$25 NLHE 6-max: 3b bluff shoving the river okay here?

[ovitoo]

Nope, my loosest position is the small blind

I'd rather fold pre than end up spewing post flop though, just seems like unnecessary spew.

So are you saying you think the BB is usually >A8?

or are you saying you don't kno how to play A8 hu?

 

[acky100]

No, i open it vs most but it's far from a good hand bvb. What i meant was if you're going to open it, dont spew post flop.

 

[ovitoo]

No, i open it vs most but it's far from a good hand bvb. What i meant was if you're going to open it, dont spew post flop.

ok then I misread. Sorry.

 

[Ducky7]

Nope, my loosest position is the small blind

I'd rather fold pre than end up spewing post flop though, just seems like unnecessary spew.

Whats your sb open? 5% of hands i take it

And never folding an A sb v BB HU -.-

 

[acky100]

Probably a leak with that attitude young duckster, hands like A6o are absolutely terrible OOP, i probs open 50-60% in the small blind but vs guys like this im ditching Ax offsuit pretty quickly, maybe A8o would be the worst i'd open. Seriously are useless hands, in the worst possible spot you can be in if you expect him to call you a lot bvb.

 

[ovitoo]

Probably a leak with that attitude young duckster, hands like A6o are absolutely terrible OOP, i probs open 50-60% in the small blind but vs guys like this im ditching Ax offsuit pretty quickly, maybe A8o would be the worst i'd open. Seriously are useless hands, in the worst possible spot you can be in if you expect him to call you a lot bvb.

I can't help but think that not taking advantage of +90% hands pre is -ev.

imo.

 

[Ducky7]

Probably a leak with that attitude young duckster, hands like A6o are absolutely terrible OOP, i probs open 50-60% in the small blind but vs guys like this im ditching Ax offsuit pretty quickly, maybe A8o would be the worst i'd open. Seriously are useless hands, in the worst possible spot you can be in if you expect him to call you a lot bvb.

For all the time he folds 73o we have to raise small blind to big its just retaded not to. And if he is calling all flops then when we hit top pair or any pair for that matter we are going to get a ton of value

 

[nmaher18]

All I can say choop is you're a braver man than me! I like the 3rd barrel but not sure i could have committed to the shove! Just not sure we have enough info on villain to rule out him slowplaying. Hats off to you though and I hope it worked!

 

[Deco]

Probably a leak with that attitude young duckster, hands like A6o are absolutely terrible OOP, i probs open 50-60% in the small blind but vs guys like this im ditching Ax offsuit pretty quickly, maybe A8o would be the worst i'd open. Seriously are useless hands, in the worst possible spot you can be in if you expect him to call you a lot bvb.

Ditto.
Well other than opening from the SB 50-60%. I open around 35%.

 

[JCgrind]

Ackys just jealous cos I'm running better in September IMO

 

[acky100]

I can't help but think that not taking advantage of +90% hands pre is -ev.

imo.

I used to think that too but hands play in reality based on playability, not rank. A6o is essentially a one card hand, the 6 is useless, no straight potential, no flush potential, just an ace. Oh and your opponent is defending bigger aces too so there are also times when you do hit the ace and are in trouble, but most of the time you miss the flop and have no equity to remain aggressive. Its pretty standard to just fold crappy aces when OOP, just like you should fold A6o in the CO when there are regulars behind, common sense that hands like 67s go up in value for steal equity purposes.

Do you guys realise that being OOP is terrible bvb vs anyone semi-competent? I am openening any ace vs most guys but thats because im usually relying on them folding to my steals a lot, if theyre not then you aren't gonna be able to push anyone around with a shitty hand like A6o.

Sorry for rant, just dont believe anyone is making money with a hand like A6o vs a regular that doesnt bend over in bvb spots.

 

[acky100]

For all the time he folds 73o we have to raise small blind to big its just retaded not to. And if he is calling all flops then when we hit top pair or any pair for that matter we are going to get a ton of value

But what if he only folds to your bvb steals 45% like a reg who knows you steal wide would? Pretty easy for them to just 3bet you with like 20% of hands and flat with 30% or more and you can do absolutely nothing about it apart from probably tighten up vs them individually so you can maybe marginally exploit them.

 

[acky100]

Ackys just jealous cos I'm running better in September IMO

You might be running better but i'm crushing september under EV


Also, before all you pricks start arguing, come back when you can break even in the small blind

 

[JCgrind]

You might be running better but i'm crushing september under EV


Also, before all you pricks start arguing, come back when you can break even in the small blind

maaaaaaaaate. lol


i agree with what acky said about folding shit aces in SB for BvB spots, but from memory (i believe its in the OP) he was folding to steals 67% or something, so obv im opening to steal the blinds and thats pretty much it.
flop in this case was totally playable though lol

 

[JCgrind]

threw this on FB at the same time as i put it on cc for analysis because i thought it was interesting. changed names for privacy reasons, but fwiw, josh is an online regular up 44k for cashgames. added this in because i think the hands really interesting

Jchoop obv im always double barreling flop and turn with overs + gutter BvB as PFR
22 hours ago · Like

Scott If he doesnt have AJ, I feel he has A-high and thinks you have nothing, it looks like your value bet bluffing there
22 hours ago via mobile · Like

Scott Id say he folds, what did he do
22 hours ago via mobile · Like

Jchoop i think its pretty retarded for him to have AJ, i think A6, 88-TT, AJ all flat that river.
wait you think my $4 into $7.80 OTR looks like a vbet bluff? its like half pot lol thats so standard for river sizing.
not gunna say what villain did/had til ive heard what fozzy thinks. dont wanna bias his decision
22 hours ago · Like

Jchoop im always getting to that river, so its check/fold, bet/fold, or bet/3b shove. although tbh i kinda think i can check/call too lol
22 hours ago · Like

Jchoop ^(checks back all value hands bar trips+), only bets Khigh or worse
22 hours ago · Like

Scott Sorry I thought it wad $4 into $11.80 lol
22 hours ago via mobile · Like

Scott Yeah I agree with everything you said
21 hours ago via mobile · Like

Anthony A5
21 hours ago via mobile · Like

Jchoop your river line tony? c/f, b/f, b/shove or c/c?
21 hours ago · Like

Josh bet/call run around the house like a genius when he rolls 89/910/810.
18 hours ago · Like · 3

Josh thinking more 108 910 tho
18 hours ago · Like

Anthony I'd either check fold or bet fold
18 hours ago via mobile · Like

Josh not paying much attention to the dynamic tony, BVB is important, so is his floating range which seemsto be any two. but calling 2 streets feels like he should have someform of equity which is why i would think a busted draw seems likely. hmmm interesting hand tho
18 hours ago · Like

Anthony I'm no online expert but to me online is a grind fest. Generally when it comes to big hands like this it's just better to fold it and wait for a better spot. If this was love though I would sit there and contemplate a hero call since they might be sitting with a naked 5 or 89/910 and coz I do like standing up and telling people to eat it
18 hours ago via mobile · Unlike · 2

Anthony Love = live
18 hours ago via mobile · Like

Justin Calls with 55
17 hours ago via mobile · Like

Josh lol 10-1 says he doesnt have 55
17 hours ago · Like

Josh plz god dont have 55 i dont wanna be stuck anymore
17 hours ago · Unlike · 3

Justin Really? 10-1??
17 hours ago via mobile · Like

Josh on $10 if interested
17 hours ago · Like

Josh if that guy is raise/calling the rvr withh 55 i quit
17 hours ago · Like

Justin 10-1 on $5 cheers
17 hours ago via mobile · Like

Josh ok booked plz dont have 55
17 hours ago · Like

Jchoop Sorry guys, I don't have the answer, he folded to my shove lol. But ye I take it you and Justin like my line then (slash prefer calling his raise but w/e it's the same thing basically)
Tony wtf why would you bet fold here? I've seen you bluff 3b shove Rivers lol.
15 hours ago via mobile · Like

Jchoop But yeah fwiw, 55 is hero calling or folding, never raising IMO
15 hours ago via mobile · Like · 1

Justin He can sometimes raise with 55
A) You have AX and must fold, or call with worse than a pair
B) Bluffing with the best hand and wasn't expecting you to shove
Raise fold is okay if your response is to shove...obv has to have a lot of history behind it
15 hours ago via mobile · Like

Jchoop I totally disagree. There is no way a villain in the history of pokerstars is good enough to value raise 55 here/call off a 3b bluff shove.
We don't have a whole lot of history, it's what like 220 hands over 2 sessions.
Also, if he thinks he's got the best hand wtf is he doing raising? There's no chance he's expecting a hero all from A high ever
14 hours ago via mobile · Like · 1

Jchoop And by here I mean at 25NL
14 hours ago via mobile · Like · 1

Josh Obv 89 I think

 

[naruto_miu]

I love it, but then again I don't play NL (and when I did I sucked)...

From my understanding your line is saying w/e you may have "I have it crushed"...Cuz you bet flop/turn/river and RRAI on river....Yet your villain has called you flop/turn/and RR on river...The only thing that makes no sense is why villain would RR on river? Why not flop/turn/? If they had JJ surely they would've rr pre right? So I must say your line speaks volumes, and since he's a thinking player, I'd assume he'd assume your not playing in this case, and they would have to fold..


My question is one thing, the pot is pretty big, are you not sure they would'nt feel compelled to have to call just because of the size of the pot itself, are you sure they would'nt feel like I'm committed and must see what the hell he got?

 

[JCgrind]

even after his stupid river raise he has committed $13.40 of his money in the middle and has like ~$14.50 left behind.

if he hit his jack, he may feel pot committed. but if i misclick raised with AJ or somethign dumb on the river id snap fold to a 3b shove. but ye im not villian.

the thing is, when he raises on the river i think that he doesnt actually have any kind of showdown value. The way i saw it is that he calls with all his hands with SD value like if he binked the jack on the river, 88-TT, 6x maybe, and possibly even AX high hero calls.
So what hands can he raise on the river? Only trips+ for value, but i think its hard for him to have trips or a boat here due to the way he played his hand and his range, so why would he raise? My river bet is pretty polarised so to me, (esp considering the board is so drawy and the river raise is tiny in comparison to the pot), hes raising Khigh or worse because these hands have no showdown value, so he cant bluffcatch me with them, but thinks theres a good chance im FOS here (which i was lol).
So it seems like call>3b bluff shove, but just incase he was doing something stupid like bluffing with a 6 not knowing it was the best hand etc i decided to jam.

To answer your question, imo there are no hands here he can hero call the river with (like a J). hes either snap calling with the nuts or gunna gtfo

 

[WVHillbilly]

Against this opponent, this is a 100% fold preflop. We're OOP against a player who doesn't fold to steals enough, 3bets often, and calls multiple streets.

Also change tables. With this guy to your immediate left and 2 1/2 stacks this table is not going to be very profitable.

 

[acky100]

Against this opponent, this is a 100% fold preflop. We're OOP against a player who doesn't fold to steals enough, 3bets often, and calls multiple streets.

Also change tables. With this guy to your immediate left and 2 1/2 stacks this table is not going to be very profitable.

Changing tables is probably a good idea, but i think vs this guy its a 100% open preflop He is folding like 67% iirc which means we make money opening ATC.

 

[JCgrind]

I generally hunt shortstacked players (between 10 and 25) as they tend to be the worst, and just leave if they're actually playing a legit shortstacked strat

 

[WVHillbilly]

Changing tables is probably a good idea, but i think vs this guy its a 100% open preflop He is folding like 67% iirc which means we make money opening ATC.

He's folding 67% overall. I'd be willing to bet it's more like 35 to 40% when facing a SB open.

 

[JCgrind]

^ *67% vs steals

 

[WVHillbilly]

^ *67% vs steals

Right. And it will be a lot less than that when we look at only vs steals from the SB. Again probably 35% - 40%, not automatically profitable.

 

[JCgrind]

I agree it's going to be lower, just clarifying your post

 

[WVHillbilly]

Yeah my post should have said he's folding to steals 67% overall.