Calling a raise in the Big Blind with a stack under 8BBs?

[Amanda A]

I came across this question doing a quizz on a poker site.
"Should you ever call a raise from the Big Blind with a stack under 8BBs?" I answered no thinking it is a push fold situation, but apparently this is wrong. Do others agree? Thanks!

 

[pablo lima]

depending on the strength of your hand you can play call or go All in face is what I would do

 

[johnnylawford]

IMO it would depend on a number of factors:

-Opp stack - Do you have them covered or are they just going to try and push you off any flop with a bigger stack? Do you have any fold equity against their stack size?

-Opp VPIP and hand strength - Are they min raising 100% or is it a tight player? You might be calling against a high VPIP as an all-in would scare off all of the junk they're opening.
Opp position - same as above, but especially true for button/sb opens.

-ICM - Are you close to a bubble/big pay jump? It might be worth call/folding if you don't want to risk giving up all your ICM equity.

 

[thehangdude]

There are situations I might call from the BB with a short stack. A hand like JT clubs might call, planning a shove if I get any pair and any draws. I wouldn't want to risk my 8BB stack on an JTc, but paying an extra 1.5BB to win 6.5BB with a good hand is reasonable.

 

[ph_il]

I came across this question doing a quizz on a poker site.
"Should you ever call a raise from the Big Blind with a stack under 8BBs?" I answered no thinking it is a push fold situation, but apparently this is wrong. Do others agree? Thanks!

interesting question. does it give you hand examples? i think this is definitely an 'it depends' situation.

if i have a hand that i think is ahead of villains range and i know villain isn't folding if i jam, then i might just get it in. this will be with hands like 99-jj, aqs.

if i have a hand that dominates villains range and villain is capable of folding worse hands if i jam, then i might opt to just 3bet small for max value. if i have qq+, aks, and i 3bet small, i give villain odds to call with any hand and the chance to 4bet jam. both situations i'm happy with. since effective stacks are shallow at this point, the money is getting in on the flop.

if i have a hand that hits flops well but isn't strong enough to jam preflop, then i'll just flat. the reaon for this is: a) i don't have the fold equity to jam in this spot as i am getting called and likely behind villain. b) by flatting, i still get to see my true equity in the hand when i hit as i'm getting the money in. stacks are just way too shallow to fold if connect on the flop. for example: mid pairs, bottom pairs + straight draws, flush draws + backdoor straight draws, etc and i'm going to happy to get it in. also, we can donk bet a lot of strong draws and get villain to fold hands that might be slightly better against us to increase our chances of winning. for example if we have 56s and the flop is 32kr, we can jam with our gut shot draw and villain might fold hands like 10js, qjo, a9o, etc in this spot. so we deny villain their full equity in this spot. c) if i completely miss, i can fold and still have some big blinds. if you're near the bubble or a pay jump, this helps in 2 ways: a) you give yourself a better chance of winning the pot/doubling up and b) you give yourself a better chance to make the money/pay jump if you have to fold.

 

[dorynel7]

Depending what cards you have but the good game under 8bbs it s a push or fold. GL

 

[Amanda A]

Hey everyone, thanks for your answers! It doesn't give examples, but it does say "would you ever" so if there's some situations you would call, then the answer is yes, which is correct. Funny thing is, even though I answered no, I have in truth done this and called a min raise with 8 bigs or less when I have a hand I want to see the flop with and there are shorter stacks than me near a bubble or money jump. I just thought it was a no no, so I gave the answer I thought the quiz wanted to hear. LOL!

 

[Anglermeister]

This can be an option if you're sitting in the BB and plans to go all in on the flop if the opponent doesn't hit his range as well.

But usually it's mostly a shove or fold.

 

[gravac]

Maybe if is it on the bubble or you want to make a few $ more, then yes you can fold.
In every other situation is simply all in, your time is now, get it

 

[fundiver199]

Yes I think, it can make a lot of sense to call from the big blind seat with a stack below 8BB, especially if its close to 8BB, and especially if you are only facing a mini-raise. If that situation you basically pay 1BB to win a pot of around 5,5BB, so you dont need to win very often at all for this to be a profitable call.

Also when you are that short you basically dont have fold equity preflop against someone, who already put in 2BB again assuming, its a miniraise. That player is getting at least 2:1 for making the call, and with no more chips behind he basically has to call with anything, that was good enough to open in the first place.

So there is no point in rejamming with a stack of less than 8BB, unless its for value, or your stack is so short, that you will be committed postflop anyway regardless of the flop. But with for instance an 8BB stack pot will be 5,5BB with 6BB behind, and then you can certainly fold, if you have nothing at all on the flop.

Or you can run a stop-and-go, and now you actually have some fold equity, if Villain has missed completely. This is the obvious play if for instance you flopped a draw or a vulnerable pair, which will often be the case, because the hands, you do this with, tend to be not very premium.