Trouble hands

JAMILE1

JAMILE1

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These are the kind of hands that always get me in trouble. Villain here is a shoverer ;) after going down in chips early he started pushing every hand he entered after that, he never really showed down any hands other than his loss. Do I make this call? its actually like I dread this hand but I'm trying to get outta the playin scared because of past history with certain hands syndrome, I posted 2 HH just to see what everyone thinks or as DM would say easy fold?s. I do some crazy shiet with these hands. also what range of hands do I need to make a call like this? is it simply AA, KK, maybe QQ?



pokerstars Game #10200353187: Tournament #51696353, $3.00+$0.40 Hold'em No Limit - Level IV (50/100) - 2007/05/31 - 14:44:51 (ET)
Table '51696353 1' 10-max Seat #9 is the button
Seat 1: mrbungra (1570 in chips)
Seat 2: garrett360 (1145 in chips)
Seat 4: Indycore (1865 in chips)
Seat 6: prodigy666 (880 in chips)
Seat 7: ManiacMack (2500 in chips)
Seat 8: DoppeleB's (1905 in chips)
Seat 9: Flying_one (665 in chips)
Seat 10: kala5583 (4470 in chips)
kala5583: posts small blind 50
mrbungra: posts big blind 100
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to kala5583 [Tc Th]
garrett360: folds
Indycore: raises 1765 to 1865 and is all-in
prodigy666: folds
ManiacMack: folds
DoppeleB's: folds
Flying_one: folds
kala5583: ?

Hand #2

PokerStars Game #10200383873: Tournament #51696353, $3.00+$0.40 Hold'em No Limit - Level IV (50/100) - 2007/05/31 - 14:46:58 (ET)
Table '51696353 1' 10-max Seat #2 is the button
Seat 1: mrbungra (1420 in chips)
Seat 2: garrett360 (1445 in chips)
Seat 4: Indycore (1915 in chips)
Seat 6: prodigy666 (480 in chips)
Seat 7: ManiacMack (2500 in chips)
Seat 8: DoppeleB's (1575 in chips)
Seat 9: Flying_one (1245 in chips)
Seat 10: kala5583 (4420 in chips)
Indycore: posts small blind 50
prodigy666: posts big blind 100
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to kala5583 [8s 8d]
ManiacMack: calls 100
DoppeleB's: folds
Flying_one: folds
kala5583: calls 100
mrbungra: folds
garrett360: folds
Indycore: raises 1815 to 1915 and is all-in
prodigy666: folds
ManiacMack: folds
kala5583: ?
 
stormswa

stormswa

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hey

I need to go to doctor and see my baby inside wife belly so I will get to this when i get back.
 
joosebuck

joosebuck

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you need reads to call open shoves that are 20bb.
 
F

Freakakanus

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Fold/Fold.......
I'm not usually one to give advice but you are risking 1/2 your stack with way marginal hands. I know... I know you are saying.."Freak, you call this shit all the time!" and I say "exactly! that's why I suck!"
 
alexanderwoo1

alexanderwoo1

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I would fold on both of those hands. Also the trouble hands are usually the 7's to the J's.
 
NineLions

NineLions

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If he's already shoving every hand after going down, then he's probably gone on manic tilt and doesn't care if he gets taken out. Someone, not necessarily you, needs to pick a spot to get rid of him.

TT, twice his stack, in the blinds so no-one else is likely to get involved, is not a bad spot, I think. No matter what he's shoving with he might still get lucky and take it. I might shove that one, and join Freak on the sidelines. :)


It depends though on how frequently his shoves are. If they're 2 -3 times an orbit, I'd go. If it's only 1-2 times every 2 orbits, he might just be tired of his post flop play in which case I fold both.
 
Last edited:
Ronaldadio

Ronaldadio

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2nd hand a defi fold.

What I don`t know is how many are in the tourny, how many left, etc. but, if about 1/2 way through and u r top 1/2 I would call with 1010. I always feel u need to get lucky to win a tourny, so if he has 2 overs and u hold up there is your luck :D

As one of the other guys said, it would also depend on how ofter he is pushing all in. I might have a tendancy to let someone else do battle with him, but if he is pushing almost every hand I might even call with 88.

Nice post and I think its an area a lot of us struggle with. The way I get around this is to have a strategy for the tourny before I start. That strategy changes from tourny to tourny, but I will have already decided if I`m going to push with a LAG player or not.

Hope this makes sense :confused:
 
Four Dogs

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Given your healthy stack I would fold both pairs in the order they came. Your probably ahead in both cases, but either hand could be a coin flip, the 8's almost certainly are. Why give an inferior opponent an even chance? If he continues the all-in parade, you can safely put his range on any pair, any Ax and maybe worse, in which case calling with TT or better would be fine but for the moment you must give him credit for an equal shot at the pot. If he should drop below 1/4 your stack, or there's sufficient dead money as overlay, I'd call with any pair, KQs and AT or better.
 
stormswa

stormswa

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welp

no need to reply now everything has been said.
 
secretpanfish

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Villain here is a shoverer ;) after going down in chips early he started pushing every hand he entered after that

When you had 10s, if his all in was for the 3rd+ (or maybe even 2nd) consecutive time I would say call. If you beat him then everyone can go back to playing... if you lose you'll have chips left and with patience and skill you can get back into the game.

Fold the snowmen.
 
skoldpadda

skoldpadda

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PokerStars Game #10200353187: Tournament #51696353, $3.00+$0.40 Hold'em No Limit - Level IV (50/100) - 2007/05/31 - 14:44:51 (ET)
Table '51696353 1' 10-max Seat #9 is the button
Seat 1: mrbungra (1570 in chips)
Seat 2: garrett360 (1145 in chips)
Seat 4: Indycore (1865 in chips)
Seat 6: prodigy666 (880 in chips)
Seat 7: ManiacMack (2500 in chips)
Seat 8: DoppeleB's (1905 in chips)
Seat 9: Flying_one (665 in chips)
Seat 10: kala5583 (4470 in chips)
kala5583: posts small blind 50
mrbungra: posts big blind 100
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to kala5583 [Tc Th]
garrett360: folds
Indycore: raises 1765 to 1865 and is all-in



Hand #2

PokerStars Game #10200383873: Tournament #51696353, $3.00+$0.40 Hold'em No Limit - Level IV (50/100) - 2007/05/31 - 14:46:58 (ET)
Table '51696353 1' 10-max Seat #2 is the button
Seat 1: mrbungra (1420 in chips)
Seat 2: garrett360 (1445 in chips)
Seat 4: Indycore (1915 in chips)
Seat 6: prodigy666 (480 in chips)
Seat 7: ManiacMack (2500 in chips)
Seat 8: DoppeleB's (1575 in chips)
Seat 9: Flying_one (1245 in chips)
Seat 10: kala5583 (4420 in chips)
Indycore: posts small blind 50
prodigy666: posts big blind 100
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to kala5583 [8s 8d]
ManiacMack: calls 100
DoppeleB's: folds
Flying_one: folds
kala5583: calls 100
mrbungra: folds
garrett360: folds
Indycore: raises 1815 to 1915 and is all-in
prodigy666: folds
ManiacMack: folds
kala5583: ?



Same answer for both. It's early, you have tons of chips. FOLD.
 
robwhufc

robwhufc

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I'd call the 1st one if it's the 3rd or more consecutive time he's gone all-in. Most likely he's only got one overcard, he could have no overcards. Folding seems a bit cowardly.

2nd one, why call initially if you're not going to call his all-in, when you know he's going to go all-in? I'd have raised initial limper and see what psycho would have done (and called if he insisted going all-in again, but it's a moot point - hand wouldn't have happened if i'd called 1st one).
 
robwhufc

robwhufc

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Same answer for both. It's early, you have tons of chips. FOLD.
Stretching same logic a bit further, you'd fold AA because you have a ton of chips? Ton of chips means you can risk some to get more. You sit on your 4k chips, the other players start taking each other out, and you're in the final 3 with equal stacks.
 
robwhufc

robwhufc

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Actually, Hand 2 - if he's gone all-in 5-6 times straight, and someone calls, then you've got to put caller on a big hand and fold. But the first one, easy call.
 
shinedown.45

shinedown.45

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IMO, If I was in same position, I would consider how long the other players at the table took to fold, see if they were considering calling this maniac, and if 1/4-1/2 the players took some time to consider thier fold, I would have to say that they must have had hands to warrant a call but opted to fold.
With this info, its safe to say that 1-2 aces are gone along with maybe a king and /or queen and if he had 2 overs in the first HH, then I would assume, based on what I observed at the table from the other players actions, I would call, but if the other players made quick folds, then I would fold the 1010, as for the second with 88, the same applys but with a little more hesitation to calling.
Then again, this is my style of play, and in MTTs I occasionally like to gambool with hands and situations like this.
 
stormswa

stormswa

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bottom line

you really don't want to be calling off all your chips, you want to be the one pushing. You always want to be making your opponents make the hard decisions not the other way around. You are fine right now no reason to call off all your chips on what might be a coin flip at best.
 
robwhufc

robwhufc

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You are fine right now no reason to call off all your chips on what might be a coin flip at best.
If someone's pushing every hand (see OP) then 10 10 is coin flip at WORST. I haven't got a xx v random hand calculator, but 10 10 has got to be a big favourite - with only 2 people to act behind me this is a total no-brainer call for me.
 
stormswa

stormswa

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If someone's pushing every hand (see OP) then 10 10 is coin flip at WORST. I haven't got a xx v random hand calculator, but 10 10 has got to be a big favourite - with only 2 people to act behind me this is a total no-brainer call for me.

I dont like flipping this early in a tourney personally, but I cant say I hate the call either.
 
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