Ducky7
Cardschat Elite
Silver Level
Ye this specific is at 25nl though? at 100/200 its completely different
Ye this specific is at 25nl though? at 100/200 its completely different
John A
Poker Zion Coach
Silver Level
Ya.............. .. ... I was responding to someone who said they didn't think this happened at 100nl.
Ducky7
Cardschat Elite
Silver Level
oh right ok musta misread
WVHillbilly
Legend
Silver Level
If you're the villain here what's up with your bet sizing on the river? You obviously don't think he should be raising a T, there are very few Aces he can have since you hold 2, and he should be folding just about everything else right? So shove the river and get value from his Tx and maybe 6x hands (if he has any). Hate your bet size more than his shove.Actually, while the HH is real, I was villain in this hand and wondered whether or not he should have shipped river vs me
He's a reg who probs calls too much IP to outplay TAGs like me, and he always has at least a T here (as he did).
John A
Poker Zion Coach
Silver Level
Fyi, this is from last night. I've played a good amount of 100-400nl in the last 3 months building a roll on a new site. Not the same as a river shove, but similar point. And this is just because of my image I can get over bet calls w/ A high.
***** Hand History for Game 1111111111 ***** (poker stars)
$100.00 USD NL Texas Hold'em - Thursday, December 20, 01:26:07 ET 2012
Table 2653425 (real money)
Seat 3 is the button
Seat 1: Player1 ( $206.16 USD ) - VPIP: 32, PFR: 26, 3B: 7.8, AF: 3.0, Hands: 4667
Seat 2: Player1plus1 ( $95.92 USD ) - VPIP: 32, PFR: 14, 3B: 7.6, AF: 3.8, Hands: 7661
Seat 3: Player3 ( $183.14 USD ) - VPIP: 39, PFR: 16, 3B: 4, AF: 1.7, Hands: 155
Seat 5: Player5 ( $137.90 USD ) - VPIP: 26, PFR: 20, 3B: 6.9, AF: 3.9, Hands: 2666
Seat 6: Hero ( $96.73 USD ) - VPIP: 27, PFR: 22, 3B: 8.5, AF: 3.8, Hands: 95695
Player5 posts small blind [$0.50 USD].
Hero posts big blind [$1.00 USD].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Hero [ 3d Ah ]
Player1 folds
Player1plus1 folds
Player3 folds
Player5 raises [$2.50 USD]
Hero calls [$2.00 USD]
** Dealing Flop ** [ 2d, 9c, 5h ]
Player5 bets [$4.25 USD]
Hero calls [$4.25 USD]
** Dealing Turn ** [ Kd ]
Player5 checks
Hero checks
** Dealing River ** [ 4s ]
Player5 checks
Hero bets [$17.50 USD]
Player5 calls [$17.50 USD]
Hero shows [3d, Ah ]
Hero wins $47.50 USD from main pot
Player5 doesn't show [Ac, 6d ]
***** Hand History for Game 1111111111 ***** (poker stars)
$100.00 USD NL Texas Hold'em - Thursday, December 20, 01:26:07 ET 2012
Table 2653425 (real money)
Seat 3 is the button
Seat 1: Player1 ( $206.16 USD ) - VPIP: 32, PFR: 26, 3B: 7.8, AF: 3.0, Hands: 4667
Seat 2: Player1plus1 ( $95.92 USD ) - VPIP: 32, PFR: 14, 3B: 7.6, AF: 3.8, Hands: 7661
Seat 3: Player3 ( $183.14 USD ) - VPIP: 39, PFR: 16, 3B: 4, AF: 1.7, Hands: 155
Seat 5: Player5 ( $137.90 USD ) - VPIP: 26, PFR: 20, 3B: 6.9, AF: 3.9, Hands: 2666
Seat 6: Hero ( $96.73 USD ) - VPIP: 27, PFR: 22, 3B: 8.5, AF: 3.8, Hands: 95695
Player5 posts small blind [$0.50 USD].
Hero posts big blind [$1.00 USD].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Hero [ 3d Ah ]
Player1 folds
Player1plus1 folds
Player3 folds
Player5 raises [$2.50 USD]
Hero calls [$2.00 USD]
** Dealing Flop ** [ 2d, 9c, 5h ]
Player5 bets [$4.25 USD]
Hero calls [$4.25 USD]
** Dealing Turn ** [ Kd ]
Player5 checks
Hero checks
** Dealing River ** [ 4s ]
Player5 checks
Hero bets [$17.50 USD]
Player5 calls [$17.50 USD]
Hero shows [3d, Ah ]
Hero wins $47.50 USD from main pot
Player5 doesn't show [Ac, 6d ]
Last edited:
John A
Poker Zion Coach
Silver Level
Well, there's no value from Tx, but you're point is still valid if he calls with 6x. I think the consensus from people who are playing these stakes is that no one expects bluffs and AQ+ will bet fold. So calling is likely the best play w/o better image/dynamic info.
WVHillbilly
Legend
Silver Level
No villain (hero) here has AA so he beats all his Tx/6x hands.
Ducky7
Cardschat Elite
Silver Level
I understand the point you are making about image, but both the villain and hero in the hand we are discussing a relatively straightforward ie neither is a maniac/spewwy reg/ station. So it is very player dependant on table image. And with the image given in the hand its hard for him to call with worse imo. Also ranges in your hand are super wide where as in the hand above ranges are relatively polarized, well our range is anyway
acky100
Legend
Silver Level
My whole argument would suggest that yeah this is a good spot to bluff but im not too sure considering i dont think villain should be snap betting a hand like AJ or AQ on the river. I think villain is quite protected here and can happily fold AQ to someone shoving here just because he has sooooooooo many better hands and the top of villains range is stronger than the top of hero's range, but yeah, from my experience mostly at 100 and 50 is that people are just not not not bluffing very much in general especially boards like this, but yeah there is always gonna be people who are capable of it i just think the best way to think about hands is as if a standard 2p2 reg was villain until proven otherwise or reads are provided.
Interesting spot though i will have to model villains river betting range and our turn calling range properly to see if it actually is a good spot to bluff :/ kind of skeptical atm considering villain has all combos of AT in his range and AA and we probably shouldnt be calling with hands like KTo if we were really the hero.
youregoodmate
Cardschat Elite
Silver Level
Why arent you fully stacked?
WVHillbilly
Legend
Silver Level
...and he's right.
Bubbles
Enthusiast
Silver Level
ya this was my first thought. I would much rather 3 bet KT0 form the button. As played easy ship on the river