A Proud Laydown

[Stick66]

One of my best laydowns ever. Definitely a tournament-type decision.

UTG was semi-tight but getting desperate. I knew behind me the SB was semi-loose & a questionable caller. BB was average.

I thought long and hard about going for all the chips on this one, but I also was thinking about going deeper in the match and at least cashing. I guess my read on the dude behind me is what steered my decision to fold.

I believe this was the turning point of the SNG since I went on to win it. Any comments?

 

[robwhufc]

What was the question again? Was you putting down KQ pre flop to 2 all-ins the best laydown ever? Yep, probably was.

 

[t1riel]

I would have laid this down as well. Even if your opponent only had one pair, you still behind and it's not worth a lot of chips to pray for a King or Queen to come up. The other opponent could've had a better kicker than you as well. I hate K, Q!

 

[Dorkus Malorkus]

No offence, but laying down KQ to a UTG push and a repush should be routine.

 

[Four Dogs]

This was a no brainer Sticker.

 

[Stick66]

No offence, but laying down KQ to a UTG push and a repush should be routine.

No offense taken, but jeez guys. I know these Titan screenshots are hard to follow, but I thought you've seen them before. Here's a better one below.

When I said the SB was "behind me", that means he acts AFTER me pre-flop. I was only facing one push during my turn to act. The key was that I guessed the SB would call the push behind me with borderline stuff, thus reducing the strength of my KQ. Without him, I would have called and won with Queens.

Now that we're straight, the question would be: Good fold, technically bad fold, or easy fold?

 

[Osmann]

I read it correct the first time, and I still think it's a standard fold. Because why would you want to call a push from utg with KQ? I think the best you can hope for in a situation like that is a coinflip, so it should still be a pretty standard fold, even if you thought sb would need a good hand to call the push.

 

[Dorkus Malorkus]

I read it incorrect the first time, but I still think it's a standard fold.

Fixed for me.

I blame (a) Rob, (b) the screenshot for sucking, and (c) the fact I was at work pretending I was doing something important at the time. >_>

 

[ChuckTs]

I read it correct the first time, and I still think it's a standard fold. Because why would you want to call a push from utg with KQ? I think the best you can hope for in a situation like that is a coinflip, so it should still be a pretty standard fold, even if you thought sb would need a good hand to call the push.

ditto

sure, good laydown, but this should really be an automatic fold here.
KQ is a raising hand, not a calling one - especially not preflop allin.
Even if i knew UTG to be a loose aggressive player, you're still getting at best 2 overs to 2 unders (pretty unlikely), or maybe a KJ type hand which you have dominated. More likely is a pocket pair, in which you're only getting the short end of a coinflip. You still have plenty of chips here to wait for a better opportunity.

 

[Stick66]

sure, good laydown, but this should really be an automatic fold here.

Wow! This seems to be the consensus. I guess I was overvaluing KQo in my mind. "Good raising hand, sketchy calling hand" is something I'll have to reinforce within my game.

Thanks to all for the comments.

 

[Dingodaddy23]

not even really that good of a raising hand. i'll only raise with it in LP if its folded to me

 

[ChuckTs]

not even really that good of a raising hand. i'll only raise with it in LP if its folded to me

i agree - to an extent
in a shorthanded game like the one M.S. is in, i'd raise from any position.
At a 10-handed game, i'd probably only raise it from MP - if even. Easy toss from early pos.

 

[mec1331]

I don't think you have any choice but to fold pre-flop. There is no way you can call this when 2 people go all-in in front of you. One of them is going to have a pair or at least AK suited. In all cases you would be at a disadvantage. Even if only one person went all in in front of me I wouldn't call with KQ. It just isn't that great of a hand when it is unsuited and even if it was suited I'd fold. You have to make this type of fold everytime when 2 people go all in in front of you. If i have a low pair and 2 people go all-in in front of me I fold almost everytime because I know they are going to have a higher pair.

 

[Four Dogs]

I wasn't even considering the SB, and it doesn't matter who would have won. KQ is nice hand to play from any position, even to raise with, but it's not worth an all-in call against 1 opponent let alone 2 unless your getting blinded out. In this case you seemed to be short stacked, but not desperate. I think you were right to fold.

 

[truushot]

Yeah I'm totally confused. You can't make a good laydown preflop if no one is in the hand yet. It would be a fold but not a laydown. I'm shocked you didn't bring it in for a raise in your situation and then if you folded it would be a good laydown. Maybe I read it wrong.

 

[Stick66]

Maybe I read it wrong.

Not "maybe", but definitely.

 

[Four Dogs]

Yeah I'm totally confused. You can't make a good laydown preflop if no one is in the hand yet. It would be a fold but not a laydown. I'm shocked you didn't bring it in for a raise in your situation and then if you folded it would be a good laydown. Maybe I read it wrong.

Sticker was the button. UTG raised all-in preflop.

 

[darkhorse30]

still an automatic throw away guys, yes you went on to win so it makes it seem a better lay dwn, but that late in the game with a possible str8 on the board too. u shouldnt have got that deep in the hand.

 

[ChuckTs]

LOL I don't think that anybody understands iPoker's HH screenshots...
To clarify (once again, I know it's been done several times in this thread):

PREFLOP:
"Dacomebackid" (UTG) raises 1075 and is all in
(folds around to MrS.)
"Mr.Sticker" (button) folds (KQ)
"ttr____" (small blind) raises to 1700 and is all in
big blind folds.

Then the hand is all in, and showed down.

 

[Stick66]

:banghead: :damnmate:

 

[ChuckTs]

lol I can't argue; sometimes those titan HHs confuse me too :/

 

[blankoblanco]

All the people misreading the screenshot are taking away from the fact that this is a routine laydown for any good player. From my experience, it's possible that the majority of online poker players would call this, but the majority of online poker players aren't very good. That said, overvaluing KQ os is not uncommon.