What is the lowest stakes anyone should play

I find mysef unable to play in the games that I think i could do good in due to lac kof a BR. I currently have 25 bucks in PokerStars and 40 bucks in Full Tilt Poker. I could put more in but then I start worrying that i will run into you guys.....LOL

I am playing .02/04 and .05/10 three tabling most of the time

What is the lowest stakes anyone should play. Seems people at the micro tables call everything and hit all the time. I guy just took 1.50 off me for having a str that he should have never had from UTG?

I see people playing hands that they clearly should not be playing. At what level does it feel like poker and not Lottery Bingo or Roulette?

Do I need to add more money or do I need to re-evaluate what i do at these micro tables.

micro tables are donk fests. i stay away from there lol

Michael what is the lowest you say I should play considering my BR?

Make them pay for draws, don't pay off when they hit. Push when you're ahead. I don't understand all the complaints I see about the play at microstakes. You should be able to win at a higher rate there than anywhere else. Play whatever level your bankroll dictates, go lower if you're losing, move up when you've won enough.

and the players at lower stakes are very unskilled

So if I have the best hand at the time let's say top pair or pocket pair with three undercards, I should push my stack in with a flush or str draw on the board?

Ive never seriously played anything below 25nl because its just so hard to take it seriously....I go there to blow steam occasionally.

Its not hard to understand why people complain about the micros, LOL its by far the highest variance you are going to encounter at a FR table.

Understand that if you have QQ, and you get 5 callers after a .40 raise, the flop has quite a good chance to absolutely crush you. Now if you are playing say, 25nl and you raise to $2.50 to try to at least isolate the donks, perhaps you will get less callers maybe 1 or 2. Thats the reason why people complain about micro limits.

BTW for 25nl you should have at least $500 IMO

If you can't make money playing the idiots, you are going to get killed playing higher limits.

End of story.

In the past this has not been the case for me in SnGs. Just that I dont have the funds to play $10 SnGs all day long.

I'm not saying push every flop you hit, value bet top pair but don't pay off big when the draw hits. I'm saying get the bulk of the money in ahead. Either push the action and get the money in by the turn (when draws lose equity) or make them payoff when you make hand over hand. Because its deepstacked even some seemingly stupid plays aren't that bad if someone is going to pay them for chasing.

That's the truth.

Maybe this is why I don't understand. I only play 6max so I can isolate.

I totally agree with Monoxide on this one. I tried starting playing at 10nl and was pulling my hair out because it wasn't even making sense what people were doing. Moving to 25nl has taken some of the ridiculousness out of poker but you still get weirdos. 50nl is really where I think things get serious, and you start actually seeing "players making plays against specific opponents" at 100nl with the occasional 50nl superstar.

Thanks for clearing that up. I will keep that in mind next time a draw is out there on the flop and I am ahead.

I sertainly don;t have the roll to play at the limits you guys are talking about for the more serious play so I will have to figure a way to increase my roll and then get there.

I would like to say I agree that playing against the donks should be easier but I have yet to see it come true. They are so unpredictable that even the most skilled player can gt tripped up with the garbage they play.

I would love to rail someone while they play 01/02 or 02/04 to show me what I am doing wrong. If anyone is interested in this please let me know.

The easiest way to win money at the micros is to play ABC poker. Don't bluff, don't slow-play, and don't get cute. And when you have a monster that is difficult to crack, go crazy with the betting. You will almost always get called.

In fact, I would argue that the best place to start is at the micros. You will learn the fundamentals of poker that will bring you a profit in almost any poker game. Then, as you move up in stakes, you can start adding components to your game: bluffing, blind stealing, slow-playing, etc.

The only skill you really need at the micros is betting for value.

[quote]What is the lowest stakes anyone should play?[quote]

The lowest stakes that make them happy.

Some people should only be playing the play money tables. Others are happy losing every night at $100NL because they can afford it and it's worth the entertainment value.

As for beating micros...
In the micros it's pretty much playing ABC poker. A lot of people say "don't bluff" but if you can find a guy who is smart enough to fold go ahead and bluff him. Just make sure you've seen him make a few smart (or scared) laydowns before trying it yourself.

Cant Totally agree with that....because people at lower limits get "luckier" and rarely play with any skill. I've noticed that when i play higher limits you really start to play poker, at the low limits you play more with luck. Its always fun watching someone call re-raises when they only have 4 6 off suit, or 7 9 suited...and then catch runner runner to take the pots.

Do you realize how retarded that sounds?

If you're getting into situations where they have to draw runner runner to beat you, you are going to make buckets of profit in the long run. Hands like this are where all my money comes from at 10$ NL:

Hero:

Pre-flop:

schoobydoo calls. billflo checks. RoBs4x4 calls.
SlappYJacksoN folds. rayaubri folds. Hero raises
to $.60. schoobydoo calls. billflo folds. RoBs4x4
calls.

Flop (board: ):

Hero bets $1.55. schoobydoo calls. RoBs4x4 calls.


Turn (board: ):

Hero goes all-in for $7.85. schoobydoo folds.
RoBs4x4 goes all-in for $6.78. Hero is returned
$1.07 (uncalled).

River (board: ):

(no action in this round)


Showdown:

Hero shows .
Hero has Ac Ks 5c Ad 5s: two pair, aces and fives.
RoBs4x4 shows .
RoBs4x4 has Qc Th 5c Ad 5s: a pair of fives.


Hand #55258873-583 Summary:

$1 is raked from a pot of $20.16.
Hero wins $19.16 with two pair, aces and fives.


This guy is just *giving* me his money chasing his flush! Money doesn't come any easier than that! At higher limits, this profit goes to pretty much nothing. If you can't beat a game where opponents are just giving you the chance to be in a 4:1 favorite position against them, then you have SERIOUS problems with your game.

^ This is all true. If you cant beat the lowest limits then your not going to be able to beat the higher ones.

As to what limits people should play, imo you should play where:

a.) You can make the most profit
b.) You are most comfortable and enjoy the game

And have enough money in your bankroll to play it.

1. If you can't beat the lowest micro limits it's because you're doing something very wrong.

2. If you lack the ability to adapt correctly then yes, it's possible to lose in the micros and win in the higher limits.

3. If #2 applies to you, you're going to be a loser when you move up the larger stakes.

4. The lowest limit you *should* play is the point of diminishing return on your satisfaction. Satisfaction often equals financial return, (see The Irexes Principle), but not usually as most players are money losers so they have to be playing for something else.

.01/.02?

True, but you do need to change your strategy as you move up in limits. For the bare micros like you play, stick to playing only the top 15% of hands and bet big when you got it and keep the pot small when it's marginal (top pair good kicker hands for example). micro guys will stack off very light, so there is not really much room for bluffing in about 95% of cases imo.