Stars Omaha h/l pl mtt $5 buy in

[Ronaldadio]

Hi all.

Early stages of tourny.

Would you agree with my play here?

I was thinking that the guy acting after me was chasing low, but the second caller was putting me off.

I was guessing one chasing low and the other had hit straight?

Did I have a choice but to do what I did???

Thanks

PokerStars Game #18857607582: Tournament #95822141, $5.00+$0.50 Omaha Hi/Lo Pot Limit - Level I (10/20) - 2008/07/16 - 05:37:18 (ET) Table '95822141 2' 9-max Seat #6 is the button Seat 1: ambernat (3050 in chips) Seat 2: ronaldadio (1510 in chips) Seat 3: 2fat4mystack (2870 in chips) Seat 6: ttouch77 (1410 in chips) Seat 7: ErnieNorman (1600 in chips) Seat 8: Camel56 (1500 in chips) is sitting out Seat 9: kidlat88 (3030 in chips)
ErnieNorman: posts small blind 10
Camel56: posts big blind 20
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to ronaldadio [Qs 8c 6s Qh]
lexveg is connected
kidlat88: folds
ambernat: calls 20
ronaldadio: calls 20
2fat4mystack: calls 20
ttouch77: folds
ErnieNorman: calls 10
Camel56: folds
*** FLOP *** [Qd 2d Ac]
ErnieNorman: checks
ambernat: checks
ronaldadio: bets 100
2fat4mystack: calls 100
ErnieNorman: folds
ambernat: calls 100
*** TURN *** [Qd 2d Ac] [Tc]
ambernat: checks
ronaldadio: bets 200
2fat4mystack: calls 200
ambernat: calls 200
*** RIVER *** [Qd 2d Ac Tc] [4d]
ambernat: checks
ronaldadio: checks
Camel56 is connected
Camel56 has returned
2fat4mystack: bets 380
ambernat: calls 380
ronaldadio said, "Well, I can`t call with my flopped set Q`s"
On the FLop is connected
ronaldadio: folds
*** SHOW DOWN ***
2fat4mystack: shows [8s 6c 3c 7s] (HI: high card Ace; LO: 6,4,3,2,A)
ambernat: shows [5h 9h 4h 7c] (HI: a pair of Fours; LO: 7,5,4,2,A) ambernat collected 880 from pot 2fat4mystack collected 880 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 1760 | Rake 0
Board [Qd 2d Ac Tc 4d]
Seat 1: ambernat showed [5h 9h 4h 7c] and won (880) with HI: a pair of Fours; LO: 7,5,4,2,A Seat 2: ronaldadio folded on the River Seat 3: 2fat4mystack showed [8s 6c 3c 7s] and won (880) with HI: high card Ace; LO: 6,4,3,2,A Seat 6: ttouch77 (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet) Seat 7: ErnieNorman (small blind) folded on the Flop Seat 8: Camel56 (big blind) folded before Flop Seat 9: kidlat88 folded before Flop (didn't bet)

 

[robwhufc]

Fold preflop.

Simple.

 

[Ronaldadio]

Fold preflop. Simple.

I was expecting this

However, from time to time I will change my game.

So, accepting I called and hit on the flop, what from there?

 

[robwhufc]

However, from time to time I will change my game.

And play bad uncoordinated hands with no low potential, from mid position? Why?

 

[switch0723]

meh, i don't see anything wrong with the preflop limp. With blinds only at 10/20, i see it perfectly reasonable to play pock queens for set value. I then play the hand exactly the same, but probably bet/fold the river, since i think we can still get a ton of value from 2 pair, lower sets etc for the high hand

 

[robwhufc]

meh, i don't see anything wrong with the preflop limp. With blinds only at 10/20, i see it perfectly reasonable to play pock queens for set value

This isn't hold em, it's Omaha Hi Lo. A set isn't enough, most hands go to straights, flushes and full houses. And if there are 3 lows on board. you're usually only gunning for half. No brainer fold.

Surprising what opponents (especially 2fat) called you post flop with, but this just goes to show you simply don't need to get fancy in O/8. Play good hands only, play them hard when you hit, and people will call you all day long.

 

[Ronaldadio]

Interesting responses from both of u, Rob & switch.

The main reason for the call was the size of the blinds in comparison to stack.

If u check it out, a pair of 4s took down the high side of the pot.

 

[switch0723]

This isn't hold em, it's Omaha Hi Lo. A set isn't enough, most hands go to straights, flushes and full houses. And if there are 3 lows on board. you're usually only gunning for half. No brainer fold.

you are aware that a set can turn into a full house right??

By limping with pock queens, we hit our set. 3 handed, there is a decent chance that top set will be best hand on the river, but if not, we also have full house outs, that will give us a ton of action vs lesser full houses. We have a big chance of scooping if the board pairs on the river, and one of the villains has 2 pair or a lesser set that also turns into a full house. Im willing to risk 20 chips for a chance of winning 1.5k to my stack.

When blinds are bigger im folding this preflop, but im calling for 1/75th of my stack here and playing from flop

 

[Ronaldadio]

you are aware that a set can turn into a full house right??

By limping with pock queens, we hit our set. 3 handed, there is a decent chance that top set will be best hand on the river, but if not, we also have full house outs, that will give us a ton of action vs lesser full houses. We have a big chance of scooping if the board pairs on the river, and one of the villains has 2 pair or a lesser set that also turns into a full house. Im willing to risk 20 chips for a chance of winning 1.5k to my stack.

When blinds are bigger im folding this preflop, but im calling for 1/75th of my stack here and playing from flop

Well put

 

[viking999]

I agree that this should be a preflop fold. Queens full is still going to be very rare, and you have to pull off queens full with no qualifying low to get a decent win. And because of your position, you could get raised off the hand for a total waste (I do hope you weren't intending to call a substantial preflop raise).

I also dislike the turn bet. It's incredibly weak given that only two hands beat you, there are many draws, and there's only one card left so the draws are less likely to hit. Then you were put in the weird situation of having two callers of a small bet. They could have very weak draws, but the bet was so small they couldn't refuse.

I don't blame you for folding the river. I don't think your hand figures to beat a bet and a call on the river for half the pot often enough.

 

[switch0723]

and you have to pull off queens full with no qualifying low to get a decent win

If you have queens full, the chances are that there wont be a qualifying low on the board. More likely that queens full scoops rather than splits

 

[c9h13no3]

Fold qwains preflop. 1-way hand.

As played, pot every street until low hits the board.

 

[switch0723]

ok, on the basis of what everyone else has said in this thread, i think i need to evaluate my omaha h/l game, since im obviously playing wrong. Scrap my advice op

quick question, would you guys limp or fold with op's hand in omaha hi?

 

[c9h13no3]

quick question, would you guys limp or fold with op's hand in omaha hi?

In a loose/limpy game, I wouldn't mind a limp all that much, since we do have the ability to make top set. But I'd feel better if that 6 was a J, 9, or T.

 

[Ronaldadio]

In a loose/limpy game, I wouldn't mind a limp all that much, since we do have the ability to make top set. But I'd feel better if that 6 was a J, 9, or T.

Everyone was limping, so that is the reason. Investing a small amount to hit set seemed to be worth it. On top of that, I feel I have the ability to get away from hand when I was beaten - as I feel this hand proves - I was betting when ahead and I folded when beat.

I agree that this should be a preflop fold. Queens full is still going to be very rare, and you have to pull off queens full with no qualifying low to get a decent win. And because of your position, you could get raised off the hand for a total waste (I do hope you weren't intending to call a substantial preflop raise).

I would have folded to a raise of almost any kind. However, people were not raising very often.

U are all saying fold preflop. I`m not saying this specific hand I would always see a flop with and the reason for the post was to discuss the post flop play and ultimate fold - I would not have posted this if the guy who won the hi pot had turned a flush.

The reason for the call was down to my read on my opponents.

1. Lots of callers
2. Few raises.
3. Everyone joining most pots
4. Everyone chasing lo end = I do hit my FH/ quads/ set, etc all the lo end chasers would have paid me off.

quick question, would you guys limp or fold with op's hand in omaha hi?

It seems in this position it is being recomended 3+ wheel cards as a minimum?

If a pro had played the way I did the would have been looked at as a God U could imagine the commentry if I`d been Hansen

"Hansen likes to mix up his game, that why he is such a difficult player to read"

"Hansen hits his trips!!! I like that bet, keeps all of the people playing for lo in pot, but knows a set of aces will reraise - brilliant"

"That 10 will slow Gus up now. He might want to put in a feeler bet to see where he`s at. I like that. Also, we now have 2 potential flush draws out there."

"Diamond on the river. He will do well to get away from this now. He has so much commited to the pot. Great fold Gus, great fold"

 

[robwhufc]

Seriously Ron, you are making the game so much harder than you need to. You don't need to be fancy, you dont need to read opponents, you don't need to put them on hands. Just play good starting hands, and play fast post flop if you've got a good hand / draw, and bail if you've got a bad hand, or a good hand that is vulnerable and unlikely to improve.

You don't need to win lots of little pots, you need to win a few big ones. I honestly think you would see better results if you played it much simpler - just look at how your 2 opponent's played in this hand!

 

[dj11]

The most important info provided in OP (IMO) is that it was early in this tourney. Level 1, cheap to peek.

A trick with O8 is that there will always be a high hand, but not always a low hand, so a cheap peek with QQ can not be considered a fold situation.

He hits his flop!

I would have potted it from that point on. Yes, Omaha is a drawing game, and to get to any low hand villains HAVE TO DRAW ALSO! Your task, should you chose to accept it is to drive them out of this hand !!

The naysayers here are saying to fold this because others are drawing to something or other, while Ron has the at least the 2nd nuts on the flop.

I favor c9's answers .....

This message will self destruct before your very eyes!

 

[robwhufc]

He hits his flop!

You are absolutely right. He hits his flop. He has his set, and is only behind AA.

So what is a bad card for him to see now?

Well he doesn't want a 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 or an 8. That would put a low on board, and it is stretching it to think that 6 8 is going to win the low. 3,4 or 5 is especially bad as that makes straight possible which puts us behind both hi and low.

A King, Jack or Ten is no good either, as that puts a high straight on board.

We don't want a diamond, as that will make a flush.

So we are really looking for the last Queen, the 3 non diamond 9's, 2's and Aces (though the ace could easily give someone a better FH).

So we've hit, and basically we're in the shit. Because we've played a ridiculously substandard O/8 hand.

 

[Ronaldadio]

Seriously Ron, you are making the game so much harder than you need to. You don't need to be fancy, you dont need to read opponents, you don't need to put them on hands. Just play good starting hands, and play fast post flop if you've got a good hand / draw, and bail if you've got a bad hand, or a good hand that is vulnerable and unlikely to improve.

You don't need to win lots of little pots, you need to win a few big ones. I honestly think you would see better results if you played it much simpler - just look at how your 2 opponent's played in this hand!

If you do play simple and post a hand history here u are told u played it too tight, should not have raised, should have slow played, etc - very much a question of u r damned if u do and your damned if u don`t

What I got was what I wanted i.e. I folded the river. This again would have been wrong according to some others. If I had won this pot but just called I would have been told I should have put in a value bet, as one of the guys have mentioned.

I`m sure I can improve in lots of ways, however I keep good stats and I`m a winning ring game player, MTT player and the only thorne in my side is I`m trying to fight back in SNG`s.

I think I`ve only played in about 15 MTT organized on this site and I`ve won 3 and placed a few - so I can`t be that bad

GL

 

[dj11]

My post was meant to say that aggression will be the proper play from the moment he hits his flop. 5 people saw the river!

5 people should never have been given the chance to see the river!

Let me add that this is a conditional situation, and had Ron been any of the other players it might have (?) made sense to limp along, or play pot odds here.

Keep in mind that on the flop the odds of anyone filling either a straight , flush or the board pairing (making Rons boat) are very similar.