STT, bubble, AT in BB, short stack shoves, big stack calls, ?

NineLions

NineLions

Advanced beginner
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Sep 20, 2006
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Ooops, that should read "short stack raises" rather than "shoves" in the title



Game # 695101476 - Texas Hold'em No Limit 150/300 - Table "€1+0.10 Turbo Sit & Go 3422354 1"

Players(max 10):
anagonda (7,395.00 in seat 1)
NineLions (2,375.00 in seat 3)
Sake69 (4,190.00 in seat 4)
ramsig (1,040.00 in seat 7)

Dealer: ramsig
Small Blind: anagonda (150.00)
Big Blind: NineLions (300.00)

ninelions was dealt: Ac - Ts

Sake69 Fold
ramsig Raise (700.00)
anagonda Call (550.00)
NineLions ????


Not much in the way of reads (PT doesn't work here, and I don't start paying attention until the blinds reach 100, arrogant lazy bugger that I am).


Short stack raises rather than shoving. At a better game, this could be scarier than a shove, indicating he has a monster and wants some action. At this level though, he could be afraid and will fold to a dangerous flop in spite of the pot odds, especially on the bubble. I've seen people do so with less.

Big stack calls rather than raising. This could be inviting me in to help take out the short stack, afraid of me shoving, or just a marginal hand and he's willing to see the flop and hasn't thought ahead to my action possibilities.

The short stack is risking most of his stack, we're on the bubble, I've got a decent hand (that I would have shoved if it was limped to me).

Call, to help take out the short stack? Fold, in case the short stack gets taken out and we get ITM? Shove and get the short stack in?
 
Melkor

Melkor

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As inviting as the pot odds are, calling represents such a proportion of our stack is wrong, and to me, a shove is getting little fold equity off the big stack mainly for the pot odds offered when the short stack calls (more than 2:1 I think). Plus, the big stack seems to be inviting you into the hand if you ask me, but he may be unaware of what he is doing.

Both plays are just damn bizzare. That makes me think short stack is weak and big stack strong but I wouldn't put money on it. I would fold this marginal hand.

A couple of other things, if the short stack doesn't have much, the big stack will put him out, but the big stack could make something and put you out now if you get invovled, which is needless. If the short stack has something, or makes a big hand, you will be giving him more chips by shoving, tripling him up. Folding keeps you alive (even if the short stack wins, you are only just shorter after this hand) and could very well get you ITM. As much as it is a $1, I play all SnGs the same and I would be playing tight to avoid bubbling.

Basically, avoid getting into a three way pot on the bubble with the big stack and with a marginal hand. Fold, imo.
 
Four Dogs

Four Dogs

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Agreed. You are a little less than avg stacked, but looks as though you still have some time. AT is definately a open raise hand, but an easy laydown here nomatter who you're up against. Fold. Besides, I'm always happy to see the short stack go up against the big stack. Under these conditions I'd even fold AQ.
 
ChuckTs

ChuckTs

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Readless I probably fold this for reasons mentioned (no FE, probably not that far ahead, possibly very dominated).

By folding we are leaving ourselves very short, though.
 
NineLions

NineLions

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Sep 20, 2006
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Thanks guys.

Agree with folding here. I'm more than happy to open shove here, but with the shortest stack seemingly willing to lay it on the line and the big stack willing to go and we're on the bubble, I'm hoping the big stack flops something that will take the shorty out.


Of course, the flop came KQJ which would have given me the straight. Short stack was inviting action; he had KK, big stack was hoping; he had J3s and called the flop shove.

And I bubbled a few hands later. C'est la vie.
 
J

Jon BrokeOff

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Dec 3, 2007
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no matter, the lucky/unlucky end result a fold is definetly the right move there

hey you were up against KK, Good Lay Down.
 
beechleaf

beechleaf

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Sep 29, 2007
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the short stack was going too try and double with a good hand big stack only wanted too see the flop because he could and call is in order too see the flop but thats just me
 
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