Are HUDs necessary for cash games?

I'm thinking of making the switch from MTTs to cash games just because it will fit my schedule better. However, I play on a chromebook and can't DL any HUDs/tracking software to use on this laptop. And unfortunately, I am unable to purchase a new laptop any time soon.

I play on carbon and know they offer a their own stats tracking software, but it's something I have do download and isn't available with the instant play option, which is what I use to play.

Stakes start at 10nl, which is higher than I've ever played before. I'm not sure if Carbon has a lot of 10nl regs or if the games are weak/strong.

Anyway, should I wait to get a new laptop so can I use a HUD and then make the jump to cash games? Or would i be fine making stabs at without?

I'm curious as well, anyone's input would be lovely. Did it completely change your game? For better, for worse?
Thanks

Jason somerville made 50k last year on Twitch single tabling cash / sngs / Mtt's without a hud to prove it's possible.

Yes it is possible! I believe if you're going to 1 or 2 table then you don't need a HUD. action is slow enough to figure everything out and it's good practice. IF you're going to be going 3+ tables then a HUD is a definite!

HUDS are just a guide though, you should not become a robot because of your hud stats.

i'm not a pro at poker but i think it's possible. I play micro stakes without a hud and it works fine for me. I only play 1 table at a time because i'm mostly still a fish. I think when you are going to play more than 4 tables or so you need a hud.

The game is beatable without a HUD but a HUD can only benefit your game and increase your winrate.

It is possible to play without it but the strategy is more simplistic.

I think It's definitely required. Even lots of (around 3~40%?) 2NL players try to exploit players..

I want to say something snarky here, because it's such a silly question I hear a lot.

Poker is a game of incomplete information. You're constantly trying to piece together the info / intel you're gathering at your table, whether it be live or online, and then make the best possible decision based on the information you have available. So the conclusion here should be obvious. More information = POTENTIAL for better decision making.

And yes, of course you can win without a HUD. But if you put the work in, and learn how to understand stats, and how stats translate into hand ranges, you WILL win more money.

People who are anti-hud imho just don't want to put the work in. It makes no logical sense at all that you'd want to have less information at your disposal. I think people get confused between people not knowing how to properly interpret information, vs the amount of information available.

The more information you have, the better and more informed decisions you will make. This should be common sense imho.

A hud will pay for itself in no time, so I'm not sure why there is even a debate.

I'm not trying to debate whether or not HUDs are worth it and I am not anti-HUD either. I would like to use a HUD for cash games and know the benefits of it but, for reasons given in my 1st post, I am unable to play with a HUD.

I was just asking if it's worth switching to cash games without a HUD (again, I can't play with one at the moment) or if I should just hold off until I can play with one.

Thanks for the replies.

I agree 100% except for this one point.
I want to point out that the HUD works out of the box (at least it does for PT4).
So its not any work.
I think anti-HUD ppl just dont want to pay for it. IMO its an internet thing - everything on the net should be free.

We cash games regs love guys who play without a hud...
Also I thought Carbon was dodgy you should check out threads on CC regarding this. CC withdrew its freerolls off that site because they weren't paying out. That was some time ago though so but I'd still check before depositing.
Hud stats may work "out of the box" but it took me at least a year to properly understand how various stats in combination allow you to make informed decisions on player types and their exploitable tendencies. This and determining the hand ranges are the "work" John A refers to.

I've read a ton of the anti-HUD comments over the years, and that's not the sense I've gotten. If you're too cheap to pay for a HUD, you really shouldn't be playing poker for real money to begin with any ways.

that serves you much information to give the hud if many or most do not know how to interpret a hud others base their decision deciciones based on the hud as if they were robots hud destroy the game in my opinion not serve not exist before poker online and had enough good players

The stats are out of the box. Well, not really, but in a way. There are stats that you can chose to show. But, which stats are best for the game you play, and - and IMO this is the clincher - what you do with the info, and how you do it- can be a lot of work.

Some people dont want to pay, but many people dont know how to correctly use the stats.

You can 100 percent be profitable without a HUD. It could even be a good thing to do once in a while for anyone IMO as its a good way to work on some basic fundemental ABC poker. With that being said, poker is largely a game of inforomation and being able to analyze that information properly. The amount of information a HUD can give you is incredible and therefore will hugely improve your profits if used properly. I think this is even more important for cash games.

Hud is useful especially when you were multitabling and can provide you with extra edge.

play without a HUD, and it's on my profit to know I'm still in the red

I am anti Hud and it has nothing to do with not knowing how to use one or price. People should have to rely on their own knowledge and not outside infomation from a program displaying information over each players head. HUD's are also an unfair advantage against the new player joining the online poker world that have no Idea a HUD exist. Same for the rec player that might play the odd weekend.

If sites are going to allow HUD's they should make them apart of the client software download ( with an option to turn on or off ) or don't allow them at all.


That being said I would suggest not playing with a HUD as I feel they will be banned eventually and a percentage of those who became somewhat depended on them are going to go through an adjust period to catch up to those who never used them.

Very well said & U almost convinced me to download a HUD right NOW.

I actually started doing A LOT better when I switched to Bovada and knew not only were HUDS less useful there but also note taking was less useful. I take notes on players sometimes in MTTs but in cash games (and zone poker) its pretty useless for me. I did try a HUD on sites like BCP but found it distracted rather than aided me.

I think part of that is because it's easier to use a basic strategy to profit on a site without names and less HUD use. Which allows you to change up your game and try different things.

Also live play doesn't have a HUD so what do online players do when faced with live play and no HUDS?

I'm anti-HUD to the extent that I think it dilutes the fun and value of the game for recreational players. It is also super exploitable. If I know you're a HUD user I'm going to mix play up a lot, jump around tables, switch up betting patterns, and do a lot to give your stats tracker on me the wrong information. I think it takes away core aspects of the game. I think esp for newer players it gives a false sense of relying on data that may or may not be usable in a given situation and they miss core information because they're so focused on either their own stats or the villain's stats. I cringe when I see posts like "my VPIP and PR% vs. XYZ% +/- cats/pre flop *42 is good or no? Can I fix it?" because to me that's not poker and if you get into the game thinking HUD data is the secret to success you lose sight of the actual game you're playing.


That said I think if I was multi tabling 16 tables then yes using a HUD and learning what the stats mean would be helpful in making decisions quickly and without much thought.

Overall I think the real danger with HUDs is that you could become so reliant on them that you miss key information or you get into bad playing habits because you're playing based on past data and not the current hand.

This depends upon the reason why sites allow a HUD.
The only reason I can think of is that it enables multi-tabling, which increases the site's rake. If that is the actual reason, then the sites that allow HUDs wont ever ban them.

This might also explain why the sites that don't allow HUDs have less traffic.

I should clarify ... It is not likely every site bans them. I feel there will always be sites that allow HUDS. I do believe Pokerstars will eventually ban them and so will most the other main sites. Pokerstars has made it fairly clear with all the recent cut backs ... there focus isn't on the players who like to mass multi-table.

Imagine if you are a new player or a casual player and just quickly lost your deposit. You stumble across a video of someone playing with the aid of a program you have to download separate from the poker client itself. You watch and see all this extra information this player has on everyone else. There is a good chance you are going to feel a little cheated.

The game should be played with skill and information a person has learned without outside aid of a program you need to download.

Poker Choice

(1)Use HUD

(2)DO not use HUD



You can choose to use it or not, its your money your playing.

I am currently using PT4 on trial and I really like that the database tracks my hand history and I can review my sessions and mistakes later. As for HUD I do have it on and use basic information like VPIP and PFR etc but don't majorly rely on them. Most importantly I am a beginner currently trying to break even 2NL.

So my question is this: Should I invest in PT4 given my situation or is there any alternate option I can use to cover my post session needs. I may be able to pay for the HUD but I do feel the cost is a bit high given I am a newbie at micros and not even winning yet.

As for me, VPIP and PFR are much necessary at any type of poker, MTT, SnG, Cash also. How many times this typical stats save my money, when I saw aggressors or big fishes at my table. What about other, huge statistic HUDs, hmm.... I really don't know, I prefer low limits, in this case, that HUDs are not comfortable to use on them.

no, there are no necessity to use HUD in any poker games.

If you play more then 4 tables, you will need a HUD, it's better with it.

I have the same question. Hud is necessary? I think it is if you want to play multitables with a nice score.

So as a US player who hasn't used software yet, I tried researching the sites Americans are allowed to play at and also support HUDs.

1. I currently play at BetOnline, where it seems holdem indicator and freepokerdb are options (I have had trouble setting up the latter).

2. Does anyone have any suggestions for the best particular site/software combo?

You don't need to use one.

If you don't use HUD, you will just lose the advantage of knowing more about your opponent and getting them in range faster.

its up to you if you use it or not.

If you are a decent to good player, don't worry about not having a HUD transitioning over to the cash game. I play PLO and NLHE. Ironically, I don't use a HUD when playing PLO at all. It's value lies in NLHE for me. I've been for about 15 years or more. I play anywhere from .10/.25 to 2/4. I change my hand ranges up constantly, ways I react or act during hand change constantly, so for opponents using HUDS against me, it really limits their effectiveness. However, I would say that most players do fall into a set playing "style" and for players like this, the HUD is an effective tool, especially mult-tabling.

HUD does not and I'm doing wrong, because my results are disastrous but whether it would help me know

In my opinion all poker rooms should disallow HUD for players, because its not honestly against players who dont use HUDs. Personally i dont use HUD.