thought he was holding a good hand so i pushed and bamo lol

stormswa

stormswa

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i'm up fora little heads up session on pokerstars if u want say- 5 * 5.50- just to check the winning tactics.
And also the numbers u are running presume he has a good hand- many times we are ahead of villians range here- and i feel i am good enough to laydown A4 on a AK4 board- maybe not a AQ4 board tho- would take a very good read on thatp but an AK4 board i could easily do it


stars just added .25/.50 heads up tables?

no the numbers I ran a general odds of you flopping a flush and has nothing to do with his hand, really did you even look at them LOL.


I dont play HU STT, the rake is dumb.


you have to wait till this tourney is over though about to burst bubble in it.


the call he made is not horrible preflop but it by no means is a automatic call as you suggest.


the biggest problem I have with your posts is you are calling to as you put it "flop the nuts", and im saying it is very very unlikely to flop a real strong hand with As4s
 
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Shandy

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are u hidden on stars- look us up whe u r ready i dont mind playin a little 25/50
 
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Shandy

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sorry missed last part of post- no i am not playing to just flop nuts- but am just saying that it is quite easy to see when you have- so gives you a lot of confidence to get your chips.
 
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stormswa

stormswa

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are u hidden on stars- look us up whe u r ready i dont mind playin a little 25/50


k maybe not tonight this tourney will take awhile and I have to be up at 11am.

sorry missed last part of post- no i am playing to flopnuts- but am just saying that it is quite easy to see when you have- so gives you a lot of confidence to get your chips.


well duh yea if 3 spades come out I think its pretty obvious you have the nuts but the thing is that wont happen as much as you suggest.
 
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Shandy

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cool cool- yeah would like to have a game at some point- i do respect your points of view and from what i have seen on these boards i class you as a good player. And i hope that you dont think that i am one of these players who will play ATSC from any position- the only reason i am keen on the call here is the fact that u are closing the action and that- if u hit the flop hard then you can easily bust some big hands
 
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joeeagles

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A hand like Axs can quite easily flop the nuts, or a strong draw to the nuts.


I don't know where you get that from. In general, with a hand like A4s its much easier to lose your stack rather than getting someone else's.

With 2 suited cards you'll flop 4 to a flush 11% of the time. You'll then go on to actually complete the flush 1 time out of 3. Odds of flopping the flush are 118/1. All this hardly qualifies as a hand that "quite easily" will flop the nuts or have a strong draw to it.

That said, being that table is 5-handed I don't totally disagree with the PF call, that's not the reason I asked the question in my first post. I was just curious to hear opinions on it, as you can see if you read back I never said the call was terrible. A4s is a trouble hand that has some potential, but there is also much more that goes into the decision of calling or not. You may feel that you can outplay him on the flop, or villain has been raising a lot, or he was caught doing it with marginal hands etc etc. I don't think 1 can put a general rule when to call raises or reraise them, its kind of situational.

However what I disagree with is to call because with that hand you can easily flop the nuts or a strong draw to it. That's not true. If that's the only reason you're calling then you're better off to fold or reraise or shove, since the truth is you have a weak and easily dominated hand and you're also OOP.

I agree with your thoughts on that flop. If you're going to flop 2 pair HU and with those stacks, there is no getting away with it. You'll get your chips in 100% of times. That's bad luck and just about impossible to escape from it.
 
mrsnake3695

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One thing Shady also doesn't consider (not to pick on Shady here), is that even if you flop the nuts with A-4 suited it will be hard to get payed off. If villan doesn't have a very strong hand also after the flop such as a set or King high flush you may not win any more chips at all. This makes the math even worse for this situation.

The two biggest holes in peoples games that i see constantly are always playing ace-x and always playing 2 suited cards. These are both long term losing plays although we tend to remember the few times they pay off.

As for hitting something other than the "nuts", you can still easily get stacked if you hit 2 pair with your ace-4. For one there will most likely be overcards to your 4 and if the board pairs your kicker is useless.

I agree with others who have said something like, if the player is aggressive and you think he's on a steal reraise. If he's tight and you think he has a legitamite hand fold and wait for a better spot.

Remember you will be out of position the rest of the hand. The more mediocre the hand you aree playing the more important position becomes.
 
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