What is correct river sizing?

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vax1op369

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Go all in many opponents just fold. Besides the all in do you prefer 80% 2/3 or half? Do you get more calls with 80% 2/3 or half pot on river?
 
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eetenor

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Go all in many opponents just fold. Besides the all in do you prefer 80% 2/3 or half? Do you get more calls with 80% 2/3 or half pot on river?



Thank you for posting.

River sizing is dependent on many factors- Villain style- Villain range- SPR Stack to Pot Ratio- previous streets of action- purpose of bet value- bluff- combination of both.

As to more calls if you get called less often with bigger bets we want to know how much less often,

I bet 100 get called 60% but bet 500 get called 30% which bet should I make?

Hope this helps
:):)
 
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300HPGOD

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This is a very good topic to bring up. To me, your river sizing should depend on two main things. First, what is my perceived range/holding compared to my villains range in terms of strength. If I have the nuts and I think villain has a good chance of having 2nd or 3rd nuts then I am betting large on the river thinking they have a hand that they are more willing to call with. If I have the nuts and I think my villain has little I will bet small or if out of position I will even check sometimes thinking any bet villain will fold but maybe if I check here villain will bluff at the pot. Really depends on strong I think villain is. Same goes for bluffs, if I think villain is weak and I am bluffing I will make a bet (usually half pot as that is perceived as a value bet) but if I think villain is at least somewhat strong and Im weak then Im giving up. Try to scale your hand strength vs your villains strength and you will get a gauge on how much you can bet. The goal of course it to not cross the inflection point of folding (unless we are bluffing) and bet the most we can while still getting a call.

Second is villain type. The more call station they are the more we can bet when betting for value and the opposite when we are bluffing. The nittier the villain is post flop the less we have to bet to still get a crying call from them.

I use a chart in my head thats like a punnett square. I have call station vs nit and the other axis is how strong my hand vs villains is. Example is villain is call station and I have a strong hand that is just stronger than theirs... in this case we can bet huge since we think they are strong but weaker than us and will call a lot.

Effective stack size comes into play too but I think your question is stemming more from deep stack situations and not situations where you are closer to being pot committed.
 
franken222

franken222

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If I'm at the river, and there's only one opponent in with me, if I act first, I'll go all-in, if I'm somewhat unsure of winning the hand (unless I'm facing a larger stack).

If I'm pretty sure I'll win the hand, I'll raise just above the minimum, to try and draw a call, or raise.
 
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caracaski220

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caracaski220

Remember , huge over bets usually mean one of 2 things extremelly strong or very weak, probably air. So based oon the previous play you can asses witch it is. If you have a very strong hand , I qwould valuebet depending on previous action , berween 30 and 50 %. All in if you can succesfully represent a major hand or if you have a great hand and have bet as if weak.
 
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5pAce_C0wb0y

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Thank you for posting.

River sizing is dependent on many factors- Villain style- Villain range- SPR Stack to Pot Ratio- previous streets of action- purpose of bet value- bluff- combination of both.

As to more calls if you get called less often with bigger bets we want to know how much less often,

I bet 100 get called 60% but bet 500 get called 30% which bet should I make?

Hope this helps
:):)
SPR is a preflop/flop metric and measures if we are committed on the flop. So we have the same commitment thresholds that we did on the flop.
 
V

vax1op369

Rock Star
This is a very good topic to bring up. To me, your river sizing should depend on two main things. First, what is my perceived range/holding compared to my villains range in terms of strength. If I have the nuts and I think villain has a good chance of having 2nd or 3rd nuts then I am betting large on the river thinking they have a hand that they are more willing to call with. If I have the nuts and I think my villain has little I will bet small or if out of position I will even check sometimes thinking any bet villain will fold but maybe if I check here villain will bluff at the pot. Really depends on strong I think villain is. Same goes for bluffs, if I think villain is weak and I am bluffing I will make a bet (usually half pot as that is perceived as a value bet) but if I think villain is at least somewhat strong and Im weak then Im giving up. Try to scale your hand strength vs your villains strength and you will get a gauge on how much you can bet. The goal of course it to not cross the inflection point of folding (unless we are bluffing) and bet the most we can while still getting a call.

Second is villain type. The more call station they are the more we can bet when betting for value and the opposite when we are bluffing. The nittier the villain is post flop the less we have to bet to still get a crying call from them.

I use a chart in my head thats like a punnett square. I have call station vs nit and the other axis is how strong my hand vs villains is. Example is villain is call station and I have a strong hand that is just stronger than theirs... in this case we can bet huge since we think they are strong but weaker than us and will call a lot.

Effective stack size comes into play too but I think your question is stemming more from deep stack situations and not situations where you are closer to being pot committed.

Enjoyed your post, thx for comment, goal is to find perfect spot get called most often tho k anymore it’s somewhere between half pot and 80 percent
 
V

vax1op369

Rock Star
This is a very good topic to bring up. To me, your river sizing should depend on two main things. First, what is my perceived range/holding compared to my villains range in terms of strength. If I have the nuts and I think villain has a good chance of having 2nd or 3rd nuts then I am betting large on the river thinking they have a hand that they are more willing to call with. If I have the nuts and I think my villain has little I will bet small or if out of position I will even check sometimes thinking any bet villain will fold but maybe if I check here villain will bluff at the pot. Really depends on strong I think villain is. Same goes for bluffs, if I think villain is weak and I am bluffing I will make a bet (usually half pot as that is perceived as a value bet) but if I think villain is at least somewhat strong and Im weak then Im giving up. Try to scale your hand strength vs your villains strength and you will get a gauge on how much you can bet. The goal of course it to not cross the inflection point of folding (unless we are bluffing) and bet the most we can while still getting a call.

Second is villain type. The more call station they are the more we can bet when betting for value and the opposite when we are bluffing. The nittier the villain is post flop the less we have to bet to still get a crying call from them.

I use a chart in my head thats like a punnett square. I have call station vs nit and the other axis is how strong my hand vs villains is. Example is villain is call station and I have a strong hand that is just stronger than theirs... in this case we can bet huge since we think they are strong but weaker than us and will call a lot.

Effective stack size comes into play too but I think your question is stemming more from deep stack situations and not situations where you are closer to being pot committed.

Thank you for posting.

River sizing is dependent on many factors- Villain style- Villain range- SPR Stack to Pot Ratio- previous streets of action- purpose of bet value- bluff- combination of both.

As to more calls if you get called less often with bigger bets we want to know how much less often,

I bet 100 get called 60% but bet 500 get called 30% which bet should I make?

Hope this helps
:):)



Good stuff thx mate
 
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eetenor

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SPR is a preflop/flop metric and measures if we are committed on the flop. So we have the same commitment thresholds that we did on the flop.


Thank you for responding.

The reason I mentioned SPR on the river was depending on earlier streets the SPR could be as high as 5 or as low as 1.2. If the SPR is 1.2 on the river betting 80% pot makes less sense than if the SPR was 2>. We would often shove for value or as a bluff with SPR 1.2 rather than choose an 80% sizing.

It is true that we use SPR preflop and flop to understand our pot commitment when we are short stacked. It helps to know that we have low fold equity when we have a low SPR preflop and how easy it will be to get our stack in when we want to.

However that is not the only use of SPR- if we are 80bb deep or more preflop we want to use betting strategies on all streets to create the SPR we want on the river to encourage our Villain to call or fold. So river SPR does matter as the question asked was not specific in any way as to pot size or stack size. So if SPR was 3 on the river and we had the nuts and we thought our V would call a big bet but not a shove we could bet 1.2 pot confidently. If however the same V had SPR of 2 and we bet 1.2 pot they might see that as being too big a bet to call in relation to their SPR. Especially in tournaments.
Also if we are trying to get value or possibly induce a shove at the same time with our river bet sizing we want to know what the SPR is on the river.

Hope this helps
:):)
 
maestro121920

maestro121920

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For me if I want to value bet 20 to 23% of the pot. The villain can call with a medium pair or small pair. If I bet half he can't call. Just my observation.

If bluff I will bet around 60 to 80% of the pot so it will look like a value bet to the villain.
 
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