in on the flop... it would be fairly miraculous if it had not. I would think PNJs_dad's fistpump was slightly dampened by the post flop enthusiasm... but how could you fold here? It is too tight.

That is a true "cold deck" situation. That is a true cooler.

 

[PNJs_dad]

Yeppers...the money got in pretty quick. I bet, dude to my left raised, and the guy with the Kings pushed. What truly sucked is that the dude on my left got out easy since the guys with KK was a shorter stack so he got a refund by winning the side pot.

 

[katymaty]

Here was a hand from today....CAN YOU SAY COOOOOLER!!! LMAO!!!

Thats nothing, couple of months ago ran into 3 sets on flop, quads on turn then better quads on river

 

[ALL IN CLUBS]

im shovin all-in on flop

freakin turn so sick

Wish my cards would just hold

 

[ALL IN CLUBS]

IT says i am 98% to winn the hand

98% to win the hand thats 98% to win the hand did i say 98% :motz: :icon_stud uke:

 

[xdeucesx]

full tilt poker $0.05/$0.10 No Limit Hold'em - 9 players - View hand 990262
DeucesCracked Poker Videos Hand History Converter
UTG: $11.89
UTG+1: $12.47
UTG+2: $4.00
MP1: $6.31
MP2: $5.95
CO: $10.00
BTN: $8.11
SB: $14.02
Hero (BB): $8.87
Pre Flop: ($0.15) Hero is BB with 4 :club: 4 :heart:
2 folds, UTG+2 raises to $0.40, MP1 calls $0.40, 4 folds, Hero calls $0.30
Flop: ($1.25) 4 :spade: 8 :diamond: 9 :heart: (3 players)
Hero checks, UTG+2 bets $1, MP1 calls $1, Hero raises to $2.70, UTG+2 raises to $3.60 all in, MP1 raises to $5.91 all in, Hero calls $3.21
Turn: ($16.67) J :diamond: (3 players - 2 are all in)
River: ($16.67) Q :heart: (3 players - 2 are all in)

he fliped over 99 and KK...set over set haha atleast it wasnt >200bbs

 

[Olddog21]

Sets!

Funny you should ask because it's usually the small sets that are my downfall....espcially when I catch two decent pairs on the flop and the third card in the flop is a 2,3 or 4! I think my main concern is chip stack size and proximity to prize money...If I'm all ready in-the-money ...and it's just a matter of how much I'm going to win....I push my chips in!:musicus: :musicus: :musicus:

 

[fx20736]

I was not even at the table a full orbit. Special!

Full Tilt - $0.02 NL - Holdem - 8 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3: http://www.pokertracker.com
SB: $1.03
Hero (BB): $2.00
UTG: $2.05
UTG+1: $1.99
MP: $1.97
MP+1: $2.14
CO: $2.54
BTN: $2.89
SB posts SB $0.01, Hero posts BB $0.02
Pre Flop: ($0.03) Hero has Qs Qd
fold, fold, fold, fold, fold, BTN raises to $0.06, fold, Hero raises to $0.19, BTN calls $0.13
Flop: ($0.39, 2 players) Ad Ts 3c
Hero checks, BTN checks
Turn: ($0.39, 2 players) Th
Hero bets $0.21, BTN calls $0.21
River: ($0.81, 2 players) Qc
Hero bets $0.34, BTN raises to $2.49 and is all-in, Hero calls $1.26 and is all-in
BTN shows Ah As (Full House, Aces full of Tens)
Hero mucks Qs Qd (Full House, Queens full of Tens)
BTN wins $3.75

 

[cAPSLOCK]

Ah the re-suck psych...

 

[GotaLovePoke]

Folding a set? Nahhhh.....

 

[Mr Whatever]

alot of these issues can be dealt with ur preflop play.

for me it it really depends on position. i usually ditch small pairs preflop especially in the later positions if i see the pot has been raised and is still gonna go multiway because ppl coming in the pot usually have a pair and ur gonna get into trap if u hit with a lower pair, like the issue that the original poster is addressing.

i learned this from playing omaha 8 where 2nd best always loses money. this set vs set issue doesnt show up of course as much in holdem as with omaha 8 but its the same lesson.

and the odd thing about this set vs set situation is its a really bad spot for beginners because it doesnt come up that much but when it does, a lot of em are willing to risk a lot regardless of texture of the board or other factors and lose alot with hand because of expectations.

another thing about this hand is that since it doesnt happen alot while playing holdem- if u get into this spot and lose a lot of $, ur gonna have to play a considerable amount of regular hands for this situation to come up again to balance ur spreadsheets for this specific type of hand and allow the law of probability factor "where ur suppose to win" with this type of hand to play a factor. and this might be a real problem for ppl that either dont play a lot or dont have a big bankroll.


gl

 

[papagallo]

Is there any way to get away from a hand where you are bottom or middle set? I ran a set of 2s into a set of Jacks yesterday. So just wondering if anyone else has a problem with this. Luckily, it hasn't happened to me often.

NO!!! Either I'm going broke or doubling up. bet-raise-reraise-shove on the flop. keep repeating until you have a monster bankroll.

Curious though. Was the pot unraised preflop? If it was 3-bet to me I'd have folded the deuces pre.

I LOVE looking down at 222 - 555.

 

[fx20736]

Full Tilt - $0.02 NL - Holdem - 7 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 3
BTN: $2.19
SB: $2.00
BB: $1.98
UTG: $1.09
UTG+1: $2.01
MP: $1.94
Hero (CO): $2.19
SB posts SB $0.01, BB posts BB $0.02
Pre Flop: ($0.03) Hero has A:spade: T:heart:
fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to $0.07, fold, fold, BB raises to $0.12, Hero calls $0.05
Flop: ($0.25, 2 players) 8:spade: Q:spade: 3:spade:
BB bets $0.26, Hero calls $0.26
Turn: ($0.77, 2 players) K:diamond:
BB bets $1.60 and is all-in, Hero calls $1.60
River: ($3.97, 2 players) 3:diamond:
BB shows 7:diamond: 9:diamond: (One Pair, Threes)
Hero shows A:spade: T:heart: (One Pair, Threes)
Hero wins $3.71

 

[timboslice4]

If a player bets 2/3 the flop after the flop and he has a higher set than me there is no way im going to be able to throw my hand away unless the board is really scary, but i would never put him on a higher set. If my opponent slow plays then i could lay down a set, but i would still have to have a solid read on this player

 

[earneri]

im shovin all-in on flop View attachment 33152

freakin turn so sick View attachment 33153

Wish my cards would just hold

This is a situation where I think one could possibly get away from their set. Another example, say you put your opponent on AK or AQ you have 33, flop comes out AQ3, or AK3 you see turn and its an A,K or Q, depending on situation, you could get away from your hand there too.

 

[ALL IN CLUBS]

This is a situation where I think one could possibly get away from their set. Another example, say you put your opponent on AK or AQ you have 33, flop comes out AQ3, or AK3 you see turn and its an A,K or Q, depending on situation, you could get away from your hand there too.

Just curious, you flop a fullhouse and your going to get away from it?? Wow

 

[GotaLovePoke]

I thought of you today, VERY SCARY but damn, the hand says it all:

pokerstars Game #51559031252: Hold'em No Limit ($0.01/$0.02 USD) - 2010/10/23 17:13:37 ET
Table 'Protogeneia IV' 9-max Seat #9 is the button
Seat 1: goguxxl ($1.73 in chips)
Seat 2: benpokermuc ($2.01 in chips)
Seat 3: GotaLovePoke ($3.78 in chips)
Seat 4: Henk008 ($2.71 in chips)
Seat 5: ajfa11 ($5 in chips)
Seat 6: 7alexc7 ($2.27 in chips)
Seat 7: 71HigWil74 ($1.67 in chips)
Seat 8: BirraChicha ($5.11 in chips)
Seat 9: Xoren83 ($2.35 in chips)
goguxxl: posts small blind $0.01
benpokermuc: posts big blind $0.02
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to GotaLovePoke [6s 6d]
GotaLovePoke: calls $0.02
Henk008: folds
ajfa11: folds
7alexc7: calls $0.02
71HigWil74: folds
BirraChicha: calls $0.02
Xoren83: folds
goguxxl: calls $0.01
benpokermuc: checks
*** FLOP *** [Tc 6c 3d]
goguxxl: checks
benpokermuc: checks
GotaLovePoke: bets $0.06
7alexc7: calls $0.06
BirraChicha: raises $0.06 to $0.12
goguxxl: folds
benpokermuc: calls $0.12
GotaLovePoke: raises $0.80 to $0.92
7alexc7: folds
BirraChicha: raises $0.80 to $1.72
benpokermuc: calls $1.60
GotaLovePoke: raises $2.04 to $3.76 and is all-in
BirraChicha: raises $1.33 to $5.09 and is all-in
benpokermuc: calls $0.27 and is all-in
Uncalled bet ($1.33) returned to BirraChicha
goguxxl said, "interesting"
*** TURN *** [Tc 6c 3d] [Jh]
*** RIVER *** [Tc 6c 3d Jh] [9s]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
GotaLovePoke: shows [6s 6d] (three of a kind, Sixes)
BirraChicha: shows [Kh Kc] (a pair of Kings)
GotaLovePoke collected $3.36 from side pot
benpokermuc: shows [Ac Jc] (a pair of Jacks)
goguxxl said, "lol"
GotaLovePoke collected $5.83 from main pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $9.67 Main pot $5.83. Side pot $3.36. | Rake $0.48
Board [Tc 6c 3d Jh 9s]
Seat 1: goguxxl (small blind) folded on the Flop
Seat 2: benpokermuc (big blind) showed [Ac Jc] and lost with a pair of Jacks
Seat 3: GotaLovePoke showed [6s 6d] and won ($9.19) with three of a kind, Sixes
Seat 4: Henk008 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: ajfa11 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: 7alexc7 folded on the Flop
Seat 7: 71HigWil74 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: BirraChicha showed [Kh Kc] and lost with a pair of Kings
Seat 9: Xoren83 (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)

 

[fx20736]

I analyzed my amt won for pps 22-66 (over 50,000 hands)and they're all losers, in part because of set over set. Going forward I will not set mine pps under 77.

 

[GotaLovePoke]

I analyzed my amt won for pps 22-66 (over 50,000 hands)and they're all losers, in part because of set over set. Going forward I will not set mine pps under 77.

Are you sure its not mostly flush/straight.

 

[cjatud2012]

I analyzed my amt won for pps 22-66 (over 50,000 hands)and they're all losers, in part because of set over set. Going forward I will not set mine pps under 77.

Why? I find that hard to believe, set over set happens like > 1% of the time... That can't account for all your losses. No offense obv I wish I could provide more insight but I'm not really a cash player nor am I really savvy at analyzing PT3 stats, etc.

 

[fx20736]

Are you sure its not mostly flush/straight.

yes

Why? I find that hard to believe, set over set happens like > 1% of the time... That can't account for all your losses. No offense obv I wish I could provide more insight but I'm not really a cash player nor am I really savvy at analyzing PT3 stats, etc.

I've run into set over set 5 times in the past 3 days, got stacked each time. That's 500 bb. If I dug up all the times I've lost set over set and figured out the bb lost and then calculate how often I was dealt those pairs it definitely would be a significant leak IMO.

 

[coolnout]

going broke everytime, and it's a horrible way to play poker putting your opponent on a set everytime you flop a set. lolz.

 

[cjatud2012]

I've run into set over set 5 times in the past 3 days, got stacked each time. That's 500 bb. If I dug up all the times I've lost set over set and figured out the bb lost and then calculate how often I was dealt those pairs it definitely would be a significant leak IMO.

That's three days, though. I know you said your original sample is ~50k hands, but even that's not huge. I would certainly estimate that most of your losses come from overplaying when you don't hit a set.

 

[WVHillbilly]

DON'T FOLD SETS!!!! EVER!!!

Locking this since everything past this post is either stupid, a bad beat post, or a +1.