Countering the LAG with Calling Station Style

blueskies

blueskies

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I think most will agree that the toughest opponents to play are the LAGs.

If you catch your cards and make big hands, you are gonna get paid. But most times we aren't gonna do better than top pair and a lot of times these guys give us pause by strange raises.

The only way I've found to counter the aggression is just to call them down lighter than usual. The results are mixed. Sometimes they are bluffing and sometimes they did catch a bigger piece of the board than you with their trash hands.

However, the mixed bag is still better than the sure -EV of folding, which is a loss 100% of the time.

Play strong starting hands and don't be afraid to call them down. You gotta show'em that they can't bluff you around. Sometimes they don't get the msg and calm down a bit, and that makes it easier to play them.
 
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Hermus

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Great advice! Often in poker, the best exploitative play is to do the opposite of what your opponent is doing. Let the over-bluffing LAG hang himself by calling more, let the TAG overfold by bluffing the river etc. I'll only go as far as to not really open myself up to be exploited though.
However, the mixed bag is still better than the sure -EV of folding, which is a loss 100% of the time.


This statement doesn't add up though. Folding just has an EV of 0. Which may or may not be lower than calling or raising.
 
blueskies

blueskies

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This statement doesn't add up though. Folding just has an EV of 0. Which may or may not be lower than calling or raising.

What I meant is that if you are already involved in the hand, by folding you are losing all equity. Yes if you fold preflop and you are not the blinds, then it's 0 EV.

To be clear, I don't mean calling with anything. Just calling lighter.
 
Plut41

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But what do you do when you play against aggressive calling stations? :D Currently trying to beat 0,01/0, 02. Some people go crazy with J2, some limp and call whatever you bet with aces. You bet preflop and 4 guys call you. You hit your top pair, then cbet and get reraised twice. You throw your hand away and look how 3 of them go all in with mediocre trash. *Big sigh*
 
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Hermus

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What I meant is that if you are already involved in the hand, by folding you are losing all equity. Yes if you fold preflop and you are not the blinds, then it's 0 EV.

To be clear, I don't mean calling with anything. Just calling lighter.


Folding is by definition 0 EV regardless of the size of the pot. It's true you fold your equity share but saying that folding is anything other than 0 EV is just not true. Don't get me wrong, I wholeheartedly agree with the advice you give, just not this tiny part about how you phrase it.
 
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pepomjp

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Very good advise. You need to let them make the mistakes and then make them pay.
 
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pepomjp

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But what do you do when you play against aggressive calling stations? :D Currently trying to beat 0,01/0, 02. Some people go crazy with J2, some limp and call whatever you bet with aces. You bet preflop and 4 guys call you. You hit your top pair, then cbet and get reraised twice. You throw your hand away and look how 3 of them go all in with mediocre trash. *Big sigh*

Only patience to trap them.
 
Plut41

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Only patience to trap them.
It's what I try to do but sometimes I do same stupid mistakes.
1) Never bluff a fish
2) Don't play too fast. Let them do the work for you.
3) Try to read hands and play poker, not just brainlessly trying to hit card and what not.
 
blueskies

blueskies

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But what do you do when you play against aggressive calling stations? :D Currently trying to beat 0,01/0, 02. Some people go crazy with J2, some limp and call whatever you bet with aces. You bet preflop and 4 guys call you. You hit your top pair, then cbet and get reraised twice. You throw your hand away and look how 3 of them go all in with mediocre trash. *Big sigh*

What you are describing is a loose player but not a calling station.

The calling station is the player who calls you down and rarely folds or raises after the hand goes to the flop.

Normally that is a losing style against good players, but against very aggro opponents, it can work.
 
Poker_Mike

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What you are describing is a loose player but not a calling station.

The calling station is the player who calls you down and rarely folds or raises after the hand goes to the flop.

Normally that is a losing style against good players, but against very aggro opponents, it can work.


Yes, after I determine that a player is playing with an overly aggressive style - I might call that player down with only a small pocket pair in my hand.

The usual tell is they will make a very big bet on the flop for apparently no reason (other than just trying to motivate you to fold).

Of course they could wake up with a big hand eventually.
Good luck !
 
Poker_Mike

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What you are describing is a loose player but not a calling station.

The calling station is the player who calls you down and rarely folds or raises after the hand goes to the flop.

Normally that is a losing style against good players, but against very aggro opponents, it can work.


Yes, after I determine that a player is playing with an overly aggressive style - I might call that player down with only a small pocket pair in my hand.

The usual tell is they will make a very big bet on the flop for apparently no reason (other than just trying to motivate you to fold).

Of course they could wake up with a big hand eventually.

Good luck !
 
blueskies

blueskies

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Sometimes against a loose donk it's good to check on the river when you are OOP.
If you think he's been floating you with junk and will fold to your third barrel, it's best to check and let him try to steal the pot.
Against a good player or a calling station, you should be value betting, but you just gotta adjust against the bad ones.

I just had a hand where I took almost the guy's entire stack. Against a good player, I probably would have gotten one street of value at best.

I raised with TT from UTG+1 on 10NL 6-max. BTN (the loose floater type) calls and BB calls.

Flop's 269 rainbow. I cbet about 80% of the pot and BTN calls while BB folds. Turn's another 2 and I bet big again knowing who I am up against. He calls again.

The turn's a 7. No flush draws, and if he has 85 or 8T, he got there. But anyway, I am pretty sure I am ahead here. But knowing this dude's style, he may not have a hand that will call a third barrel. I checked expecting him to try to steal. And sure enough he throws out almost a pot size bet. I call and I win. Dude had two overcards. If I bet the river (which would have been a smaller size bet than his bluff) he would have folded.

Afterwards I thought to myself I should have shoved. He only had a bit of coins left and may have said the hell with it and called a shove anyway. So I left a little money on the table there.
 
Plut41

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What you are describing is a loose player but not a calling station.

The calling station is the player who calls you down and rarely folds or raises after the hand goes to the flop.

Normally that is a losing style against good players, but against very aggro opponents, it can work.
There are mostly calling stations that stick to river with like Jack high. I wish I could find some stream record where a player crushes this limit to pick up on things he's doing.
 
blueskies

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Since I've made the adjustment the results have improved a lot. Win rate been shooting up lately. Now that I am calling, I find that the majority of them are actually floating with nothing (not even a draw) and then will bet around pot size to steal when I check the river.

I am just trying to tag as many of these guys as I can.
 
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