Every poker player needs to read this.

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BlueSolar

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I have been lurking on various internet poker forums, including this one, for many years. I have never participated in the discussion or signed up for a single forum. This will be my first post and I hope it helps someone out in some small way.

Forget the books, forget the tips, forget the hand analysis, forget the peer reviews, and forget what you see on TV. If you do not possess the ability to sit down by yourself, take a deck of cards, learn the game, figure out the odds, and develop your own strategy for winning within the first 3 months of dedicated play, then you need to come to the realization that your only future in poker will be, more likely than not, recreational. There is no shame in admitting that to yourself, poker is a fun game for recreational players.

The rules of poker are extremely simple, as we all know, it is the table that you are sitting at that adds the complexity. If you are unable to sit down at a poker table (online or live), recognize the patterns in other players and as a result, beat the game consistently, then you will not be successful at poker. This is a skill that cannot be taught with practice, just as athleticism cannot be instilled by any amount of training. Without this ability, your ability to win consistently will be non-existent.

The ability to learn the game, learn the odds, and develop your own successful style of game play that is adaptable to every table you sit at, is the key to winning. If you have to study what other people do, then you can place yourself in a limited-success at best, or a no-success (which is more likely) category right now. You cannot study or practice your way out of a natural ability deficit.

Winning or losing on a consistent basis is, ultimately, the barometer for success. Being able to honestly self-evaluate is the key to limiting your losses. The majority of human beings do not posses this skill. Throughout history it has been one of the hardest for people to master. The worst case scenario that can be created for a poker player is to not have the abilities listed above, in combination with not having the ability to self-evaluate. The end result of this combination is to continue losing play, while continuing to strive to become something, that you have no hope of ever becoming.

I played basketball when I was younger, however, I am not 6'4, I am only 6'0. I can jump high, but not high enough. I can make jump-shots, but not as many as the majority of players. I have ball control, but I am not the best at it. I realized these things at a young age, and instead of trying to grow 4-6 inches, jump higher, shoot better, and dribble to a level that I did not possess, I changed sports and as a result, paid my way through college with a scholarship. Sure, I play basketball recreationally, I play it for pure fun and with no expectations. I actually enjoy it now as a hobby because all the pressure is completely removed. I urge you to do the same thing with poker. You cannot force yourself to be good at any skill-set. So why would you try and force yourself to be good at poker?

Don't be that guy, don't be that guy who asks the question, "why am I not winning at XXXNL", or "Someone review this hand and tell me what I did wrong". If you do not possess the ability to figure that out on your own, then you are destined for failure.

I wish you all the best of luck in accurately self-assessing your poker abilities and making the hard, but beneficial decisions.
 
honeycrush

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Interesting post. Thanks . Can I ask - why, after all this time, have you decided to join a forum? And what made you choose this one? Finally, will you be sticking around?
 
Poker Orifice

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"Every poker player needs to read this"

Why? ^
:confused:
 
OMGITSOVER9K

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Don't be that guy, don't be that guy who asks the question, "why am I not winning at XXXNL", or "Someone review this hand and tell me what I did wrong". If you do not possess the ability to figure that out on your own, then you are destined for failure.

I disagree.

the whole point of belonging to a forum means learning off of other, probably better players.

you are not destined for failure if you post a hand for review and don't understand what you did wrong, thats just part of the learning process.

people learn better with other people, whats the saying 2 minds are better than one?
 
ryhailey

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I disagree with this post in so many ways it is not even funny.

I have learned so much from so many different sources (books, this great forum, watching/playing live, videos, etc...) I have been playing quite some time now, and I was probably quite the donk in the first 3 months of playing, and now I am quite the poker player Imo by far not a pro but pretty decent. There is so much to learn that it would be so hard to cram into a 3 month time span. Do you think a professional computer programmer or a engineer learns everything they need to know in a short time frame? I think not. Things take time and studying if you try your hardest I believe you can do just about anything possible.

Just my two cents.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy Note 2 using Tapatalk
 
OzExorcist

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Disagree completely.

The comparison between poker and basketball is invalid, for starters. Basketball is an activity where some people will run up against certain physical limitations that can't be circumvented, no matter how hard they practice. Height, body makeup, whatever.

None of those things exist in poker though... unless it's something as basic as an inability to count or read. Otherwise, there are literally thousands of examples of people who have learned and become winning players despite their lack of "natural poker talent".

What's more, even if it were the case that there are certain players who are just never going to be any good, why would you encourage them to stop playing?!?
 
domeburglar

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Ive played poker for years and only recently started really trying to learn about it and strategies and take it seriously.. and i cant even express how much ive learned from all the hand histories and thoughts people post on this forum... its ludicrous to think that the only way to become good at poker is by learning from yourself especially in 3 months... PHIL IVEY was terrible at poker according to other pros early in his career and constantly lost money.. Now hes unstopable
 
fletchdad

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Well, this thread will almost certainly get some varied responses. Here is mine.

You claim if you cant beat the games in 3 months you will never amount to anything but a recreational player who loses. You also claim that in those 3 months all you need to be good enough to beat the best is a deck of cards. You rationalize this with your basketball story. It only takes a minute to find a list of great pro basketball players who were not even 6 feet tall. Just cause you couldn't do it, doesn't mean the rest of the world cant. So in your story, your height was not coupled with enough ability to continue as a pro. Fine, good on you for realizing that your talent was not developed enough, or simply just not large enough. But you can put your own limitations on everyone else? Hmmmmmm.

And do you make a lot of money at poker? Cause you sure seem to want to discourage less then average players to stop playing. You would rather only have great players in the game?

While I do agree with a number of point in your post, I find others incredibly arrogant. As well as simply wrong. Studying what other people do is a great way to learn. You certainly should then expand on what you learned, but there is absolutely nothing wrong with emulating another while you simultaneously look for your own way.

I could continue but I am sure some others will chime in as well.

IMO a lot of fail in your first post here. Good luck to you anyway.
 
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RamdeeBen

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This post is so stupid and most unhelpful post I've seen in a while.

I played basketball when I was younger, however, I am not 6'4, I am only 6'0. I can jump high, but not high enough. I can make jump-shots, but not as many as the majority of players. I have ball control, but I am not the best at it. I realized these things at a young age, and instead of trying to grow 4-6 inches, jump higher, shoot better, and dribble to a level that I did not possess, I changed sports

This is rubbish. There are plenty of professional basketball players who have been well under 6ft. Just because you feel everythings basically natural ability or give up doesn't mean it's correct.

What you'e failing to realize is that, the only thing that can't be changed here is your height. Everyone CAN train and get better at jumping higher, shooting better, dribble etcetc..just because you didn't instantly possess it or feel you couldn't achieve it you just instead gave up.

Just because YOU gave up and failed doesn't mean that EVERYONE is destined to do that.


Don't be that guy, don't be that guy who asks the question, "why am I not winning at XXXNL", or "Someone review this hand and tell me what I did wrong". If you do not possess the ability to figure that out on your own, then you are destined for failure.

This quote is even more stupid. You're an idiot.


At the end of the day, don't express something as factual based on your own failings and experiences..give an opinion but DONT act like it's this way and only this way if you don't naturally pick something up, then you're never going to be this or that.



The parts that annoyed me is that your post is so negative to players wanting to improve their game. It's complete bullshit that you actually believe if it doesn't come to someone instantly they are doomed for failure. You do realize the fast majority of professional players failed to start with and had to improve. There are very few naturally gifted players out there, the rest had to WORK on their game and it DID pay off contrary to your beliefs that you're not destined. More worryingly you think it's the correct attitude to take with everything in life..which is completely incorrect.
 
BigCountryAA

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Yeah this post couldn't be farther from the truth. Grats on trying to troll everyone though.
I'm sure this will be your 1 and only post here.
 
ryhailey

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From the sounds of it the Op has given up on poker after a short time of playing. With out really applying himself to learn the game and, he just wants everyone to give up just like he did.

That's just what it sounds like to me.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy Note 2 using Tapatalk
 
micromachine

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I stopped reading after the second paragraph
 
vinylspiros

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Hey OP, this is a poker forum filled with poker enthusiasts. Most of which are members here cause they are looking for any way to improve their game and learn from others.your story is not going to convince anyone even if it was true, which for me is nowhere near the truth."If you want to be the best at something,all you have to do is practice,study and learn. just like anything in life.
p.s the 3 month evaluation period u mentioned is nothing. 1 year minimum just to say you know how to play is my opinion.
some of the things ur saying i can relate to but the overall statement you made in this post is in high contradiction to many peoples beliefs as you may have noticed.
 
AlfieAA

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Such a negative post and a lot of shite to boot....natural talent goes to waste if you dont put the work in and learn!!!
 
SofaKingCrazy

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I think I know what the OP is trying to say but he said it sooo wrong.... and it is wrong as well. :(

Some of us have a natural ability to learn things at a faster pace than others.
I am one of these people. I play guitar, bass, and organ as well as draw, paint and can work on cars, TVs, and other electronics.
In my first year of computer programming (BASIC) (DOS) I took the teachers book home for the weekend and learned the entire book. Got 115 for an average grade at the end of the year.
I've learned every trade involved with building homes and mastered most of them in my 20 years of working with the family business. The economy tanked and building stop, so i started playing poker in September 2010.
I'm not great by no means but I've also had no guidance. I applied my own strategy somewhat based upon how I play chess along with other thoughts from observances.

This ability gives us an advantage but in no way means the other player can't learn, and we all could learn more/new. Besides eating and drinking there's isn't anything I can think of that you just "know" naturally. We have to be taught everything; we have to be exposed to it. We have to practice before becoming good at it.

As was said above this is a place for people who enjoy poker and wish to learn or expose themselves to other processes of thought and outlooks upon strategies of poker. The maths involved and shorter approximations that can be figured easier while playing.

Lastly, FFS why on earth would you want them to quit? :confused:
At the very least they help level the playing field for others learning the game and they're tasty too!!
 
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Like everyone else has said, your post is so far off the mark I have difficulty believing that you are serious. Either that, or you're just plain not too bright. When you are first trying to learn something why would you not avail yourself to all the tools available to you? Books, HA, forums, etc, etc are all tools to make you better. By themselves they won't do it. You have to make an effort and apply the things you learn from various sources, but why would you want to close them off completely?

There is no point in secluding yourself, studying entirely and completely on your own with no books, vids, etc, and ignoring all the potential help out there. You're just re-inventing the wheel over and over again. Take advantage of the resources out there. Learn from them. Adapt them to your game, for sure, but you'll save yourself years and years of frustration by simply taking advantage of the already existing resources.
 
MisterLongFace

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You made one good point, the importance of honest self-evaluation. some people lack the ability or refuse to do that.
 
OMGITSOVER9K

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to everyone that said he is discouraging others from playing.. he isn't he just says that you will be stuck as a rec player forever.

that your only future in poker will be, more likely than not, recreational. There is no shame in admitting that to yourself, poker is a fun game for recreational players.

there is still the possibly that this guy is a troll, and seems to be a good one, at that.
 
GOTHEART

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Interesting post, written with an obvious condescending tone.

Wonder if you were not only a "know it all" but also a "Bully" in High School.....
 
WVHillbilly

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Possibly the worst post ever and completely false. We have tons of examples of people coming here unable to beat micro stakes poker who went on, through hard work and learning with plenty of help from others, to beat the game at a decent rate.

If your post wasn't so blatantly stupid that everyone who reads it will recognize it as such, I'd just delete it to prevent any new player from believeing you have even the slightest idea of what you're talking about.

My guess is that you suck at poker (likely because you tried learning the game without help) and you're looking for some excuse as to why without blaming the fact that you're just not willing to work hard enough.
 
dj11

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Well written and presented and full of hogwash, thus I can conclude this guy is a Republican, voted for Mitt and the sour grapes have passed thru as smelly hot air.

TY, TYVM.......
 
fletchdad

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Possibly the worst post ever and completely false. We have tons of examples of people coming here unable to beat micro stakes poker who went on, through hard work and learning with plenty of help from others, to beat the game at a decent rate.

If your post wasn't so blatantly stupid that everyone who reads it will recognize it as such, I'd just delete it to prevent any new player from believeing you have even the slightest idea of what you're talking about.

My guess is that you suck at poker (likely because you tried learning the game without help) and you're looking for some excuse as to why without blaming the fact that you're just not willing to work hard enough.

But how do you REALLY feel?;)
 
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...

I'll just leave this here...

"online poker also offers dreams of making a fortune. Sites always advertise the great successes of normal players while (for obvious reasons) neglecting to mention the more numerous failure stories."

"Oftentimes, inexperienced players can indeed get lucky and go on hot streaks. They come to believe that they too have a shot at making serious money. Even though the luck and hot streaks eventually cool off, the addicted player remembers what it’s like to succeed and strives to make it happen again."

This sums up not only this forum, but approximately 92% of poker players. You can make all the bold statements you want, but facts, studies, and statistics say otherwise. :cool:
 
WVHillbilly

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I'll just leave this here...

"Online poker also offers dreams of making a fortune. Sites always advertise the great successes of normal players while (for obvious reasons) neglecting to mention the more numerous failure stories."

"Oftentimes, inexperienced players can indeed get lucky and go on hot streaks. They come to believe that they too have a shot at making serious money. Even though the luck and hot streaks eventually cool off, the addicted player remembers what it’s like to succeed and strives to make it happen again."

This sums up not only this forum, but approximately 92% of poker players. You can make all the bold statements you want, facts, studies, and statistics say otherwise. :cool:

Yes but approximately 85% of dentist would recommend sugarless gum to their patients who chew gum. The other 15% would recommend glass.

See it's fun to make up numbers.

Edit: Also why are you quoting some poker addiction forum? Your post had nothing to do with addicted gamblers. You are a sad little man aren't you?
 
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Big_Rudy

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So why are you singling-out online poker players? Big deal, the average online players will be a long-term loser. Most everyone knows that. Guess what? The average live player will also be a long-term loser. Of course, you could tip the odds in your favor by studying, reading a few books, joining an online forum.......oh wait.....nevermind:eek:
 
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