Do you try and limp and set mine with 88 UTG?

Pokerstudy

Pokerstudy

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What would you call a raise ..2:1 to see if you flop a set? Or more?

I never limp, but I would with 88 UTG ...It is risky, but I do it. BTW I hate limping. Limping attracts limpers and you get a limpeeeeed that follows and usually someone wakes up with a flop that agrees with their hand very well. Blah. Raise or fold. But 88 UTG..I limp, like a fool?

Set mine reference
http://www.pokerjunkie.com/set-mining-explained#:~:text=%20Set%20Mining%20in%20Poker%2C%20Explained%20%201,is%2C%20the%20odds%20against%20it%20are...%20More%20
 
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thatguy6793

thatguy6793

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I think its always worth it to see the flop with pocket pair anything, especially for set mining. I wouldn't limp though, if youre limping your pairs from EP and get to showdowns only when you have a set people paying attention will easily exploit that and you'll lose all the value set mining gives you. I'd say play pocket pair from EP as you would AA or AKs so that your range isn't as predictable.
 
Pokerstudy

Pokerstudy

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I think its always worth it to see the flop with pocket pair anything, especially for set mining. I wouldn't limp though, if youre limping your pairs from EP and get to showdowns only when you have a set people paying attention will easily exploit that and you'll lose all the value set mining gives you. I'd say play pocket pair from EP as you would AA or AKs so that your range isn't as predictable.

I like that response, a lot! It does set me up for losing hands later down the road with anyone remembering , I like your thinking! Nice
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IMO Limping just does not work, if it does, I would love to talk about situations where limping does work..I just have not found one myself. :)_
 
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BatOneHat

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Limp with Small Pockets

I know it’s probably wrong but I tend to limp with small pockets. The chance of winning is low, at least in the 9 ring that I play. So you need to hit the set to win anyway so why put in more chips.
 
acemenow

acemenow

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I can see limping behind this in late position, but otherwise in any EP position if I am opening its an open raise with 88 usually 2.2-3.1 bbs
 
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Dhendrixon

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If you are the first one to enter the pot you should be entering with a raise. You will become exploitable if you are just limping with your weaker ranges and raising your stronger ranges. A good player will pick up on the betting tells and exploit you. You are playing your range not your cards. If your opening range has 88 in it you should raise like you have AA. Usually for UTG the cut off on the opening range is 77+ .

However, if you are not the first person to enter the call you can over limp or call the preflop raiser. Remember to ensure they have enough money in their stack to call so if you hit the set you can get paid.
 
Pokerstudy

Pokerstudy

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I can dig it, UTG raise automatically sings strength, 88 is weak, but a UTG raise would scare anyone into thinking I had QQ KK AK AA. (JJ maybe) I myself always fear the UTG raiser, (as my golden rule is not to raise UTG without AQ or lower, AQ is sketchy at best, but I do it)....88 is a hand to bluff with at UTG? Would any A10 or KQ call it with say 5x BB? Thin the field for a set mine, or just a weak flop to C-bet if it turns lower cards?

I am honestly curious!, I never thought about it before lol

AJ in the real poker world is a freakin disaster. Maybe not online, but phew, it can run you into all kinds of problems! Hate AJ. I don't hate many things, but I hate AJ! Unless suited. (just because it looks good, I will drop it and not chase the flush draw most of the time) I lost an extra few hundred bucks chasing AJ suited at final table online and...last live game I lost AJ against AQ. FU AJ!!! / Rant over.
 
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jadaminato

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Mmmm seems like a bad idea to me. When you open a hand you stand on a range, which will interact in certain ways with the board. Within that range sometimes you will be in the top and sometimes in the weakest part. Based on this, you will make the decisions corresponding to the development of the action. Many times your hand is not going to hit the board but your perceived range is, and you are going to have a lot of efficient bluffs then.
Day by day I see that many people fail to avoid sizing tells. Even in freeroll club games it is not uncommon to find someone who suddenly opens x4.8 when they have been doing it all day x2. You cannot be giving that information, it is too valuable. That's why I think 88 is a raise from UTG and depending on who is floats, it will often turn into bluffing or showdown hand at least.
 
Collin Moshman

Collin Moshman

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It can make sense to limp low pocket pairs (22-66 in particular) at a very loose-passive table. I would definitely raise 88 though because it's a strong hand that does particularly well in heads-up and short-handed spots. You will often win a small-to-medium sized pot even without hitting a set.
 
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suitedsadness

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I would always raise with 88 UTG, in my opinion, you shouldn't have a limping range UTG, but I like to mix in some limps in late positions with hands like 22 to set mine. It may not be correct, but I think there are bigger mistakes I make in play anyway.
 
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DevaCat

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88 is something like the 10th best hand to open with, after 99+ and AQ+. Why would you ever limp with it? You didn't say if you were playing 9- or 6-handed, but if 6-handed you're a heavy favourite to have the best hand preflop (as there are 5 players to act, and 5.1% of hands are better than you). Plus, if you openlimp and the CO or BTN are paying attention and are dealt anything at all, you're just getting raised to 4 or 5bb, and you're then playing out of position and having conceded the initiative, putting you in lots of difficult spots on boards like KT6.

I also agree with what various other posters said about your range. If you make your preflop ranging contingent on the cards, you're playing your hand face up, and won't get value when you're dealt QQ+ in early position.
 
Pokerstudy

Pokerstudy

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UTG is really the only part of the game that it feels like gambling to me, it’s a long uphill battle and it’s why I hardly play from it. For me though, it is tempting to try and set mine lol..I agree it could end up being the best hand but it’s so easily dominated. I agree with not limping as a way to disguise your range and that bet sizing should be consistent, which is what I usually do in most cases..for some reason UTG 88+ pocket pairs always trip me up .It is always worth raising consistently in size though for all the reasons explained above.
 
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