Can playing "too well" on 2NL be bad for you?

Hi all, I play 2NL 6max

This has been discussed a lot, but I want to ask a specific question, bet sizing.

I've been reading a few articles about bet sizing and those envolve quite a lot of situational awareness from both you and your opponent. Honestly I almost always use 3xbb for RFI (more if there are limpers) then I will bet 2/3 of the pot regardless if I have a hand or not. And 2/3 is pretty much my standard bet size post flop. Of course I may 3Bet, go allin sometimes.

Do you think I should get more fancy with my betting on 2NL? Or my opponents won't appreciate my betting skills and it will only do me more harm than good?

Best

PS: Here is an example of the betting techniques I am talking about:

https://upswingpoker.com/bet-size-strategy-tips-rules/

the game

PokerPT2645 said:

Hi all, I play 2NL 6max

This has been discussed a lot, but I want to ask a specific question, bet sizing.

I've been reading a few articles about bet sizing and those envolve quite a lot of situational awareness from both you and your opponent. Honestly I almost always use 3xbb for RFI (more if there are limpers) then I will bet 2/3 of the pot regardless if I have a hand or not. And 2/3 is pretty much my standard bet size post flop. Of course I may 3Bet, go allin sometimes.

Do you think I should get more fancy with my betting on 2NL? Or my opponents won't appreciate my betting skills and it will only do me more harm than good?

Best

Click to expand...

there is no such thing as playing to well
but there is playing to tight meaning only playing premium hands
sometimes you have to play mediocre hands mix up your game play

if you wish to experiment, maybe try x2.5 in utg, x3 in mp, and x 3.5 on button...regardless of whether you have a pp or 9T+ sooted.

if you are c-betting every hand on the flop, this makes you exploitable to good players...but i guess they are mostly abc level 1 players at 1/2.

also...if you are beating 1/2 nlhe, get out as soon as possible...upgrade your stakes and your game.

My cash game brm regime would horrify most members...but imo one should play the highest stakes that one can regularly beat...and stay on the edge of one's comfort zone. To get better, one must play against opponents better than one's self...and slowly learn how to make money off them.

https://www.888poker.com/magazine/strategy/all-about-6-max-opening-ranges-and-hand-selection-charts

Too well? Perfect poker would be GTO which IMO would be a huge mistake at micro's and even live $1/$2 - $5-$10. The more mistakes your opponents are making the further you need to vary from perfect poker in order to exploit them. Bet bigger with bigger hands, Cbet more often, if they're folding to often steal more often with smaller bet sizing.

Thanks for the replies.

Yes Cbetting continuously will make me exploitable, but 2NL is pretty rudimental I guess.

So far I only played around 1,200 hands single table, I am getting 18bb/100, but I have to say I feel pretty comfortable at 2NL and maybe it's not a good sign, perhaps I should move up to 5NL. I just don't want to make the move too soon, because I am still learning quite a lot on 2NL even it's not directly linked to the actual play, for example how to study my hands history, understand what I need to study in more detail, etc.

When would you guys move to 5NL? Or should I simply forget about 2NL and just go straight to 5NL? I mean I have some cash to spend on learning, I would have some 60-70 buy ins for 5NL + a few hundred bucks to spend on learning materials.

You have the roll move up now. I piddled about for far to long at 2NL to be honest.

PokerPT2645 said:

PS: Here is an example of the betting techniques I am talking about:

https://upswingpoker.com/bet-size-strategy-tips-rules/

Click to expand...

I think it's absolutely worth understanding and implementing many of these strategies at 2NL. You will need them if you ever plan to move up. In my opinion if you studied and used them you would start to understand how they can improve your win rate. As with anything, no rule or strategy is 100% effective and inflexible. You'll need to adjust depending on the players, the situation, etc but in general these are all good things to know and start to implement. It will be much easier to learn these lessons at 2NL than at higher stakes.

As for moving up, 1,200 hands isn't much of a sample so I could go either way (I've logged more hands that that in a single session). If you're in a rush to move up you certainly have the BR to do it. If not you could try to implement some of these and other techniques at 2NL for the next 1,200 hands and then re-eval moving up every 1k or so hands.

PokerPT2645 said:

Thanks for the replies.


When would you guys move to 5NL? Or should I simply forget about 2NL and just go straight to 5NL? I mean I have some cash to spend on learning, I would have some 60-70 buy ins for 5NL + a few hundred bucks to spend on learning materials.

Click to expand...

if you have a $350 roll, you should move up to 2/5 today....also i would suggest you make the occasional foray into 5/10...see if you feel comfortable.

i repeat...you should play the highest stakes you can beat...and only you can find out what those stakes are. You should be in your comfort zone, or you will not play your A-Game...but you should be on the edge of it...that will keep you alert and focussed...and you will not take the game...or your winnings...for granted.

i have about 2k in b-roll...and play 50/100 with $100 sit down....so my roll is about 20 x my buy in. But I started playing this stake when i only had a 1k roll....slowly i learned my opponents...who were better than me...and slowly i started to win. I play on SwC....a bitcoin site...very small player pool. I play with mostly the same players every day...and occasionally a new fish walks in...

the only way you will get better is by playing better opponents.

When you Cbet too much you become exploitable. You should ask yourself if I cbet and get raised then what will I do? If you are cbetting 70%+ I would definitely be 3 betting your bet as often as possible in position. You need to mix check calling and check raising into your arsenal as well. This will allow you to get max value for many more hands.

To answer your question, I typically cbet an amount based on my range and the callers range. If I have the range and nut advantage I will cbet 3/4 pot, if I have the range but not the nut advantage, then I bet about 1/3 - 1/2 pot. If the flop smashes your callers range them I normally would check call for pot control or check fold.

PokerPT2645 said:

Hi all, I play 2NL 6max

This has been discussed a lot, but I want to ask a specific question, bet sizing.

I've been reading a few articles about bet sizing and those envolve quite a lot of situational awareness from both you and your opponent. Honestly I almost always use 3xbb for RFI (more if there are limpers) then I will bet 2/3 of the pot regardless if I have a hand or not. And 2/3 is pretty much my standard bet size post flop. Of course I may 3Bet, go allin sometimes.

Do you think I should get more fancy with my betting on 2NL? Or my opponents won't appreciate my betting skills and it will only do me more harm than good?

Best

Click to expand...

Really depends on what you mean by fancy. I think 3bb open is mostly allright at Nl2 personally I'd still go smaller because of rake.

Playing a 2/3 cbet strat on all boards, positions is pretty old school for instance. I would adapt and bet smaller.

bluff checkraising rivers with a fish allready having 40% of his stack in the middle is something which I'd consider to fancy. Cause fish won't fold anyway.

Now these things are something that won't make a huge difference in terms of being a winning player, but since edges are quite thin anyway every bit counts imo.

Sorry to ask about notation here... 2NL is 1 cent SB and 2 cent BB? or is it 1 USD SB and 2 USD BB?
I'm quite new to cash games so I hope someone can help me clarify this.
Thanks a lot in advance!

Highsolation said:

Sorry to ask about notation here... 2NL is 1 cent SB and 2 cent BB? or is it 1 USD SB and 2 USD BB?
I'm quite new to cash games so I hope someone can help me clarify this.
Thanks a lot in advance!

Click to expand...

Yes, in general 2NL is 1 cent SB, 2 cent BB. If the dollar sign is included then it is $2NL and $1 SB and $2 BB. 200NL would be the same as $2NL.

PokerPT2645 said:

Hi all, I play 2NL 6max

This has been discussed a lot, but I want to ask a specific question, bet sizing.

I've been reading a few articles about bet sizing and those envolve quite a lot of situational awareness from both you and your opponent. Honestly I almost always use 3xbb for RFI (more if there are limpers) then I will bet 2/3 of the pot regardless if I have a hand or not. And 2/3 is pretty much my standard bet size post flop. Of course I may 3Bet, go allin sometimes.

Do you think I should get more fancy with my betting on 2NL? Or my opponents won't appreciate my betting skills and it will only do me more harm than good?

Best

Click to expand...

At this limit, you do not need to invent anything! Opponents are unlikely to notice and will be able to exploit the size of your bets! I often do overbets with NATs and usually pay for them!

c0rnBr34d said:

Yes, in general 2NL is 1 cent SB, 2 cent BB. If the dollar sign is included then it is $2NL and $1 SB and $2 BB. 200NL would be the same as $2NL.

Click to expand...

Thanks for the explanation!

If you're playing well, then you might be turning a profit, and in turn ready to move up to 5NL. Personally I started on 5NL because that's the lowest ignition has (I stopped playing online for a long time and only recently this year did I get back into it, and that was the site that seemed to be recommended the most). When I started playing on ACR/Black Chip I played mostly 2NL and realized it was the same regs and very few recs. So playing "too well" at that limit with those guys might be ideal haha. Eventually I got tired of seeing the same people and went back to ignition and moved up to 10NL which feels like 5NL with more money (the skill gap isn't noticeable IMO).