Tournament Late Registration:

Tournament Late Registration:
I have been playing poker on internet for approximately 6 months. I am learning a little at a time and have a super player as my coach. We talk/email back & forth quite often. We played in 3 of the same games within the last 5-7 days. I get nervous playing against him, but have done fairly well. This PM is about late registration's. At this time I try to understand that this happens to get players that are running late. I've kept some records for several months that I've played in and 95% always have late entries. My coach has no problem and tries to convince me it's not a big deal. What disturbs me (and my game) is after 5-10 minutes names pop up over the number of players in the game at START TIME.
On several occasions I have lost quite a few chips and then these strangers jump in with 1500 chips and to me that is unfair. Say I now have 500 chips and he/they have 1500 for some reason doesn't set well with me. Keep in mind though, that I realize that the organizers want as many players as possible to make the purses larger and more rakes for the clubs or whomever the rakes go to. Just wanted to know if anybody else has this problem or if it is a problem to them? It plays with my mind and then I can't concentrate and get lousy at play. Thanks, Boston1993

It's completely fair, you started out with the same amount of chips as they did and you have the opportunity to see more hands at the early stages of the tournament, giving you the edge as a matter of fact. Play tight at the beginning of the tournament and you should be fine.

I agree with the above, the info you need is all the game lobby under Tournament info, it is all there how long registration is extended for, so if you dont like the terms of the game don't enter it, find one that suits you.

Actually I have done it a few times, I have waited till the extended reg was just about over and then registered and had a few good payouts, you will find that in most of these tourneys the first hour is where all the lunatics get knocked out, and if you play well after that you will get deep into the tourney.

i've also taken advantage of the late registration, especially in the super turbos. and i might do it more often since the beginnings are a lot of donks and more aggressive play.

there was a time i sat out for the first 10-20 minutes for that same reason.

Yes I agree it is very frustrating this late registration if it is for 10 minutes not too bad but an hour is way too long.

I never enter tournaments later than 15 minutes past the beginning, I play super tight hoping to get it all in with a lunatic, have a nice double up, and wait for more premiums until registration is over. I feel like waiting for registration to almost be over is a waste of money as you are already playing short stacked to almost any good poker player.

I have had good success entering tournaments late, as long as I would have at least 20 BB left I will jump in. So basically it has to be a 3000 starting stack with 10-15 minute blinds

Like I said earlier I have done it a few times with great success, so far I have had 2 Approx $80 cashes and 1 $115 cash, I always leave it till 59 mins after the start and with the 3000 starting stack you end up either just below or just above avg chip stack, and no shove monkeys to contend with at the beggining of the tourney, the only drawback is not having a chance to stack some of the shove monkeys.

With all that said I would only do it with a starting stack of 3000.

I agree with Boston. Lets face it you can't always stop the bad beats.
when you take a bad hit and then see new players come in with more chips, it seems totally unfair. I have always been a puntual person in life priding myself on being on time. Anyone in the working field must realize the importance of being on time. If one can't be on time for a tourney then maybe one shouldn't be in the tourney. maybe a 5 or 10 minute leeway is alright, but shouldn't be any more.

I have actually played in live tourneys where they allowed players to buy in late. Some even let players who have busted out rebuy back into the tourney. To work hard at eliminating a decent player and then see them turn around and rebuy right back into the tourney is disheartening. This is totally unfair!! It takes some of the fairness and enjoyment out of a tourney.

heh? Granted it took me a while to come around on this but you want people late regging.

First off, by registering on time for the start you have a shot at the idiots who stack off early. Late reg players miss out on this. If you can catch a great deck early and double or triple you are in great shape obviously, but in ridiculous shape compared to the late registering players who don't geta shot at some of the early spew.

How is it a bad thing if players register 45 minutes in adding equity to the prize pool, but maybe have only 30bb max to play with? They are at a significant disadvantage for not having had the chance to wait for some hands early. This is even better if you have built a stack - you can bust them selectively- while they can't bust you. Essentially, especially with shallower structures, people are not giving themselves much of a chance regging late - and might even be essentially dead money in a turbo bc there stack is so small relative to the blinds.

This is a trend that is only going to expand anyway. Bodog added it not that long ago (which i hated lol) because they were overlaying their guarantees so much. Now the late registrants tend to bring it close to or over the guarantee (sunday 100k excluded). On pokerstars and tilt, late registrations tend to rocket the prize pools way above the guarantee - and a bigger prize pool is never bad.

The only network that I know there is left that doesn't allow any late reg (USA friendly that is) is Merge. I'm happy about it there because they give away so much overlay in everything it's ridiculous! Other then a sweet overlay though...I don't see the problem.

I too have had success registering late, and the best success was the absolute latest. 59 mins with 1 to go.

My thinking is that in most tourneys it is the spewtards that cause me the most trouble, so by registering late I avoid most of them. The ones who are left are generally nits (I know, very broad accusation there) and I can play a bit looser.

So I don't have any problem with either end of the late registration thingy.

Wow I feel the opposite is true , when I register late . I have no luck at all, also the blinds are higher...good luck at the tables

I like the late reg, before I register late, I check how far behind the average chip stack I will be. If I get 3000 chips for the buy in and the average is less than 4000 I will definately get in. I feel my chances aren't too bad in that scenario. If I get 1500, I would like the average to be less than 2000. Late reg is good as you don't have to rush to make a "deadline"

The ONLY thing I don't like about late registration is when I am playing tournament with Guaranteed money and it looks like there will be a lot added by the poker room and it ends up with no EV. The fair/not fair is irrelevant, it seems obvious that good players want to play MORE hands to level out luck as much as possible.

Stix

You will never start above average chip stack with the initial chip number - the best you can hope for is to be exactly at even (no one out)

I also agree with boston when it comes to "late registration" because to me it seems that there is enough time for players to register for WHATEVER tournament they would like to participate.Thats why i don't play real large tourny's unless i satellite into one.The best advice i can give is simply not play tourny's with late reg if you think it's unfair because they sure is hell aren't going to change the rules!

You have to look at it both ways... you have a chance to get down to 500, but you also have equal spots to get to 3000, more hands played, cheaper blinds, and more donks at the beginning than near the end of the entry period (if its an hour long)

Might just be me, but seems to me this is a HUGE leak for you. The spewtards are the ones you are supposed to stack!

I'm going to guess you've been sucked out on a few times and didn't like it? What about the times you are the beneficiary of the spew? THose times give you a much bettr shot to win.

THe dead money goes early... and you could easily be missing the cooler hand of AA for you and KK for the other guy.

Don't fear the spewtards- embrace them!

People keep saying that it isn't fair, how can it not be fair if the extended registration time is advertised in the tourney info, If ppl don't like it that others are registering late then they should not enter tourneys that have late reg.

Wow, never is a big statement to make...... I must have dreamt the 1 time (so far) that it happened to me, and like I said I was just above avg by about 35 chips.

Well if a wizard like dj does it the same way as I do, I must be doing something right.
It is the spewtards that frustrate me to want to reg late also.

I do not have a huge problem with the late reg but if I had a choice I would limit it to say 5 mins.

Well for pokerstars its pretty simple. They guarantee money in the prize pool to draw people in thinking they will be adding money but they keep the registration open long enough to make sure there are enough players to exceed the guarantee. I personally have never seen a PS tourney where they had to add money to get to the guaranteed prize pool except maybe some of the special tourneys that have 1 million guaranteed or something.

what gets me is the people that last minute register in a turbo. how are you gonna start an mtt with an M of less than 5 thats just crazy.

That is impossible, you must have looked at it wrong because for simplicity sake let's say 10 people buy in and have 1000 chips each. If one busts out the average stack is now higher because the same amount of chips are being split amonst more people. The new average would be about 1,133 and you would enter with just 1,000 and the more people that bust out the more the average stack goes up.

Late registration is completely fair. It's balanced since the earlier you'll be in the tourney the more hands you'll see for cheaper + you'll be up against the lousier players in the beginning

I also think it's fair although I don't wait to reg late myself. I enjoy trying for that quick double up opportunity against the early fish and if it doesn't happen I'm rarely so far behind that I don't feel like I'm still in the hunt.

I do see how in a turbo or depending on stack size it could be a concern however.

I would not consider doing that too often, it is a form of cheating called collusion and Full Tilt will kick you off and keep your money.

As far as LR goes, It does not really hurt you, but at the same time it does not help you to register late. Just bc you went through a couple more blinds then them (When the blinds are at 15/30, LR usually closes at the 2nd level). I often register late in the Daily Dollar to cut down on the looong amounts of time.

I understand what you are saying here, but would like to know what others think about this. I done see it as collusion based on OPs choice of wording. It doesent sound like they are chating while playing, tho I would guess there is chat going on after the game, so his coach can go through some hand analysis with him. He said he was nervous playing against his coach, so I suspect softplaying is not going on. OP may take a re raise from his coach as a danger signal, as he respects the coaches play, but since I believe they are playing the same games so his coach can spot some leaks, than I suspect his coach would play rough against him as against any other player. Hes not a good coach if he does not exploit weak play and point it out after the game. Since they obviously are familiar with each others playing style, they will make decisions accordingly, but is this not just poker, keeping tabs on how someone plays and then making your plays based on your knowledge? As long as no comunication or softplaying or any other breach of rules is happening, is this still a form of breach of ettiquet? I dont see it so yet.

Sorry for the hijack, I will get back on to OPs point - or not as I dont play LR games at all, but am now from this thread a bit piqued to see what they are like. I have always avoided them since I didnt know anything about them, but gained a bit of knowledge here. It seems most late comers - from what I have read here, and correct me if this is not true - are better players who dont like stacking of against spewtards, ( I do lol) with the occasional spewtard late as well. I would personally want to start on time to have a stack edge against the better LR players. I have read in other threads that the oppinions on LR games go both ways. I will try to do some and check back here. And I would view a regular starting stack as a disadvantage as the blinds are higher, would that not mean actually starting at a slight to large disadvantage equity wise?

Fletchdad, I agree with you that obviously the OP is not trying to gain bankroll during this session, he is doing it for educational purposes. Personally I think this is morally right....but at the same time it IS collusion. I was just warning the OP so his BR does not get taken by Full Tilt.

From Full Tilt Policy

"We take cheating very seriously and will suspend the accounts of any player who is found to be sharing hole card information during a hand, “chip dumping” during ring games or tournaments, or engaging in any other form of cheating."

not a big fan of late registration, dont play pokerstars much anymore,since they lengthened the time. just because of the sheer numbers of them.

Just because they played in the same game 3 times in the last 5 days does not make it coluding, if that was colluding all regular CCer's that play the CC buy in games would be colluding.
It all depends on how the ppl that know each other play against each other, I.E. Soft playing, Chip Dumping, and other forms of collusion.

CC buy-in games are private, so I believe the terms are a little bit different in that situation. I have heard multiple stories in which two players enter the same tourny or SNG for friendly competition (no intention of colluding), only to have an e-mail the next week saying their acct has been frozen and funds withdrawn. Calm down Zorba, as I said before I'm not arguing the definition on colluding or any of that. I'm simply warning a fellow CCer of the danger of having his BR frozen.

agree with all of this ^ ... 100%
(only other time I don't like to see late reg. (aside from big overlay MTTs.. which incidentally some of FT's $26donkaments have been lately).. is for Satellites).

As far as thinking it can be advantageous to 'late reg'???? This I find amusing/funny, etc.

lol, I am calm, I never stress, just trying to point out that just because he plays in the same games as his coach that it is not collusion, collusion depends on how you play with the person that you regularly play with.

Also when it comes to collusion it doesn't matter if the games are private or not, I'll give you another example, there is a regular group of us here that do what we call an Invasion (you may have seen a thread or 3) where the regular group all get into the same $2.20 Stars SnG, often we sit at the same table as we dont have any controll of that, if I can knock out one of the others I will, but if I have the chance to knock them out and I don't take it then that is soft playing and against the rules, or if we share info during the game or chip dump or other things so each of us can get deeper into the tourney then that is collusion.

OK possible I did see it wrong (personally I don't think I did) it was too long ago to remember clearly, but as for your above example, you haven't taken into account all the other ppl that are registering late.

This is the way I look at it, when I sat down, at the beginning of the tournament, the average stack was $1500. A latecomer steps in like 40 minutes into the tiurnament, he starts with $1500 and the average chip stack is $1850. Thanks for coming in. Every little bit of advantage helps !
I wonder if I ever make any sense.

I'm with you Boston. I don't like late registration lots of players just register during late registration. You register before the tournament starts, more than likely looking at the payouts, you think the payouts are good at first, then the tournament starts and the payouts start getting worse than what you wanted. Now you wish you didn't register. But, it's too late because the tournament has already started. This is how I feel every time I'm in a tournament that has late registration, people just register after the tournament has started.

I also think it's a little unfair. You have been playing for 5-8 minutes or so and you have lost chips already and let's say you are down to 1200 chips, now new people just come in and start with 1500 while everyone else at the table has already lost/won chips. That doesn't seem too fair to me. I mean, yes, you start with the same amount of chips, but they still get a better chance than you do because they just got to the table while you have been there for the last 5 minutes or so.

I just wish there was no late registration. Its really no use in my opinion. It ruins the game.