$5 NLHE 6-max: Top of Range v Fish on low board

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teh_colonel_saigon

teh_colonel_saigon

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help me out bros! How do we play this flop? Does this work vs other players?

Yatahay Network - $0.05 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

SB: 173.4 BB
BB: 100 BB
UTG: 54.6 BB
MP: 116.4 BB
Hero (CO): 117.2 BB
BTN: 100 BB

SB posts SB 0.4 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has A:diamond: K:heart:

fold, fold, Hero raises to 3.4 BB, BTN calls 3.4 BB, fold, fold

Flop: (8.2 BB, 2 players) 8:diamond: T:club: 3:diamond:
Hero bets 2.8 BB, BTN raises to 8.4 BB, Hero calls 5.6 BB

Turn: (25 BB, 2 players) 7:diamond:
Hero bets 25 BB, BTN raises to 88.2 BB and is all-in, fold

BTN wins 71.4 BB
 
Aballinamion

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Rep the flush?

help me out bros! How do we play this flop? Does this work vs other players?

Yatahay Network - $0.05 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

SB: 173.4 BB
BB: 100 BB
UTG: 54.6 BB
MP: 116.4 BB
Hero (CO): 117.2 BB
BTN: 100 BB

SB posts SB 0.4 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has A K

fold, fold, Hero raises to 3.4 BB, BTN calls 3.4 BB, fold, fold

Flop: (8.2 BB, 2 players) 8 T 3
Hero bets 2.8 BB, BTN raises to 8.4 BB, Hero calls 5.6 BB

Turn: (25 BB, 2 players) 7
Hero bets 25 BB, BTN raises to 88.2 BB and is all-in, fold

BTN wins 71.4 BB

Hi there teh_colonel_saigon, thank you for posting your hand! Are you playing vs a passive fish? Have you ever seen this fish fold to a c-bet flop of 1/3 pot before in position?
Look, if this is a passive player this check-raise is pure value and we must fold 100% of times, with no second guesses! Passive loves to call, when they show aggression is simply value. If you have the HUD display look to its Aggression factor and verify it.
However, if this fish in position is an aggro fish we should not have made a C-Bet flop, because this player is likely to bluff us a lot when we check! And AK is nothing in this flop but a very poor equity for turn/river (runner-runners)
Third and finally, we know that players rarely check-raise for bluff so high a value like this at the micros. Every check-raise, indeed, either they are overbluffing or overvaluing their hands, in both cases is a clear case of polarized range.

I understand your line of thought in this hand, you saw SB deep stacked, and you have nearly 120 blinds of stack size, so you raised 3.4x IP, which an abnormal sizing and get called in position, which should modify your previous gameplan.
This flop is very dry, and there isn't many bluffs right now on Villain's range. J9 is one of those hands but even so, it has to be a pretty wild player to be check-raising OESDs like this.
We believe this board hits more the BTN's range, considering it called not a 2.5x or 3x open raise, but a 3.4x, consider it, it changes a little but it changes.
I don't love this kind of equity for bluffing, we have runner-runner straight and runner-runner flush plus two overcards. No fold equity and many turns and rivers will simply destroy us.
Our 1/3 pot C-bet is okay if we want the Villain to fold all of its trashes, but we know they are hard to fold. Once again, when I get check-raised in a spot like that, I will fold very easy, because our hand has a little potential to realize some turns and rivers and we know that after this check-raise the players will continue pushing trying to hold us turn/river.
Again, I would never C-bet this turn just because I have the blocker of the flush nuts and mostly because I am out of position in relation to V.
Players at these limits barely understand it. They will call with a trips in a board that has a straight and flush easily, so they will call easily with worst flushes.
The possible value hands here are just a few such as T8 with two pair, and the sets with 88, TT and 33, and JJ, QQ that decided to cold call in position, which are hands that could follow this line of check-raising flop. The check-raise flop could also be a flush draw of diamonds that it realized in the turn.
IF we were playing higher limits such as 50 NLHE and 100 NLHE (real thinking players), I would either just call the turn to go all-in river, or check-shove turn right off the bat, because at those limits many players will never pay a shove river if they don't have the blocker of the flush nuts, so they would easily fold second and third flush nuts. At the micros I don't know many players capable of folding flushes in the river, even 8th flushes :p
Let's not even get started of weak players folding Two pair, sets, straights, it is so rare that I don't even count as a possibility.

Regards;

Carlos 'Aballinamion' Barbosa
 
teh_colonel_saigon

teh_colonel_saigon

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Hi there teh_colonel_saigon, thank you for posting your hand! Are you playing vs a passive fish? Have you ever seen this fish fold to a c-bet flop of 1/3 pot before in position?
Look, if this is a passive player this check-raise is pure value and we must fold 100% of times, with no second guesses! Passive loves to call, when they show aggression is simply value. If you have the HUD display look to its Aggression factor and verify it.
However, if this fish in position is an aggro fish we should not have made a C-Bet flop, because this player is likely to bluff us a lot when we check! And AK is nothing in this flop but a very poor equity for turn/river (runner-runners)
Third and finally, we know that players rarely check-raise for bluff so high a value like this at the micros. Every check-raise, indeed, either they are overbluffing or overvaluing their hands, in both cases is a clear case of polarized range.

I understand your line of thought in this hand, you saw SB deep stacked, and you have nearly 120 blinds of stack size, so you raised 3.4x IP, which an abnormal sizing and get called in position, which should modify your previous gameplan.
This flop is very dry, and there isn't many bluffs right now on Villain's range. J9 is one of those hands but even so, it has to be a pretty wild player to be check-raising OESDs like this.
We believe this board hits more the BTN's range, considering it called not a 2.5x or 3x open raise, but a 3.4x, consider it, it changes a little but it changes.
I don't love this kind of equity for bluffing, we have runner-runner straight and runner-runner flush plus two overcards. No fold equity and many turns and rivers will simply destroy us.
Our 1/3 pot C-bet is okay if we want the Villain to fold all of its trashes, but we know they are hard to fold. Once again, when I get check-raised in a spot like that, I will fold very easy, because our hand has a little potential to realize some turns and rivers and we know that after this check-raise the players will continue pushing trying to hold us turn/river.
Again, I would never C-bet this turn just because I have the blocker of the flush nuts and mostly because I am out of position in relation to V.
Players at these limits barely understand it. They will call with a trips in a board that has a straight and flush easily, so they will call easily with worst flushes.
The possible value hands here are just a few such as T8 with two pair, and the sets with 88, TT and 33, and JJ, QQ that decided to cold call in position, which are hands that could follow this line of check-raising flop. The check-raise flop could also be a flush draw of diamonds that it realized in the turn.
IF we were playing higher limits such as 50 NLHE and 100 NLHE (real thinking players), I would either just call the turn to go all-in river, or check-shove turn right off the bat, because at those limits many players will never pay a shove river if they don't have the blocker of the flush nuts, so they would easily fold second and third flush nuts. At the micros I don't know many players capable of folding flushes in the river, even 8th flushes :p
Let's not even get started of weak players folding Two pair, sets, straights, it is so rare that I don't even count as a possibility.

Regards;

Carlos 'Aballinamion' Barbosa

Yea, you're right. I just want to make sure my thinking wasn't too crazy. There could be a play here, but not with this opponent, we should give him credit. Plus we don't have enough equity to fall back on if our bluff fails. :motz:
 
freddydr87

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I would have not call the raise flop,in fact i donk bet that flop,because is more favorable to the defenders rangue and you will face a lot off raises on that spot.
 
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gustav197poker

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The texture of the board does not favor you for a small bet of flop. Your first barrel represents a protection of a middle hand, which can look for a flush blocking on the turn. But the board is dry because of the scales it contains. In this flop with semi-flush line, you can expect many times increases of the villain, to the small protection bets that are made.
Because many times, players will seek to increase the pot, for induce a positive equity, and now turn their semi bluffs into high value hands.
Therefore, your range may have more blocking force in this flop. Basically we can neutralize the entire range of bluffs that can disturb us in the future streets.
For this it is necessary that, if we decide to continue betting, we make a cbet of a larger size (60-75% for example).
The most standard option is to check the flop, since we don't really have any protection range and we don't want to block the flush line now, since we're out of position.
In addition the btn range is more open than us and considering the texture of the board, we can be below a calling range, which includes some scale of this flop.
On the turn the flush line is completed, and now we are being defeated many times, by various types of hands. We can only improve if a diamond appears on the river. But the situation is not good now, since the villain can turn his valuable hands into bluff catchers. In this point, it is also likely that we are being dominated in blockers, which reduce our implicit probabilities of improvement in the river.
All this indicates that our bet turn is not convenient. Since we can estimate a low fold equity in the v range, because now our structure is unbalanced in bluffs. (they have little credibility).
According to what you played I think your final decision to fold was good.
Greetings.
 
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TheDude6622

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I would have not call the raise flop,in fact i donk bet that flop,because is more favorable to the defenders rangue and you will face a lot off raises on that spot.

Totally agree. You're basically being told you have to have a hand to play on. If you don't and you're calling, you know it's only going to get more expensive. Fold to the raise. If you don't donk bet and just call the opponent's bet, you get to see a cheaper turn and try to catch up on the river IF possible.
 
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Check fold flop. It sounds weak, but fish aren't folding often, so why bluff out of position. If you do her and get called in the flop - check fold. Double barrel is no good there.
 
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