Aside from rake, why do players lose?

Lets stop going round in circles on the other post.

What makes players lose aside from rake?

(Even though I would say over 80% of losers would still lose even if there wasnt rake)

Calling to much

I'd have to say that emotions play a big part. When feelings get in the way, you tend to make stupid plays that cost so very dearly. I play my best when I am the least emotional in the game. Just play a no-nonsense by the odds poker.

there is an easy answer if you knew game theory. but I'll try to explain. poker is a game of skill but is different from those games that depend on intelligence (like chess), talent and practice (like sports)... It's a game of incomplete information and some of it depends on luck, therefore even the most skillful is bound to make mistakes. Now all these make people THINK they can compete, but not everyone is lucky OR skillful enough. Or they are lucky but don't know where to stop etc etc.

And above that everybody plays against you (only except HU, there is one player to play against)... when you think of sports or other games, the opponent/s are usually equal with you/your team. So when every other person on the table tries to do their best to beat you, and the information is incomplete, and there is luck factor involved- it's actually a very hard job to maintain longterm success. Therefore you have only couple of choices to succeed:

1- make it a grind to minimize the risk- like it's a 9a.m-5p.m job. multitables, rakeback, and overcoming tilt issues will be main thing here.

2- luckbox a tournament.

3- be skillfull enough to jump through limits fast. (like durrrr etc.) this is the hardest one, as even though the play between the limits are not that different; the amount of money on the line always leads to mistakes. controlling emotions is key here. (also read "boywonder"s thread about this on 2p2 for inspiration- I can find the link if people would request)

This is what I think the problem is overall, nevermind the rake.

What the first two responders said and this,
overvaluing certain cards,(hands),
Not knowing anything about post flop play,
and Playing out of position.

Too many games in a too faster time. You finish one you start another one.

I do profit a little bit in online poker but not as much as i did in live casino's games.

Just too many games.

Plus too easy to go on tilt... with internet games...

1) limits
2) skill
3) patience

Thats just my opinion.

Most people have no idea how little they understand about the game.

play to many hands

need skill

alot of paitence

and dont read ppl correctly

1)incorrect BRM is the number 1 reason people dont succeed in online poker.
2)Flat calling raises instead of folding or raising
3)Lack of a HUD
4)Ignorance of position
5)Improper bet sizing
6)Incorrect hand ranges
7)Not knowing pot odds
8)Variance/Bad Luck
9)Tilt

stuventus said:

Lets stop going round in circles on the other post.

What makes players lose aside from rake?

(Even though I would say over 80% of losers would still lose even if there wasnt rake)

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The other thread asked a different question, they asked why do MOST people lose at poker? So you have asked a different question, and will therefore receive a different answer. It doesn't change the fact that the correct answer to the other question was rake.

Irexes said:

Most people have no idea how little they understand about the game.

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I have to admit I was one of these people until about last week. I have no clue wtf I am doing compared to some of the people who make vids

And I don't think 80% of people would lose without rake. In fact, I'm pretty sure it'd be way less than that.

Somebody's gotta lose.

NoWuckingFurries said:

The other thread asked a different question, they asked why do MOST people lose at poker? So you have asked a different question, and will therefore receive a different answer. It doesn't change the fact that the correct answer to the other question was rake.

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No, I just dont think it is.

I thought this was the non rake discussion thread? Might as well merge them if we go back to that.

As I said in other thread, BRM is not the main problem as no BRM plan will turn ev- poker into ev+ and yes, someone has to lose. Playing too many hands has to be right near the top.

They play with people who are better than them. Why are they not as good as others at the table?

1. Call too much/in wrong situations
2. Fold too much/in wrong situations
3. Bet too much/in wrong situations/too big/small
4. Raise too much/in wrong situations/too big/small

Think that pretty much covers it.

tenbob said:

Calling to much

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Not read the rest yet but this is making me a losing player right now, just started playing again and having my first go at cash games. I cannot stop from calling which is strange because I used to be a fold machine.

Also what Zach said.

Also I find myself getting pre-occupied now when I play either surfing or other stuff so maybe I am not diciplined enough and lack of concentration means missing reads and bad plays.

Ego. Players think that they are better then they really are and play at limits that are out of there skill range.

Impatience. People play for an hour or two, then feel like it's time for them to get lucky, and make stupid plays.

Sardonix said:

3)Lack of a HUD

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Definitely not a reason WHY people lose!!!!

P.S. HUDs are overrated

jordanbillie said:

Definitely not a reason WHY people lose!!!!

P.S. HUDs are overrated

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Thats your opinion, a HUD has saved me and made me money. i go with results :deal: not opinions. gl at the tables

jordanbillie said:

Definitely not a reason WHY people lose!!!!

P.S. HUDs are overrated

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Agreed. A properly used HUD can help but just having one isn't going to make you win if you're losing before it.

not taking the game seriously enough

If you can win with an HUD but can't without it, see vanquish's above post.

god hates players who lose

thererefore you will never succeeedd