Can you win a tourney without luck?

diego farfan

diego farfan

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the truth to win a tournament sometimes if you need cotton and you have lost several tournaments with excellent hands, but that does not have to do that you always depend on luck this game is a combination of strategy and luck in some occasions
 
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bigpappa325

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Thank you all for the responses. My point was to point out that luck is just as important as skill. You can be skilled enough it looks like your just cheating in cards and still lose all your chips. Its important people realize that. I have had three occasions that i have got a beat recently and the player say i see you. With my name being can-you-see-me I'm assuming its a shot. Even a blind squirrel finds a nut. Good day
 
zinzir

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I thought we were keeping it civilized. If you took it otherwise i must of misspoken.

I have had a few accounts that have been banned due to little experiments on the tables. I have a thread on that. I opened ACR account in my name so i could play in the free rolls. Tammy said i couldn't use accounts in other peoples name. So can-you-see-me is to new to register on sharkescope. I get unlimited searches there so no worries.

Im an old coon, complain here because really no other place too. A lot of others do too. Advice given usually warrants success. i mean would you listen to me or the WPT champion. Only success i have ever mention is my live play. I started online a few years ago. Had a backer (friend) who wanted me to try online. For convenience and possible ending the 45 minute trip to the card house sounded good. It wasn't going to cost me anything so why not. after 6 months the honeymoon stage was gone and online wasn't proving to be as profitable as it should. I started questioning things and me and the friend went separate ways. Never mix friendship with business.


I perfectly understand what you're saying, and couldn't agree more. I have already told you that I have nothing but respect for you as a person. I only contradicted some specific statements you made, all being variations of the same idea, that online poker is not random. I don't agree with that particular idea, that's all, in your opinion does that make me a bad person? Because what bothered me a little was that you responded by throwing barbs at me at a personal level, something I felt I didn't deserve. Yes, in this thread I made a reference to the glitch we talked about the previous day, but that was intended to be a friendly banter, not trolling. I hope we can continue to interact with each other in an amicable way and agree to disagree from time to time. I read your threads and posts with pleasure, and with your permission I will continue to respond if I have something to say, but I can't promise to agree every single time. And I expect nothing less from you, please feel free to contradict me every time you think otherwise, I promise to never be bothered by it. Good luck at everything you do, as in my opinion luck is of vital importance not only in poker tournaments, but in every single aspect of life :)
 
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bigpappa325

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I perfectly understand what you're saying, and couldn't agree more. I have already told you that I have nothing but respect for you as a person. I only contradicted some specific statements you made, all being variations of the same idea, that online poker is not random. I don't agree with that particular idea, that's all, in your opinion does that make me a bad person? Because what bothered me a little was that you responded by throwing barbs at me at a personal level, something I felt I didn't deserve. Yes, in this thread I made a reference to the glitch we talked about the previous day, but that was intended to be a friendly banter, not trolling. I hope we can continue to interact with each other in an amicable way and agree to disagree from time to time. I read your threads and posts with pleasure, and with your permission I will continue to respond if I have something to say, but I can't promise to agree every single time. And I expect nothing less from you, please feel free to contradict me every time you think otherwise, I promise to never be bothered by it. Good luck at everything you do, as in my opinion luck is of vital importance not only in poker tournaments, but in every single aspect of life :)
we are good. i have no objections. Tonight i start cc free roll 45 minutes late. i got a,k one time and never got a pair higher than 77. Finished 21 in the change department. that's playing poker, few small pair i folded would of hit but lost to higher sets. I really dont know how i got so far with dead cards.
 
zinzir

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we are good. i have no objections. Tonight i start cc free roll 45 minutes late. i got a,k one time and never got a pair higher than 77. Finished 21 in the change department. that's playing poker, few small pair i folded would of hit but lost to higher sets. I really dont know how i got so far with dead cards.


Congratulations is in order! I read CC club freerolls are competitive and the players good. I hope to be able to play them in the near future since I have already submitted my application to the freeroll club :)
 
edenman1

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I would say luck plays a huge role.. But you have to have the skills too
 
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bigpappa325

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Congratulations is in order! I read CC club freerolls are competitive and the players good. I hope to be able to play them in the near future since I have already submitted my application to the freeroll club :)
At first i was skeptical because they are free rolls. Actually having a good time. They are starting to chat. Enjoy it all around. you will too
 
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tomk7788

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Bad players play for luck, skillful players play against luck. That being said you need to win coin flips to win tournaments so yes even skillful players need luck to win tournaments.
 
delirium1129

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Sure you can't win tourney without luck. If you'll get 5 preflop all-ins with your AA you need big luck to stay alive) But your skill rly improve chances to get luck. Just try to determine the coefficient of your advantage over the field and divide the count of players by it to get the chance to win the tourney.
 
DizzyDeb717

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The simple answer is NO.
Every time the cards you need show up on the board, that is luck. You can increase your odds with your play, but it's still gambling, and all gambling is based on luck (combined with educated calculations)
You can steal pots all day, but I doubt many mtts have been won with bluffs alone.
 
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Heresthecooler

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In Hold 'Em, no, you cannot win a tournament without luck. Just think about the dozen races you have to win, just to make a final table. If you lose just one race, your tournament could be over.
 
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cheeeer

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Once I finished 1 out of 10000. But it was pure luck. My biggest cash so far. I didn't care much when I played it. Actually I didn't want to play it.
But when I tried to do my best I didn't finish higher than 100-150 place.

So I think that is key. I remember the other guy who didn't want to play some tourny, still he was a chip leader.
 
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canfoldaces

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I think you needed luck to win a tourney. It's not true that all you need is skills lol
 
JJP

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Yes and no, there is the famous story of Annette_15 winning a pokerstars tournament with her cards covered. Obv versus more skilled of competition you will need to get lucky in a few a spots here or there to finish in 1st place. I always like the quote, "you will have to give a bad beat and survive taking a bad beat in order to win an MTT"
 
kleopatra123

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Luck is a big part of poker. Without luck in risk there is no victory !
 
ChipWinged

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If you talk about one defined tourney answer is No. If it was Yes it would be great.
Luck is measurement of your bad beat's frequency. So I have tourney when I played without bad beats. But also I know three times in a row tourney when I pushed and lost because there was bad beat.

Long story short: you need luck for winning all-ins.
But I ask other question: can you win one tourney without luck? And answer is YES. If you played big count tournaments and you was never ITM - it's not luck, it's your skill. I say about distance. You could be the king of loosers but even random numbers generator can't damage you within for example 1000 tournaments.
So when you are playing more you are decreasing meaning of luck in your game.
So play, learn, grow, win!
And also good luck! :D
 
david1bear

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I also get caught up with crap like that :O) I feel like I play pretty conservative and smart and then get hit with a lot of bull. So I do also feel your frustration. As of luck and skill I believe you need more of luck to come your way then skill. Good luck out there and keep Grinding
 
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parekoy88

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as the saying goes.... "it's better to be lucky than good"
 
Dewmz

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imo luck is definitely required, without knowing what's gonna land on the board you can't really predict when to bet, or raise. Too many variables come in to play to win purely based on skill.
 
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fundiver199

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Of course you need to be very lucky to win or even run deep in a big poker tournament. When Cris Moneymaker won the wsop main event after qualifying online, he was certainly not the best player in the field.

And if you review an online tournament, you actually won, you will almost certainly find a lot of spots, where you got lucky. Your hand held, even it was only a 70/30 or a 60/40. You won the coinflips. You coolered someone. Your draws completed.

You even got it in bad and won. Like you jammed A5s on BTN with 11BB, someone in the blinds called with AJ, and you spiked a 5 to dubble up. These things happen. Its not only your opponents, who get lucky. And nearly always, the times you win a tournament, is when you got more lucky than them.
 
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Pwohar43

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I might say something that sounds mean but it not intended to be. So be nice on responding.

I only been playing the ACR free rolls since they returned. This weekend was the most played free rolls other than the daily ones. I'm finding it difficult finishing. I have the one winner take all and a few in the money but not really happy with the outcomes.

These bigger prize tourneys i really just focused on the tables and nothing else. No multi tasking nothing. I find after about 15 minutes i have most of you pegged at the table. Your ranges and pretty much your betting habits. A few of you know because I'm the thorn in your butt after about 15 minutes. I chip away and seem to get moved to another table after a nice hand is won. Then i start all over again unless i have notes from past games.

This might be one of my problems. I find most the play on these free rolls very soft. I seem to chip up nicely then make a great call almost perfect in your range usually post flop. Only to get rivered ever so often. And the sets, I missed every mining of them today but one. That ended up being second best of a three way of sets. Flop landed set for three and my kings. Pocket aces pushed and of coarse we all followed only to have a ace hit the river. That's not bad luck that's insane. And it usually comes in threes. Then I'm 10 bb or less and in push or fold mode only to get beat by the dumbest hands. Like my a,k suited went all in and always one player who calls and has like today q,5 off. Hits his five on the river. Happens all the time. Are they lucky or am i unlucky?

The point of this was how can you play on point and not say that luck isn't more important than skill in a tourney. Long run skill may out last but sure seems to kicking my butt. it be different if i was out played or made a bad decision and it cost me. This is flat out thank god somehow i won stuff that seems a bit habitual. No this isn't a bad beat rant. Can you win a tourney without luck prevailing? Am i truly a unluc
If everything u say is true, you are to advanced to play free rolls. Try moving up where players are less likely to go Alln with Q5 off suit
 
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cheeeer

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Yes and no, there is the famous story of Annette_15 winning a pokerstars tournament with her cards covered.
Though she said she watched some hands when it was heads up (because you can't win heads up without watching all hands, there are some all-ins) and started to do it when 3-4 players left in the tourney.
And she tried to do it 3-4 times when she finally did it.

So it looks you need some luck. Though skills are important.
 
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kleopatra123

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You needed luck to win a tourney ! Without luck in risk there is no victory !
 
LJG23

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The short answer to your question is no and without reading any of the responses you have received already I'm sure its one you have heard before, but in my attempt to be more involved with this site I will stat my case anyway.

First off they are freerolls most people there are poor players or extreme micro grinders and other than flopping huge over and over (which happens) you are going to have to win flips deep in tournaments and even find yourself in spots with inferior players that just get lucky against your good play, that is the bad news....

The good news is this is basically the case in every tournament with large player pools. The blinds will catch up to most of the fields stacks and you will find yourself in 50/50 spots and someones gotta lose, sometimes its gonna be you. The difference with freerolls is your fold equity (meaning someone folding to your raise or shove) is way lower. You are going to find someone to play with you way more often which means your going to lose more often.

Freerolls are brutal and other than CC freerolls (or playing for ACR FR leaderboard) I would suggest getting out of them as soon as possible. Simply playing for .50c will increase your fold equity in those spots and you will see a difference as long as your are playing solid poker. Little wordy hold it helps.

I might say something that sounds mean but it not intended to be. So be nice on responding.

I only been playing the ACR free rolls since they returned. This weekend was the most played free rolls other than the daily ones. I'm finding it difficult finishing. I have the one winner take all and a few in the money but not really happy with the outcomes.

These bigger prize tourneys i really just focused on the tables and nothing else. No multi tasking nothing. I find after about 15 minutes i have most of you pegged at the table. Your ranges and pretty much your betting habits. A few of you know because I'm the thorn in your butt after about 15 minutes. I chip away and seem to get moved to another table after a nice hand is won. Then i start all over again unless i have notes from past games.

This might be one of my problems. I find most the play on these free rolls very soft. I seem to chip up nicely then make a great call almost perfect in your range usually post flop. Only to get rivered ever so often. And the sets, I missed every mining of them today but one. That ended up being second best of a three way of sets. Flop landed set for three and my kings. Pocket aces pushed and of coarse we all followed only to have a ace hit the river. That's not bad luck that's insane. And it usually comes in threes. Then I'm 10 bb or less and in push or fold mode only to get beat by the dumbest hands. Like my a,k suited went all in and always one player who calls and has like today q,5 off. Hits his five on the river. Happens all the time. Are they lucky or am i unlucky?

The point of this was how can you play on point and not say that luck isn't more important than skill in a tourney. Long run skill may out last but sure seems to kicking my butt. it be different if i was out played or made a bad decision and it cost me. This is flat out thank god somehow i won stuff that seems a bit habitual. No this isn't a bad beat rant. Can you win a tourney without luck prevailing? Am i truly a unluc
 
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DAVID KEHRER

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With skill comes some luck you need both to win.
 
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