QJ in Pokerstars $1 sng early game, J on flop

S

Silkroad

Rising Star
Bronze Level
Joined
Jan 29, 2008
Total posts
14
Chips
0
pokerstars (Tournament): $1 + $0.20, 7 players

BB ($2,480)
Hero ($1,020)
B3 ($1,515)
B2 ($1,805)
B1 ($1,585)
BN ($3,710)
SB ($1,385)

BN is the button.

Precards:
SB posts the small blind $15, BB posts the big blind $30.

Preflop: Hero is dealt Q♦ J♠ (7 active)
Hero calls $30, B3 folds, B2 calls $30, B1 folds, BN calls $30, SB calls $15, BB checks.

Flop: J♦ 5♣ 9♣ ($150, 5 active)
SB checks, BB checks, Hero bets $100, B2 calls $100, 2 folds, BB calls $100.

Turn: J♦ 5♣ 9♣ 6♦ ($450, 3 active)
BB checks, Hero bets $150, B2 folds, BB raises to $900

2 questions:
1. What should Hero do?
2. Did BB make the right play by raising that big?

Game is early so it's not yet clear if BB is loose or tight. Thanks a lot for your advice!
 
P

ph_il

...
Silver Level
Joined
Feb 5, 2005
Total posts
10,128
Awards
1
Chips
25
Easy fold. BB could easily have J + 2 clubs, 2 pair, 78 for straight. Also, its still early and blinds are low, so you'll have nothing to worry about even if you're short stack. My advice is fold QJo hands PF, especially UTG.
 
widowmaker89

widowmaker89

Visionary
Silver Level
Joined
Mar 31, 2008
Total posts
514
Chips
0
fold preflop, QJ UTG should not be played.

The size of his raise is just to put you all in here, I think you shold fold, what hands are you beating?
 
Jillychemung

Jillychemung

Stacks & Stacks
Loyaler
Joined
Feb 7, 2008
Total posts
8,250
Awards
1
Chips
124
Problem here is that BB could have ATC. The overbet feels like 2P or ST8 and trying to chase away FD. Seeing as how you've committed 1/4 of your stack I'd shove as the BB will have to call you. You have maybe 14 outs and if you lose there is always another SNG starting soon. But then again I may play this type of set-up overly aggressive. QJs UTG is an iffy starting hand as this flop shows. If I was in aggressive mode I would have raised it preflop or if I was being nitty I would have folded it preflop. How did you lose the $480 to get down to $1020?
 
Dwilius

Dwilius

CardsChat Regular
Silver Level
Joined
May 5, 2008
Total posts
7,584
Awards
34
Chips
0
easy fold you're playing a 5 way limp flop you're better off on a nut draw which is what I'd guess he hit and is getting rid of flush cards
 
NineLions

NineLions

Advanced beginner
Silver Level
Joined
Sep 20, 2006
Total posts
4,979
Chips
0
Well, probably fold, though your turn bet size might be leading him to think that you don't have much so he's trying to take it away. Not an uncommon play at this level. Mind you, even if you bet 2/3 pot some would still try to take it away with a club flush draw at this level too.

Best advice; fold preflop as others have said.
 
Dwilius

Dwilius

CardsChat Regular
Silver Level
Joined
May 5, 2008
Total posts
7,584
Awards
34
Chips
0
14 outs? I don't know which those are heros either drawing dead or has only a few
 
Jillychemung

Jillychemung

Stacks & Stacks
Loyaler
Joined
Feb 7, 2008
Total posts
8,250
Awards
1
Chips
124
Dang sorry on the 14 outs. Misread the graphics and though hero had QdJd to start and that obv isn't right. I'll edit my previous entry to toss it all out. This is a clear fold for me now.
 
Rounder_D

Rounder_D

Enthusiast
Silver Level
Joined
Apr 1, 2008
Total posts
95
Chips
0
Agree never should have been in the hand with QJ especially as the short stack.
 
c9h13no3

c9h13no3

Is drawing with AK
Silver Level
Joined
Jan 2, 2007
Total posts
8,819
Chips
0
Just re-iterating what others have said:

You have a junk hand in an even more junky position. WTF are you calling preflop for?
 
S

Silkroad

Rising Star
Bronze Level
Joined
Jan 29, 2008
Total posts
14
Chips
0
Folded

Problem here is that BB could have ATC. The overbet feels like 2P or ST8 and trying to chase away FD. Seeing as how you've committed 1/4 of your stack I'd shove as the BB will have to call you. You have maybe 14 outs and if you lose there is always another SNG starting soon. But then again I may play this type of set-up overly aggressive. QJs UTG is an iffy starting hand as this flop shows. If I was in aggressive mode I would have raised it preflop or if I was being nitty I would have folded it preflop. How did you lose the $480 to get down to $1020?

Thanks for your advice. I folded that hand to save for another day of fighting. Agreed should have folded pre-flop

To asnwer your question how I got down to $1,020. It was because of these two hands

Any advice on how I should play them differently?

Hand #1
PokerStars (Tournament): $1 + $0.20, 8 players

B2 ($1,450)
B1 ($1,460)
Hero ($1,470)
SB ($1,480)
BB ($1,460)
B5 ($1,380)
B4 ($3,300)
B3 ($1,500)

Hero is the button.

Precards:
SB posts the small blind $10, BB posts the big blind $20.

Preflop: Hero is dealt T♥ K♠ (8 active)
B5 folds, B4 calls $20, 3 folds, Hero calls $20, SB folds, BB checks.

Flop: 9♣ 2♠ K♥ ($70, 3 active)
BB checks, B4 checks, Hero bets $40, BB calls $40, B4 folds.

Turn: 9♣ 2♠ K♥ 3♦ ($150, 2 active)
BB checks, Hero bets $70, BB calls $70.

River: 9♣ 2♠ K♥ 3♦ Q♠ ($290, 2 active)
BB bets $80, Hero calls $80.

Final Pot: $450
Hero, net: -$210, Lost at showdown, has T♥ K♠ (a Pair of Kings)
BB, net: $240, Won at showdown, has T♠ J♠ (a King High Straight)
B4, net: -$20, Folded Flop
SB, net: -$10, Folded Preflop

Hand #2
PokerStars (Tournament): $1 + $0.20, 8 players

B5 ($1,560)
B4 ($1,460)
Hero ($1,260)
B2 ($1,470)
B1 ($1,690)
BN ($1,350)
SB ($3,180)
BB ($1,530)

BN is the button.

Precards:
SB posts the small blind $10, BB posts the big blind $20.

Preflop: Hero is dealt T♠ T♣ (8 active)
2 folds, Hero raises to $60, B2 calls $60, 4 folds.

Flop: Q♥ T♥ 7♥ ($150, 2 active)
Hero bets $150, B2 calls $150.

Turn: Q♥ T♥ 7♥ 9♥ ($450, 2 active)
Hero checks, B2 bets $180, Hero folds.

Final Pot: $450
Hero, net: -$210, Folded Turn, has T♠ T♣ (Three of a Kind, Tens)
B2, net: $240, Won uncontested Turn
BB, net: -$20, Folded Preflop
SB, net: -$10, Folded Preflop
 
c9h13no3

c9h13no3

Is drawing with AK
Silver Level
Joined
Jan 2, 2007
Total posts
8,819
Chips
0
Both hands were played poorly.

1st Hand:
Fold preflop. Your hand is bad, and its early. No reason to mix it up and play bad cards when the blinds are so small. And if you insist on playing this hand, use it to steal the blinds. Raise it up! Its also a lot easier to push your opponent off of a gutshot draw when the pot is larger & villain is investing a larger % of their stack.

2nd Hand:
On the turn you have a 3.3:1 draw to a boat, and he's offering you 3.5:1 on your call. Make the call. Only if he has Jh8h or 6h8h do you fold.

Other than the fold on the turn, this hand wasn't played all that badly.
 
Dwilius

Dwilius

CardsChat Regular
Silver Level
Joined
May 5, 2008
Total posts
7,584
Awards
34
Chips
0
I don't see a problem playing a small pot 3way in position early. what's funny to me is the villain betting into you to make sure he gets paid 80 with the nuts. his 10 to 1 on the turn pays off 4 to1. doesn't even check/raise an amount K has to call. Maybe because you were betting so little didn't even think you had a king and a T or J might win.
 
Dwilius

Dwilius

CardsChat Regular
Silver Level
Joined
May 5, 2008
Total posts
7,584
Awards
34
Chips
0
and don't fold the set, like last poster said you're getting odds to call without any river action. If I hit a fullhouse my odds have already paid off and I would bet into him like a defensive play to see if my hand is good in case he didn't want to bet middle heart after you called turn. If he raises the Ah on river (this is $1 stakes) you double up if he has a straight flush tough luck.
 
c9h13no3

c9h13no3

Is drawing with AK
Silver Level
Joined
Jan 2, 2007
Total posts
8,819
Chips
0
I don't see a problem playing a small pot 3way in position early.
Being in position is not a good reason to lose a good portion of your stack with a mediocre hand early in the tournament. At this point, you should be playing premium hands only, throwing in a low pocket pair/suited connector if its cheap enough & the implied odds are there.
 
S

Silkroad

Rising Star
Bronze Level
Joined
Jan 29, 2008
Total posts
14
Chips
0
Thanks guys for all the advice. Agreed that folding the set was bad play, in that
- The guy might bet with a less strong hand
- He might be bluffing
- I have outs to a flush and full-house to win at least a split pot

Correct play was not to check/fold turn, but to bet or call

Is re-raising all-in a good play as well?
 
I

Inscore77

Legend
Silver Level
Joined
Aug 11, 2007
Total posts
3,511
Chips
0
Fold it, he either has 78 for the straight or pocket 6's for the set

Also, dont play QJ UTG in these things, play this hand in a later posistion for more success with it
 
N

nathanthomp

Rising Star
Bronze Level
Joined
Feb 12, 2007
Total posts
16
Chips
0
Hero should fold PF and just shut down unless flopping a monster as played.
 
N

nathanthomp

Rising Star
Bronze Level
Joined
Feb 12, 2007
Total posts
16
Chips
0
Hand 1 either fold or raise that hand.

Hand 2 raise more.
 
PokerStars Guides: Italiano - Dansk - Nederlands - Deutsch - Français - Español - Polski - Norsk - Português - Svenska - PokerStars Mobile - Deutsch Mobile - PS Casino Top 10 Games
Top