$5 NL HE 6-max: Bad situation with AQ

[canbora]

Game

Hold'em

Game Format

No Limit

Stakes

$.02/$.05

Table Format

6-max (6 seats)

Currency

$

You'll have to forgive me, not only do I not have the exact cards, but for some reason, I'm forgetting everything but the main details. I'll explain...

Part 1:

My forgetfulness is the point here. This is about the hand but also a lesson. I played WAY too late in to the night, and I played WAY too long. I was exhausted and was too dumb to realize it. tired = -ev

I was just simply wanting to screw around. Not get involved with big bucks. I bought in to a small $10 PKO MTT. (4 tables) I got 4th place. Played well. Again, keeping things small screwing around, I went to a cash table to wind down. cash games are like after dinner coffee to me. thats where I like to keep them. I dont like playing cash seriously, regularly, long term, not my jam. So Im like I'll do a 100 hands or so at the $4NL table. (ended up going way beyond that hand number)

I paid for my good fortune in the MTT by getting the cooler on hands where I had my villains seriously deiminated and they pulled beyond bonehead moves (typical microstrakes) and... unbelievable lucked out every time. Like shoving on me preflop with 73 when I had KK. They flop trip threes. or when I had a set 5's and someone shoved on me with nothing more than pocket 7's on a wet board. No straight or flush draw. I didnt' improve, he hits a 7 on the river. Just unbelievable stuff. This stakes level is unreal. Its always 4-5 people to a flop despite large raises. Its chaos, anyone can have literally anything. (this is all important)

Despite all of this. I'm maaaaaaaaainly satisified with my play. I even make some good laydowns. Can't complain. Despite getting stacked with one of my coolers. I go through some big swings, wins and losses. I'm right at even. its fluctuating between 3-4 handed. People are coming and going at random. I'm the only static player. I get involved with two hands, with decent hands that I have to lay down. I'm down slightly from even. Nothing bad at all. Maybe 190-ish BB. give or take.
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Part 2:

OK, here it is.

After laying down two previous hands in a row. I get AQ offsuit. Its either three or four handed. I honestly dont' remember. I think 4. UTG(also the CO) min raises. (oh my stars, classic AA trap, right?)

I think button folds. (if it was 4 handed) and the small blind definitely folds because I'm in the BB. I'm like oh we're three betting. I'm pretty sure I bet 6 BB. he snap 4 bets me to 13. At this stake level. Gut reaction is to fold. Honestly. Despite me calling 6 in to a 20-ish pot. BUT... I said, we're 4 handed. I have a strong hand and its 6 into 20 and I have the preflop postion. I close the action. And people SOMETIIMES do this with small pocket pairs to induce a steal or even AK because its so short handed. So... I'm seeing a flop. you HAVE to get lucky in poker. Thats a fact. So i make the call.

Flop comes KQK rainbow. Oy - freakin-vey. Here we go. I'm first to act. So I check. He snap bets (I'm near positive the pot. Although it may be 2/3-ish or so, give or take. But I'm pretty sure it was a pot sized snap bet). I'm like... geez, are you kidding me??? I hate this position. BUT... after all this money and hitting something. I make the call to at least see the turn. No one with a King is betting, let alone two kings. Nor queens. So I'm ruling out AK, KK, and QQ. Does he have the aces?

Turn comes brick. Its a low random card. I think it was like 7 diamonds. I check, hoping this guy comes comes to his senses and slows down. Nope. Snap bets the pot again. Here we go, my classic newb panic bet. No thought is going in to this at all. He has no idea what to do so hes panicking. His hearts beating in his ears. He has a pair of some sort and he has no idea how to play them. He's scared. He doesnt wan to lay them down because he doesn't know how and he's willing to sink himself in the process.

So now I'm thinking. ..you know what?? He may have JJ. Seriously. That makes sense too. He min raised preflop as a straddle and wanted to see what was up. Now this flop is here and he doesn't know what to do. He's using these cards as blockers and feels I'm drawing with J 10 suited or something. Because I'm no longer showing strength after my initial 3 bet.

Anyway. Im like.. cheese and rice... Ok, call. I think this guy has J's.
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Part 3:

River comes another brick. Its like the 2 or hearts or something like that. Helps seemingly nothing. Im like OK big dawg. Had enough yet? I called you. You know I have SOMETHING too. I could EASILY have a KJ or KQ.... suited or not. Maybe even K10 or K9 suited. I could also EASILY have QQ. That would fit my play perfectly. I know he knows this. He's 100% scared. FACT. So... I check. He snap bets the pot. Again. Bros clicking buttons. He's firing his last bullet. I'm like do I really l really really lay this down? After ALL of this? Deep stacked. If I fold and he has J's (mmmmaybe 10's? ) I'm going to feel real stupid because I know dead fact he's scared. And I regret raising but I know if I did he's calling. At least I can salvage some of my stack left by calling down. I made several hero calls tonight to win big pots. And I've had several people call my pot sized river bet with nothing more than K high...yeah, you read that right. This is a loose loose stakes level.


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Conclusion:

So yeah. I made the call.

What say you, council?

Any opinion, comment, question, welcome. Even if its to call me stupid, I deserve it with this hand....regardless of outcome. Because I shouldn't have even been in the hand. I should have been asleep in bed.

recap: board reads KQK72 (no straights or flushes possible and we have AQ offsuit.)

 

[canbora]

Sorry if this was TLDR. Between the fact I didnt have the hard data on the hand info (which is party of the story) and given my organic style of doing things, I wrote it in story form. I tried breaking it up to make it easier to read. My mind works in both pictures and words and both. Reading dry hard data is harder for me because it makes me convert it in my head. Like when you learn a language at first, before your fluent. You have to convert it to your native language. I have to do that every time I see all this data (when they don't include a replayer link, I love the replayer)

So, my apologies.

PS. and ya know what I have found in majority or circumstances, both real life and in GTO trainers, the majority of info is actually irrelivant. The most relavant pieces are: Both of your stack sizes, your hand, and position. After that, one half notch below is any outstanding info like "this guy shoved all in last ten hands in row" .. stuff like that. After that most of it doesn't much matter. If someone shoves al in and you have queen high and you know they have nothing "does my nothing beat your nothing" I dont care if we have ICM pressure, on the bubble. PKO or standard tourney, cash game... omaha, Holdem...whatever. It rarely matters or matters little.

 

[Aballinamion]

My forgetfulness is the point here. This is about the hand but also a lesson. I played WAY too late in to the night, and I played WAY too long. I was exhausted and was too dumb to realize it. tired = -ev

It's good that you are aware that we should never, ever play when we start to feel tired. When we are exhausted we should even think about poker. After that, I should say no more, because we cannot expect good actions of someone who isn't playing the best psychological game.

I think button folds. (if it was 4 handed) and the small blind definitely folds because I'm in the BB. I'm like oh we're three betting. I'm pretty sure I bet 6 BB. he snap 4 bets me to 13. At this stake level. Gut reaction is to fold. Honestly. Despite me calling 6 in to a 20-ish pot. BUT... I said, we're 4 handed. I have a strong hand and its 6 into 20 and I have the preflop postion. I close the action.

I also shouldn't comment on a hand where there is a lots of "I think", "not sure", "I can't remember", if you can't remember what happened because you were way too tired, how can we possibly help you? Besides, if you really want us to help you, try to keep your post smaller, more objective. This post you made is way too subject and hard to read.
In a situation like this where we already have made a 3-bet with AQ and villain 4-bets we simply fold. AQ is not so strong to play a 4-bet pot, even if it is a AQs.

after all this money and hitting something. I make the call to at least see the turn. No one with a King is betting, let alone two kings. Nor queens. So I'm ruling out AK, KK, and QQ. Does he have the aces?

We do not make calls to see the turn, we do not make calls to see what is happening next. We make calls when we believe we have a strong value hand that might beat our opponent or we make the call because we think we can float our opponent on the next street raising it. We cannot know with a 100% certainty that "no one has a king" in a situation like this. We must at least consider some kings into villain's range because we own no combos of kings.

I think this guy has J's.

Villain can have JJ, QQ, KK, AA, AK, because villain had made a 4-bet preflop, it doesn't matter his sizing for it.

I deserve it with this hand....regardless of outcome.

We do not deserve to win or lose any hand. We deserve to play our best game not being outcome depending. Do not play tired and next time you post a hand for analysis, try to keep the analytical facts precise and be more objective. Pay attention! Never play once you feel you are bored, tired or with any personal problem that my distract you.
Unless, of course, you are a recreational and wants to play for fun. But if you want to play for fun you shoudn't even bother to post hands here.

 

[SrMartis]

I think you're overthinking this limit, or you're just dreaming with his JJ and you getting his stack off in a board like this rsrs.

Just kidding.

I think you're OK playing for fun in the NL2, if that was your case dont worry to much.

If not, better to be in the bed hahaha.

 

[canbora]

It's good that you are aware that we should never, ever play when we start to feel tired. When we are exhausted we should even think about poker. After that, I should say no more, because we cannot expect good actions of someone who isn't playing the best psychological game.

I also shouldn't comment on a hand where there is a lots of "I think", "not sure", "I can't remember", if you can't remember what happened because you were way too tired, how can we possibly help you? Besides, if you really want us to help you, try to keep your post smaller, more objective. This post you made is way too subject and hard to read.
In a situation like this where we already have made a 3-bet with AQ and villain 4-bets we simply fold. AQ is not so strong to play a 4-bet pot, even if it is a AQs.

We do not make calls to see the turn, we do not make calls to see what is happening next. We make calls when we believe we have a strong value hand that might beat our opponent or we make the call because we think we can float our opponent on the next street raising it. We cannot know with a 100% certainty that "no one has a king" in a situation like this. We must at least consider some kings into villain's range because we own no combos of kings.

Villain can have JJ, QQ, KK, AA, AK, because villain had made a 4-bet preflop, it doesn't matter his sizing for it.


Unless, of course, you are a recreational and wants to play for fun. But if you want to play for fun you shoudn't even bother to post hands here.We do not deserve to win or lose any hand. We deserve to play our best game not being outcome depending. Do not play tired and next time you post a hand for analysis, try to keep the analytical facts precise and be more objective. Pay attention! Never play once you feel you are bored, tired or with any personal problem that my distract you.

Both my apologies and thanks. if I could delete it at this point I would. I was experimenting with a different kind of post. I guess it didn't' take too well. I'm sorry it was irritating. And thank you, you did help me actually. I took a few key takeaways from this.

I think you're overthinking this limit, or you're just dreaming with his JJ and you getting his stack off in a board like this rsrs.

Just kidding.

I think you're OK playing for fun in the NL2, if that was your case dont worry to much.

If not, better to be in the bed hahaha.

Yeah, this is still be filed under my "cash game experiment" from being primariarly a MTT PKO player thats trying to just ......see whats up with cash games. What goes on at the different levels, how to play them, whats the best way to do it. What are the patterns, etc. And I'm allowing myself to play somewhat poorly at times, so that I can "buy" information to put together patterns of behavior of people. Its easier to do at the lower levels because people act more human instinctual so there less masking.

However........i went a little far time, I feel. Theres buying information and theres just throwing away stacks. Ya know what I mean? But, I did get information from this. Lets hope that in the future it's dividends pay off and it was worth the investment. Lets hope all of this does.

 

[canbora]

So, I've gotten better at calling out peoples hands. I already was doing so in theory, but I simply wasnt ALWAYS acting on it because I wasn't sure....THEN. I am now. I'd love to attribute this to some sort of skill or talent, but its just simple pattern recognition through hard work, time, and a bit of physical expense at my hand. I now am patching several leaks at once at the conclusion of a few micro experiments and am trusting these reads, hopefully to probability. I was just doing 10NL tonight and i'm accrediting my winnings tonight to this. Lets hope it continues. The funniest part about all of this ( to me) is how massively different tounies are from cash games. Its astounding, (agian, to me)

Click on the blurr below for hand conclusion.

OK so just using this spoiler is a bit of a experiment too. This is cool. hahah. Anyway, as per my original instinct and guess, villain had AA