youregoodmate
Cardschat Elite
Silver Level
Yes, folding is an option. Just as skydiving without a parachute is an option.
akran75
Legend
Bronze Level
I hate when I get tickets AK.I did not know to play.
and now I read this topic and I am nothing again learned.hundred people ,hundred idea.
My opinion is that is still going strong with the Reis than a tactic. If poker is one of poyitivnih feature aggressive play, then do not wait just moyen AA KK..to be aggressive
and now I read this topic and I am nothing again learned.hundred people ,hundred idea.
My opinion is that is still going strong with the Reis than a tactic. If poker is one of poyitivnih feature aggressive play, then do not wait just moyen AA KK..to be aggressive
777BODYA777
Rising Star
Bronze Level
my argument against overcall. First, your equity is stretched thin from number of callers. Second your OOP. Third your HJ CO and BTN players have an extremely wide range making your OOP very difficult. Fourth, people are particularly wary of big ace hands which makes your value plays less rewarding. Fifth you want to widen up your 3bet range to get value on your big pocket pairs, and AK is a great hand to do it with. Sixth, your post flop play against a single caller is solid with the betting lead. Your most likely against a smaller ace, big suited connectors, or medium pocket pairs. You have decent equity against most of this and fold equity against the rest. You can easily cbet any jack or better board, get value if your ace or king connects against a smaller ace or king by repping a likely second best hand.
W
Weisssound
Rock Star
Silver Level
Don't play AK aggressively in a cash game?? I must be missing something.
Let's look at AK vs. possible holdings of the open raiser.
AK vs. Other Aces and KQ. Obviously other AK combos null out. Mid position, let's give him credit down to ATo.
That's 64 combos of hands where you are 72% favorite to win.
AK vs. QQ or less
That's 66 combos where you are a 45% dog to win.
AK vs. AA or KK
There are 4 combos where you are 20% doggy dog to win.
There are 4 combos where you are 9% dirty dog.
So our weighted average is:
[(64x72) + (66x45) + (4x20) + (4x9)]/138
56%. If it's better than flips move the chips!!
You're a favorite overall with a raise against a fairly tight player. Obviously if your first opponent is opening things like suited connectors there's a lot of hands that fold out here as well. So most of the time your opponent is folding here. It would be a mistake for your opponent to flat with players behind in position, so anything very strong is getting shoved. Now you have to really evaluate the situation. There's less KKs and AAs than JJ and QQ, so you might have to suck it up and go for it...
Let's look at AK vs. possible holdings of the open raiser.
AK vs. Other Aces and KQ. Obviously other AK combos null out. Mid position, let's give him credit down to ATo.
That's 64 combos of hands where you are 72% favorite to win.
AK vs. QQ or less
That's 66 combos where you are a 45% dog to win.
AK vs. AA or KK
There are 4 combos where you are 20% doggy dog to win.
There are 4 combos where you are 9% dirty dog.
So our weighted average is:
[(64x72) + (66x45) + (4x20) + (4x9)]/138
56%. If it's better than flips move the chips!!
You're a favorite overall with a raise against a fairly tight player. Obviously if your first opponent is opening things like suited connectors there's a lot of hands that fold out here as well. So most of the time your opponent is folding here. It would be a mistake for your opponent to flat with players behind in position, so anything very strong is getting shoved. Now you have to really evaluate the situation. There's less KKs and AAs than JJ and QQ, so you might have to suck it up and go for it...
maik357
Rock Star
Silver Level
Mid position with AK is for me a definite flat call for this situation. Most chances one of the other 3 have a monster better than yours. Look is cheaper as risking a chunk for a 259 board and some has 45 suited and more rags pop on board because the other 2 villians have an A or K in hand that you wished came in flop. What was the out come what did you do?
maik357
Rock Star
Silver Level
You are correct I misread. I mixed SB and mid position. I need to read a bit slower. Villian was mid position raiser. 3 bet would be good. Question is how high? Probably pot size would scare too many away.:flowers:
akran75
Legend
Bronze Level
arty:
W
Weisssound
Rock Star
Silver Level
"Villian was mid position raiser. 3 bet would be good. Question is how high? Probably pot size would scare too many away."
Out of position, and really even in position, I'm happy to get folds all around with AK. I don't mind going heads up for sure, but the implied odds for AK aren't so great unless you have a very loose image or you're playing against a bluffy/aggro player. But there's a lot of pitfalls that come along with AK post flop.
Out of position, and really even in position, I'm happy to get folds all around with AK. I don't mind going heads up for sure, but the implied odds for AK aren't so great unless you have a very loose image or you're playing against a bluffy/aggro player. But there's a lot of pitfalls that come along with AK post flop.
Thinker_145
Visionary
Silver Level
How is AK a stronger tournament hand than a cash game hand? In cash games very rarely is someone going to call an all in with TT or lower PP. Even JJ is a hard all in call in cash games. In tournaments on the other hand people will call your shove with middle pairs all the time so shoving it is not always a good option.
Anyways if the table is as crazy as you say it is I am shoving this every single time. If we are afraid to lose all our stack in this situation then clearly we shouldn't be playing at this level.
The greatest strength of AK lies in it's ability to pick out a ton of uncontested pots and even if someone comes along for the ride there are all but 2 hands that have you in big trouble. And the odds of someone holding those hands while you are holding AK are significantly low to the point that being a maniac here is profitable.
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Anyways if the table is as crazy as you say it is I am shoving this every single time. If we are afraid to lose all our stack in this situation then clearly we shouldn't be playing at this level.
The greatest strength of AK lies in it's ability to pick out a ton of uncontested pots and even if someone comes along for the ride there are all but 2 hands that have you in big trouble. And the odds of someone holding those hands while you are holding AK are significantly low to the point that being a maniac here is profitable.
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H
heavystack
Rock Star
Silver Level
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Sheffield, England
Plays at: pokerstars
Game: NLHE
Posts: 2,286
Quote:
Originally Posted by love that omaha
Even a fold is an option
Yes, folding is an option. Just as skydiving without a parachute is an option.
__________________
Im not tilted, Im just ****ed off.
Thats pretty funny. how sick would you be to fold and flop comes 10,j,Q..
No way folding is an option.. To bad its not suited...
Location: Sheffield, England
Plays at: pokerstars
Game: NLHE
Posts: 2,286
Quote:
Originally Posted by love that omaha
Even a fold is an option
Yes, folding is an option. Just as skydiving without a parachute is an option.
__________________
Im not tilted, Im just ****ed off.
Thats pretty funny. how sick would you be to fold and flop comes 10,j,Q..
No way folding is an option.. To bad its not suited...
Thinker_145
Visionary
Silver Level
While you are correct this is never a fold but your reasoning is completely wrong. By that logic we should also never fold 23 because the flop might come A45 or 332.
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maik357
Rock Star
Silver Level
This is why people tend to forget poker does have a percentage of luck. If a donk was holding 23 and 233 flopped, he is lucky, or would some one call that skill? Same for AK. The skill is now the next move. Bad luck for AK, does he shove, does he chk, does he call? He has maybe a 2% chance of hitting runne runner.
belerophon
Rock Star
Silver Level
One thing I would add here is that what you could do depends on how you are perceived at the table.
To my mind, ideally if you've been playing tight and can make em all fold then great, pick up those bets and call it a hand but if you've been playing loose and aggressive then over-betting may not work anyway.
Having said that, pre-flop agression is your friend here. You'll be out of position post flop so if you can narrow the field, do it.
To my mind, ideally if you've been playing tight and can make em all fold then great, pick up those bets and call it a hand but if you've been playing loose and aggressive then over-betting may not work anyway.
Having said that, pre-flop agression is your friend here. You'll be out of position post flop so if you can narrow the field, do it.
G
GWU73
Visionary
Silver Level
I would tend to 3bet/ fold to 4bet AK0, but flat if suited. The value of a 3bet is obvious. The reason I would tend to flat if suited is I want to win a BIG pot whenever I can and I am willing to gamble $25 to win $1800+. I want callers if I hit a monster or a strong draw.
C
chauncey274
Enthusiast
Silver Level
Exactly.
A large 3 bet, like 200, and then jam on the flop on pretty much every board. That way even when you miss making a pair you maximize fold equity and your hand can EASILY be read as aces or kings. The only way this isn't profitable is if the original raiser only raises aces or kings. If he extend his raising range to even just the top 10% of hands, you're making good money here.