Reaction Clonie Gowen's FTP law suit

I'm sure most of you have heard by now that Clonie Gowen is suing Full Tilt Poker for 40 million dollars. I've researched this a little bit and was astounded to see most of the articles/blog posts on the subject are seriously skewed against her. Of course, I don't know the details of whether or not she ever had an agreement with FTP, but the nastiness this seems to have provoked is very, very surprising to me.

That's just one example of some of the stuff that's being posted. Sure, it's okay to defend Full Tilt if you think they're in the right, but is there really any need to get this personal and ugly?

ftp does not want bad publicity and imo they will settle out of court

well i dont know whats gone on with her and FT so ill have nothing to comment on,, But these days theres to many people suing for any reason,like the woman who sued Dunkin donuts cause she spilt coffee on herself and burned her hand or something, and she got payed, thats just another problem we have here in the usa, tons of suits for no good reasons,, what cha gonna do,,lol, buck

She should also sue her parents for naming her Cycalona.

Seriously, though, I'd like to hear more about her side of the story. Hard to judge without really knowing all the facts.

I can't believe that Negreanu tore her a new one like that! I can understand some of the full tilt pros being so pissed off about it because it really concerns them, but when Negreanu goes off, that's just ridiculous. I'm not saying he's wrong, but damn Danny!

Daniel Negreanu + John Juanda (part owner of FTP) = Best buds. When he says there's no way she was offered 1% ownership, I'd tend to believe him. Plus, I don't think he got personal (maybe some posters on some forums did). He said she was "crazy" and "an idiot". Who knows? He could be right. At least he didn't say she was ugly and her breath stinks. He's said worse stuff about Annie Duke.

EDIT: John Juanda is part owner of FTP. Daniel Negreanu is one of his "best buds". Daniel Negreanu IS NOT part owner of FTP. Daniel Negreanu is sponsored by Pokerstars.

I don't doubt Daniel has some inside information. I don't blame him for defending FTP. Calling someone crazy and an idiot might not seem personal to you, but it does to me - just because what he said about Annie Duke was worse, that doesn't make what he's saying about Gowen to be right. I think he could argue the merits of the case and make his point that Glowen has no grounds for this suit without resulting to personal insults and his arguements would come off a little better.

But, I'm not surprised at the way he's approaching this. Quite frankly, I've always thought of him as a little twat (yeah, that was personal :P).

Drama...always fun. Although I didn't know Daniel was part owner of FTP...since he played on PS..but maybe I am just all crazy confused too!

Well yeah. He could of done without the "idiot" part imo.

No, John Juanda is part owner and Daniel is very close to John and even Phil Ivey.

Yea, I'm confused also. I can see Daniels picture on the PS lobby right now haha.

Okay, let's try to clear this up - Daniel is not a member of team Full Tilt and owns no part of Full Tilt. He wasn't named in the law suit.

From what I can tell, he's just spewing off about this because he can.

Daniel Rocks!!!!!! if he said it then it must be true cause poker players never lie!!! [end sarcasm]

Actually I tend to believe him cause a 1% stake in a company is HUGE, why would they offer that to her?

Oh and by the way Daniel does Rock!!!!!!!!! oh yeah!!!!

Well this will be pretty easy. If she has the 1% agreement in writing. She wins.

I guess when the looks go away, out come the lawyers. Vanessa Rousso should take some notes for 20 years from now.

So wrong..... but still funny

From what I hear, the person who broke the news had four posts, all relating to Clonie. So they assume it was her just trying to get the word out so she can get a settlement.

Some Daniel Negreanu quotes about the situation:

Pretty sure it's been stated that she does not have the agreement in writing. When making a deal like that it's kinda important to get the agreement signed. Most people with jobs just don't think in good faith their bosses will pay them do they? Most people sign contracts for their jobs.

who really know's if they offered her the 1% or not. All I know is that she has a nice set even when she isn't playing cards. I dobut she has the contract though because full tilt wouldn't let it go this far if she did.

Funny how none of the other players who are close to those named in the suit are spouting off.

Look, again, I say, people have a right to defend Full Tilt. I personally don't care for inflammatory language like he's using, but it's his total right to use it (not like any of this has anything to do with me either.

I'm just saying, when people are debating or discussing any topic and they start using words like idiot, crazy, or comparing their advesary to a jilted ex-girlfriend, it makes it harder for me to take them or their arguements seriously.

I actually agree. He'd be taken more seriously if he wasn't so "colorful" in what he said.

Well how else would you describe someone who sues claiming they held part ownership in a company and had absolutely no proof? Crazy and idiot seem to be pretty accurate. Either she's a crazy idiot for failing to get it in writing and assuming others would believe her or she's a crazy idiot for making up the story to get publicity and/or money.

To me it seems ridiculous that they would offer her 1% to wear some full tilt stuff and whatever else. Thats a huge chunk of dough.
Its kinda surprising to read Daniel's reaction to. He doesn't seem like the type to rip into someone like that.

All I have to say on the matter is that I don't trust poker players... period. The whole game has a lot of disinformation associated with it. If I were to agree to something this major I would surely get a lawyer to cross the T's and dot the I's.

Hell, I probably wouldn't even make a 50 cent side bet with someone unless I had a 3rd party poker witness. It's not a friendly game and its not a friendly business no matter what anyone says.

I don't know how accurate the part about her not receiving any payments of any kind from the time of her recruitment in 2004 is, but if it is true then why weren't they paying her?
The same applies to the supposed offer of $250,000 from Lederer 1 year ago, if that part is accurate, why would he make such an offer unless something was not right to begin with?

It's to early to tell what went on in 2004 and what, if anything was agreed, but if she was recruited by FTP in the same ( or similar ) way as some of the other pros were, then surely she would have been paid at least once a year for the last 4 years.

Proof of payments by FTP should be very easy for them show if this was the case, but if like claimed she has received no payments, you have to ask yourself the question...................... "Why not"?

I don't see how anybody with any business sense could possibly offer her a 1% stake in Full Tilt? I mean, she's an OK player (Zero WSOP final tables; her best finish being 15/766 in this years $1,000 rebuy. No WPT final tables either.) who has the temporary attribute of being pretty.

Even if she wasn't paid cash, didn't Full Tilt has put millions into her entry fees? But her value is due to her looks/image (depreciating assets) *not* her skill. She's not a good long term investment. Nissan doesn't offer 1% of their company (an appreciating asset) to a showroom model, even if she does know a lot about cars.

Don't forget, this apparent agreement was made in 2004 ( 4 years ago ) when things were really starting to take off.
Moneymaker won the ME in 2003, and Raymer took it down in 2004 and there was an enormous amount of activity going on with the big poker sites as a result of it.

Also, it could be argued FTP had no idea what kind of future results Clonie Gowen would ever post for the next 4 years. They were buying into what they perceived at that point in time and what they hoped for in the future.

There is nothing to say that Tiffany Michelle wont run bad for UB over the course of the next 4 years and have nothing much in the way of big results. As with Clonie and FTP even though it was 4 years ago, UB are buying into Tiffany based on the here and now, what happens further down the road can be very different.

Thats unbelievable..You know..Stuff on the internet gets stirred around lately and there's really no way you can tell whats really going on..I'm going to wait and see how everything turns out..Wow..Offered 1%..that could present some bad publicity..But anyways shes not part of the FT Team anymore..has anybody noticed the rumor about David Benyamine..I have seen this new player MrB2USon on the pro tables and I have reason to believe that is David Benyamine on a new account..He is not in red bold so does that mean hes not a PRO?? Any input would be awesome..GREAT POST Take Care
Ray

That's true. Wasn't Dutch Boyd backed by UB at one point? I seem to remember seeing a UB pokerchip tattoo (or temporary one) on his hand when he beat Hachem for a bracelet.

I would say something like it was an unfortunate situation, I believed the facts would bear out Full Tilt's position, and when the truth came out it would reflect badly on Clonie. But again, that's just me.

Even if you dont agree with what Negreanu said, you have to admit its refreshing to get a real answer to a hard question. Maybe with all the political stuff lately these "tell the people what they want to hear" answers have finally gotten to me. Nice to see someone not afraid to give an opinion and not give the typical "we'll see how it ends up" response. Kudos to Daniel for not being afraid to speak out enen when maybe he shouldnt have. Seems like a real bad move for Gowen here, no matter what she was owed. Pretty stong/respected list of players in the lawsuit filed, and none of them are hurting for $. If Clonies right she desrves something, but if Tilt is right i hope they just dont pay her to go away.

There is no way they offered her 1% of the company and secondly, poker players are pretty damn smart if you ask me, atleast professional ones are(hehe) so why doesn't she have something in writting? If this is a 4 billion dolllar company as she says, then why did she do a deal on a handshake and apromise with them? It just doesn't make sense and it doesn't add up. Daniel Negraneu is right. This chick is crazy, and too bad. It's funny because daniel said she's gone ding bat crazy and that's she's acting like a nutsy ex-girlfriend. Well one of my ex girlfriends looks like clonie and I swear to god, she is ding bat crazy and had that nutsy ex-girlfriend Im not letting go-I'll throw eggs at your car kinda way. Haha it all adds up now.

Whatever. You'll see Clonie sporting a reefer poker hat soon. Hehe.

Gowen's lawsuit may have merit as verbal contracts being binding and all, but the amount she is asking for is rediculous. I think she needs to get real about how much money she would have been paid in endorsements over the years because it probably wouldn't amount to 40 mill. Lawyers and how they have to be paid through the proceeds of a lawsuit make this whole case bad for poker. Both sides should be forced into a binding mediation court!

Eh, the $40mil has nothing to do with endorsements and suchlike - it's based on FTP being valued at $4billion and hence her being owed 1% of that. It's still a laughably high figure imo, but for different reasons.

I agree this is potentially horrible for poker though.

U have to remember that all these pros are new to all this outside money they are getting. So who knows what went down with kid poker and fulltilt.