For you, check with the best hand on the river is a tricky game or a loss of value?

Vallet

Vallet

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For me, such players are the most dangerous. While you're thinking about the value bet, they're setting a trap. If you expect to bluff or have a hand, you get a re-raise and voluntarily put the money in the pot. The player's bet always gives certain information about the hand. You psychologically suppress the opponent and if he got a good hand on the river, it is difficult for him to fold. So I took note of these actions many years ago. And I use them against certain players.
Do you think a check with the best hand on the river is a loss of value or an opportunity to get more ?

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300HPGOD

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I like to check the river to bluff catch depending on the situation and the player. There are so many variants of that so its difficult to explain when I would try this and when I believe it is better to value bet. To simplify it, it would come down to do I think villain will bet here if checked to (they are either aggressive or the board comes out where they can bluff or have a hand that they might fold to if I were to bet) but fold if I were to bet.

Both the hands you post I would not check to the villain in these hands but for different reasons. Hand 1 is a hand where most villain should not be bluffing that river. Villain should have either a pocket pair or Ax. Both of those hands should have just checked behind and seen a cheap showdown. Luckily for you the villain made a mistake but I dont think I would count on a bet there unless you know the villain to do this often.

Hand 2 is a hand I can see checking the river but the villain is not going to fold there if we bet into them and they have a strong flush. Better players there with a medium flush will probably just check behind although they could bet. Checking works if they have a strong flush as they did but would you have made more in this situation of you led out there and then even though it was a paired board then villain raises you and you can then re raise? Thats up for debate but I do believe the 2nd hand is a hand where we are always going to profit when they have what they have and it just comes down to the best way of getting it.

I personally like to check the river when I really think villain has air or a missed draw. I know they never call me with a missed draw but they might bluff at when checked to, same with air. When I think villain has a little something but not strong Im more likely to bet thinking they will check behind if I check. Strong hand vs strong hand can go either way and I guess that depends on the villain.
 
spectralwave

spectralwave

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it depends a lot on the situation, but sometimes I check and sometimes I bet with value, necessarily both.
 
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63burner

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table, position, opponents..

Check the river, depends on: table you are at, position, and opponents. If you are in position, checking may add value, others who think they have a hand and will check/raise you often. If your table is full of LAG, action players, checking can induce them to "punish" your weak hand, if they assume your TAG.
If you are at a TAG table, checking may be counterproductive; they know when other players are trying to maximize their good hands, and won't bet into your check.
 
eberetta1

eberetta1

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If there are not good card combinations on the table, I will check hoping someone will raise after me.
 
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Shooter74

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it´s depends....who is your opponent? Tight or Loose?
 
perrywh

perrywh

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Agree it is based on how aggressive is the other player?
 
Vallet

Vallet

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it´s depends....who is your opponent? Tight or Loose?
Agree it is based on how aggressive is the other player?
I honestly don't remember seeing this in a poker book or in an article. Because it's a clear loss of value against any player. But a tight player can fold with a lot of hands, and a loose player can just call. We don't need any of these options. Even a tight player can put money in the pot voluntarily. They have to bet on the river themselves for various reasons. This is very important.
In the first example, I realized that I would get nothing if I made a value bet. The size of the pot provoked the opponent to bluff, because it was larger than his stack and this was his only chance to win.
In the second case, I guessed that the opponent can get a flush with a king or ace high according to the size of the bets. Sometimes players are so happy with the river that they are willing to pay more. I've fallen into these traps myself.
 
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